AA and Labor Negotiations-2020

[swamt]

Who would of thought...

The agreement could also resolve the outstanding issue of whether the unions should pay sanctions to American Airlines Group Inc. (Nasdaq: AAL) for the financial damage their actions caused last summer.

Before the tentative agreement was announced last week, a hearing in a Fort Worth federal court room was scheduled for Feb. 18 to determine whether the unions should be sanctioned for a work slowdown last summer that caused hundreds of flight cancellations and long delays for American.

But after the tentative contract agreement was announced, the hearing was pushed back to May 11. That extra time leaves room for the issue potentially to be resolved, said a labor expert.

https://www.bizjournals.com/dallas/...nes-sanctions-delay.html?ana=yahoo&yptr=yahoo

That sir is total company pressure on the employees to vote yes. In other words, vote it down the suit will move forward, vote it in, and the suit will mysteriously go away, or an agreement will be agreed to by the asso and co. on a certain amount.
Funny how these things turn out, huh?

 

[swamt]

As previously announced, the TWU-IAM Association reached Agreements in Principle (AIP) last week with American Airlines on five new Joint Collective Bargaining Agreements (JCBAs). The five-year accords run through 2025.

This week, Association negotiating committee members met with company representatives in Fort Lauderdale, FL to begin finalizing contract language to bring our Agreements in Principle back to you as complete Tentative Agreements for your consideration. This time-consuming work is necessary for accurate full text documents to be presented to the membership before ratification voting begins. We expect this process to take a few weeks.

The parties this week finalized the proposed base wage scales and associated premiums going forward, and those rates for each group accompanies this update.

We ask for your continued patience as we continue the work to bring you complete details on the premier collective bargaining agreements in the industry.

PDF: TWU-IAM American Airlines Base Wage Rates and Hourly PremiumsDownload

So, is "Premier" and ILC the same thing. I'd also like to ask NYer if the Association secured it's members, either the IAM or TWU an industry leading contract...

Gentlemen, this is NOT ILC.
Yea you all got above us in base pay, but when you add in the rates and premiums, it's not IL as far as pay goes. Just FYI.

 

[Rogallo]

The company and the association and the IAM have had a baseball bat shoved all the way up our TWU a$$e$ for years. Now they propose to pull the bat out about halfway and expect TWU members to be pleased with that.

Frickin hilarious

Pitiful, ain't it.

And even more so will be the members if they don't remove the TWU from representing M&R.

 

[CremaDiLimone]

If the company refuses to offer IAM medical to TWU members, it obviously means that it is very costly and valuable. The company has a number for that value and the association knows it as well but we are kept in the dark by design. I suspect that IAM medical is costly enough that it puts the IAM total compensation at the top of the industry.

the numbers were out, maybe 2 years ago.

i believe it was $14-$15 million per year for lus assoc. members and $24-$25 million per for laa assoc. members.

a total of $39 million per year for all.

since then, lus has more employees and costs go up..so, say conservatively, $16-$18 million per year going forward for lus.

if this passes: lus will walk away with $80-$85 million more over 5 years than laa assoc. members, in medical alone.

NYer wants us to focus on OT language. no more 7 OT holdover.

- the iam union heroes criticizing the twu for 'b' and 'c' scales. current lus will keep their exclusive insurance. new hire lus will not have it.

 

[title 2]

That doesn't even make sense

I would not expect a person like you to understand you have to have the twu tell you how and what to think.

 

[LuvnTheSky]

Oh crap. Just realized I forgot to post our PS with you guys. Sorry bout that.
Yes 1AA, we are getting an average of 6 weeks pay for PS. The breakdown is as follows: 12.2% of yearly will be awarded with 10% going into PS retirement accounts as the employees directed to their choices of investments. 2.2% will be distributed out as cash payments to the employees. So a combination of PS account payments, as well as cash in hand payments, if you will.
Although very happy to get the PS news, it was a bit lower than expected because of the Max groundings and other fiascos from the year 2019. We should have been around 16-18% should everything gone as planned. But, shite happens in life.
Delta the big winner this time around with, I think, 16% plus going to their employees, which should be around 2 months pay once again for them.

They should give you more since there are so few AMT's at your airline. Do the heavy maintenance mechanics in El Salvador that do most of the work on your planes get the PS also?

 

[LuvnTheSky]

Someone care to explain the sunset clause with the IAM medical that will give the company the unilateral right to cancel the remaining plans (some go date of signing no?) Also with every new hire IAM member coming on board forced to the LAA plan, will that not expedite the sunset clause based mainly on how many are left on the plan?

 

[Rogallo]

FYI,

AA currently has 11 acft at SAL. And probably more when this hangar is complete and outsourcing goes from 35% to 50% as proposed in the new "Vote Yes" JCBA. (although it ain't joint)

 

[V.O. Reason]

Gentlemen, this is NOT ILC.
Yea you all got above us in base pay, but when you add in the rates and premiums, it's not IL as far as pay goes. Just FYI.

