5TH week vacation coming back?

I don't know anyone that called the rescuers at the WTC "thugs" and find it offensive if they did.

As to the issue of the personal days, I have to side with Kev that if there aren't clearly defined guidelines as to how they can/cannot be used for anything other than sickness, then they aren't really "personal." The concept of personal paid time is that you can use the days however you wish. DL does offer, IIRC, to allow you to accumulate a certain number of unused days from year to year as well as to be paid for some of them at some point, but I'm not sure of the details of that.

But if there is any limitation as to how they can be used, including getting a note in your file for using them, they aren't really personal.

At the same time, though, I will question how there can be recourse for a union regarding an area that isn't covered by the CBA, which several have shown here may or may not be part of the CBA. Other than say express displeasure that someone is being picked on, what can a union really do?
 
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it is possible i missed something here, but the use of PPT can indeed be used for anything you want. one could go to disneyland using PPT everyday till they run out of PPT days and not get in trouble for it. it is what they are for. using PPT as a sick day called it right before your shift is also allowed but if abused probably gets one on some sort of abusing sick day list.
 
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thank you for that information... that wasn't the idea that has been conveyed.

In essence, PPT days do become extra time off for someone who doesn't get sick and uses them close to the end of the year.

And you can still roll those days over (or at least some of them) or be paid for them, right?
 
when delta took sick days away from us, i had like 8 or 10 weeks of sick time built up, they gave us 5 days i think it was of PPT. it could have been 10 days PPT from the get go but i don't remember it that way. those five days are for calling in sick or going to a picnic in the park or to be rolled over at the PPT year end. today one can have about three weeks of PPT saved up by rolling it over. any days over the allowed amount will be paid out (a week of PPT is equal to a week of pay) to the employee if he choses or can have it rolled into the certified time off bucket as it is or used to be called.
 
I had over 1000 hours built up...

Now, it is almost impossible to access that benefit- even with the proposed changes they just announced- and even then, they still f**k it up and pay you 7 days/week, because no one can grasp that we are all paid bi-weekly, and not bi monthly.

As for PPT itself: Accrual is based on hours worked. A benefitted FT employee gets 56hrs./year

You can "bank" up to 3 years worth before either rolling it into your Certified Time, or cashing it out.

Yes, in THEORY, you can use it for whatever you'd like; in fact, that was a point very much emphasized in the literature we all received at the time of the merger. ACTUALLY being able to use it (besides as de facto sick time) is a different story all together.

So much for "honoring your commitments."
 
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From what people are saying here if your local mgmt. is telling you that you cannot ever use that PPT benefit as you wish, then you should be making some phone calls because that isn't apparently how it works elsewhere.

There clearly is a separate issue with the fact that DL did not accept the full banked amount of sick time from NW... I don't know all of the reasons behind that but it is a different issue than the current PPT program.

Up to 7 extra days of vacation or 7 extra days of pay is nothing to sneeze at....
 
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From what people are saying here if your local mgmt. is telling you that you cannot ever use that PPT benefit as you wish, then you should be making some phone calls...
Just who would that phone call go to? How would that be received if it went to your boss' boss?
Up to 7 extra days of vacation or 7 extra days of pay is nothing to sneeze at..
Yep. Like a sniffle compared to losing 1000 hours. But hey, at least he has a job. (I couldn't resist Kev)
 
There clearly is a separate issue with the fact that DL did not accept the full banked amount of sick time from NW... I don't know all of the reasons behind that but it is a different issue than the current PPT program.

No, it's not separate; it's what DL directly replaced our sick time accrual/accessibility with.


Just who would that phone call go to? How would that be received if it went to your boss' boss?

Exactly.

And really; why should someone "have to make some calls," anyway?

Yep. Like a sniffle compared to losing 1000 hours. But hey, at least he has a job. (I couldn't resist Kev)

Well played sir...
 
NW's sick time wasn't for personal use - it was for sick time. We have been through it before but DL's disability coverage is different than what other carriers provided, including NW.

I'm not saying that losing 1000 hours is nothing but DL's written policies do reflect that personal paid time can be requested and used like extra vacation time. That has been validated in the course of this thread.

The abuse that was mentioned comes from people using UNSCHEDULED PPT at the last minute on repetitive basis.