It’s more than I’ve been making these last 4 years so who the F cares if it’s IL
At least we are getting things we didn’t have so move on

 

[swamt]

They should give you more since there are so few AMT's at your airline. Do the heavy maintenance mechanics in El Salvador that do most of the work on your planes get the PS also?

SWA has always ran lean and mean from day one. Although with the recent IG released reports and the FAA's investigations, pretty sure SWA will be adding headcount to have a better mechanic/aircraft ratio then what they have had in the past. FAA has stated that we are a bit low in that respect and they were concerned about it. PS is paid out to "all" eligible employees that were hired by at least Jan 1 2019 and tallied a minimum 1000 hours on the books. So that PS is spread amongst over 60K employees, not just the mechanics.
No, the mechanics in El Salvador do not get any of SWA PS rewards. You have to be an eligible SWA "employee".
Correction; El Salvador mechanics DO NOT do most of the work on our planes. They are only doing a few lines currently and not allowed any more than the eight lines that were lost to United's low-low bid to underbid SWA's and take over those eight slots in the states. They actually do a very small part. The other 80-90% of maint is done in the United States by FAA certified and licensed mechanics.
Just wanted to clear that misinformation up quickly.
But in reality, yes we did get 6 weeks pay added to our PS accounts. May I ask what yours was???

 

[swamt]

the numbers were out, maybe 2 years ago.

i believe it was $14-$15 million per year for lus assoc. members and $24-$25 million per for laa assoc. members.

a total of $39 million per year for all.

since then, lus has more employees and costs go up..so, say conservatively, $16-$18 million per year going forward for lus.

if this passes: lus will walk away with $80-$85 million more over 5 years than laa assoc. members, in medical alone.

NYer wants us to focus on OT language. no more 7 OT holdover.

- the iam union heroes criticizing the twu for 'b' and 'c' scales. current lus will keep their exclusive insurance. new hire lus will not have it.

Crema, forgive my ignorance, but what is 7 OT holdover? Pls explain.

 

[swamt]

FYI,

AA currently has 11 acft at SAL. And probably more when this hangar is complete and outsourcing goes from 35% to 50% as proposed in the new "Vote Yes" JCBA. (although it ain't joint)

View attachment 15069

That is interesting. 11? Hmmm. And folks were bringing up the limits we have at 8. With only a few currently being done now, not the full 8.

It’s more than I’ve been making these last 4 years so who the F cares if it’s IL
At least we are getting things we didn’t have so move on

No offence VO, but anything would be more than what you guys have been making in the past 30 years. My comment was simply pointing out and reminding everyone that it isn't IL as promised by the TWU/IAM and asso. as well as Parker and the company has promised.
And funny now how easily the members will shrug off the fact that it isn't IL as promised and say, "so who the F cares".

 

[V.O. Reason]

That is interesting. 11? Hmmm. And folks were bringing up the limits we have at 8. With only a few currently being done now, not the full 8.


No offence VO, but anything would be more than what you guys have been making in the past 30 years. My comment was simply pointing out and reminding everyone that it isn't IL as promised by the TWU/IAM and asso. as well as Parker and the company has promised.
And funny now how easily the members will shrug off the fact that it isn't IL as promised and say, "so who the F cares".

Maybe it’s because some of us live in the real world and you can’t always get what you want or promised.
I don’t think anyone is going to be living on the streets with what we will be making.
It’s all about perspective

 

[CremaDiLimone]

Crema, forgive my ignorance, but what is 7 OT holdover? Pls explain.

aa fleet is still under the 2011 BK contract. so, no more double time after 4 hrs. OT. holdover.

the company has took advantage and offers up to 7 hrs. OT holdover to cover holes for 8 hr shifts. anything more than that is considered 'unsafe' - as if they care about our welfare.

when we get a normal contract, all those that loved 7 hrs. holdover OT will get stuck with only 4...because no way the company will pay double time - unless in a severe pinch.

so, to some people that's a concession.

like the CS scammers. they hate VC, they hate more VC weeks because THEY HAVE TO BE OFF. i see guys walking around with their eyes closed, they are so tired.

more VC is a concession to them. they will lose money.

 

[1AA]

Maybe it’s because some of us live in the real world and you can’t always get what you want or promised.
I don’t think anyone is going to be living on the streets with what we will be making.
It’s all about perspective

Yes, the perspective that we were to vote on representation for the union of our choice. Yes, the perspective that the association promised an ILC. Yes, the perspective that we as members pay a fee to be legally represented by the association to look out for our best interest and not the associations interest. When one party be it an individual or group agree to pay a monetary fee for a service to be rendered and that service is not in the best interest of that individual or party then you have a legal avenue to take some kind of legal direction to rectify the issue. Leave, remove them, a lawsuit for misrepresentation or in our case bend over backwards and say just take it.