Thus, the characterizations about DL's vacation policies as being substandard are completely inaccurate, esp. because the majority of DL employees in fact actually enjoy MORE vacation than their peers - if they also manage to stay relatively healthy. Seven lost days per year for non-vocational illness seems to me to be above average. But then I used precisely 4 days of sick time in 22 years with one particular company... probably well below average.

Given that DL's PPT policy is in writing, then the call could be made to any member of mgmt. the call wants to address it to.

Local mgmt. should be on the hot seat if they aren't providing a company benefit which is in fact in writing and which multiple people have said is in fact available.

I'll pay for the phone call and the lawyer bill after that if there is real evidence that local mgmt. is consistently denying the use of SCHEDULED PPT according to DL's policies.
 
I'm not saying that losing 1000 hours is nothing but DL's written policies do reflect that personal paid time can be requested and used like extra vacation time. That has been validated in the course of this thread.

Nobody has denied what the policy reflects. The difference is in what/when/how it can be used, and the subjective criteria used in various locations to determine abuse.

Oh, and yes, people are being denied PPT requests for "R & R" (to quote the brochure we all received)...

Thus, the characterizations about DL's vacation policies as being substandard are completely inaccurate...

Again, no one said the policies as written, and as "sold" to the PMNW group are "substandard." The implementation & consistency, however, are....

The abuse that was mentioned comes from people using UNSCHEDULED PPT at the last minute on repetitive basis.

...And the words used to describe the response included such definitives as "kind of depends," and how ones manager "feels."

Application of policy wildly differs from station to station, and even shop to shop. In his quest to be witty, Southwind actually got something right for once...

Given that DL's PPT policy is in writing, then the call could be made to any member of mgmt. the call wants to address it to.

Local mgmt. should be on the hot seat if they aren't providing a company benefit which is in fact in writing and which multiple people have said is in fact available.

You truly have been gone awhile... or haven't called HR lately...
 
As with any time off, it is not guaranteed that you can get it every time you want but if scheduled PPT requests are being CONSISTENLY denied or if PPT usage is being documented as an abuse other than the types of consistent, unscheduled usage that were noted above, then there is a problem and it should be addressed and I'll lead the charge to get it fixed.

I'm still very much connected. I still have their numbers... I hear from one of them every month very faithfully and in the most positive sense.

I do believe the DL board is the most active on here.... and there is relative peace too.

WOW!
 
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This is how I see the use of PPT. You can use it as sick time, call in at the beginning of the shift and say I want to use PPT(sick). This counts against you for review purposes. Or you can use it as personal time. All time off is in a "deal book". Our crew is allowed two off every day, no questions. Want the day off, put it in the empty slot, vac, floating hoilday, ppt. This does not count against you. If the book is full then you need permisson from your manager.
 
Back to my original question; how many employees are actually getting a 5th week of vacation back?

Does anyone actually know if anyone exists that can meet the requirement?
 
This is how I see the use of PPT. You can use it as sick time, call in at the beginning of the shift and say I want to use PPT(sick). This counts against you for review purposes. Or you can use it as personal time. All time off is in a "deal book". Our crew is allowed two off every day, no questions. Want the day off, put it in the empty slot, vac, floating hoilday, ppt. This does not count against you. If the book is full then you need permisson from your manager.

Not a bad idea (assuming your crew isn't 400 people).

But again, that's completely different from how we handle it locally. If I ask 10 friends around the system, I get 10 different answers. Come on here, FB, wherever, and get even more. There's something inherently wrong with that.

Back to my original question; how many employees are actually getting a 5th week of vacation back?

Does anyone actually know if anyone exists that can meet the requirement?

I'm still waiting for a definitive answer on what "continuous service" truly means. The company has said that it is based on your Adjusted Service Date (what you & I knew as our SIV date), but there are also lots of people being told that taking voluntary leaves will count as "bad time" the same way an involuntary furlough or leave would...

Other things that might make the pool really shallow on the PMNW side:

'97 pilots strike

9/11

'05 AMFA strike

Voluntary SLIP leaves
 
Are all of the breaks in service during your NWA career? As a guideline would probably mirror how DL adds up time for seniority for pass travel.Just my experience from my merger.Strikes and global events are not the employees fault but voluntary leave time would surly be deducted.