AA and Labor Negotiations-2020

[chilokie1]

You are not responsible for new hires. You are responsible for YOU and YOUR family.

Look I appreciate your noble outlook and that you want to look out for others but that is not the world we live in today. Today the only question people ask when they look at a UNION is what can it do for ME.

I mean who are you fighting for? A bunch of self important, spoiled millennials. At some point you have to ask yourself if the people you are fighting for are actually worth it. Sometimes people need to fight their own fights so they "get it".

You may see that as selfish and heartless but to that I say you have had people accepting bad contracts for years trying to maintain headcount and everybody lost. If those people were to insist on a lucrative contract instead of trying to save headcount the industry today would be in a lot better position as a whole.

You are a good, moral person and unfortunately that is what makes you absolutely wrong. This is business, treat it as such.

It is more than being a nice guy, I hate that the TWU members have been screwed over by our own Union by cowering to Trumpca. I'm sure the IAMPF is the main reason, they stated it in the initial letter to both memberships that moving the TWU members over to the IAMPF was part of the plan. I refuse to just sit back and let these gumba's have any say in how TWU members retirements are funded. You know they have no intention of stopping at new hires, once they get their foot in the door they will always want more. That is another reason I want to get AMFA in before a TA, we need to rid ourselves of the TWU, AFL-CIO , IAM & their pyramid scheme before the ASS screws it up even worse. So yes I'm also thinking of myself & I hate being used so I also have a serious case of the red ass towards the ASS. Weaasles once told me that "you know that the company reads this forum" when I was ranting about the ASS, I told him "I hope so! I want them to know how pissed I'am
being sheep-hearded into the ASS"

 

[La Li Lu Le Lo]

La Li Lu Le Lo; I agree with Chilokie1, as a Union member we are all responsible for one another, it's NOT just the union officers job to look out for the members each of us plays a part in that.

It is more than being a nice guy, I hate that the TWU members have been screwed over by our own Union by cowering to Trumpca. I'm sure the IAMPF is the main reason, they stated it in the initial letter to both memberships that moving the TWU members over to the IAMPF was part of the plan. I refuse to just sit back and let these gumba's have any say in how TWU members retirements are funded. You know they have no intention of stopping at new hires, once they get their foot in the door they will always want more. That is another reason I want to get AMFA in before a TA, we need to rid ourselves of the TWU, AFL-CIO , IAM & their pyramid scheme before the ASS screws it up even worse. So yes I'm also thinking of myself & I hate being used so I also have a serious case of the red ass towards the ASS. Weaasles once told me that "you know that the company reads this forum" when I was ranting about the ASS, I told him "I hope so! I want them to know how pissed I'am
being sheep-hearded into the ASS"

Well maybe with guys like you the UNION will turn around and actually be a UNION again. I hope so.

You should realize you are in the minority though against the overwhelming odds of the IGM crowd.

I wish you luck.

 

[La Li Lu Le Lo]

I Weaasles once told me that "you know that the company reads this forum" when I was ranting about the ASS, I told him "I hope so! I want them to know how pissed I'am being sheep-hearded into the ASS"

In this case he gave you good advice. I know that for a fact due to personal experience. That being said I would forget about 99 percent of what that manipulative douche told you.

 

[dfw gen]

DFW Gen

There are current members of the TWU who have been told they are going to part of the IAM, (our training Dept. Maintenance planners,and others) which are part of our class and craft. Planners who at this point are not even unionized and some members of mgmt who will become IAM members when we get a JCBA. Do you think they will be part of the IAM and NOT be forced into the IAMPF? Going by the proposal the company put out 5.5% 401k Match with an extra 4% for a total of 9%. So you have to figure they will get 5% put into the IAMPF and 4% into the 401k, that helps the Multi-company IAMPF stay a float. OUR current TWU members lose. To Keep this from Happening every one needs to get some one sign an AMFA Card. Get rid of this Association,

i stand corrected.

 

[Kev3188]

In this case he gave you good advice. I know that for a fact due to personal experience. That being said I would forget about 99 percent of what that manipulative douche told you.

Can confirm. I took the same ride LaLi did...

 

[swamt]

Stop do you really think they are going to force current TWU members into the IAMPF ?I thought we already crossed that bridge with a not happening

I do know that the pension was one of the "5 biggies" left to get AIP. Is it still to this day? Have no clue as we all have no clue, because they continue to leave the membership clueless. Never say never with this asso., and I can assure you as it has happened a many times in our nego's, until an AIP and T/A is out all articles are still able to be reopened, and that is fact. I still say they are dealing with all 5 articles that have to do with $$$, pension being one of them. It's not just down to %.

If a few more stepped up where and when needed this would be done by june

Oh my, I was really hoping for 1Q, as long as it's in 2020, the sooner the better.

 

[anotherdelay]

go to trumka, wiki page, he's a pension guy. look I believe the pension is one big slush fund for their own power, and can also give a false sense of security for members expecting what they say its going to pay out. second part of my mind also says pensions are wonderful when interest rates can cover the vig, and depending on the timing of the ponzi scheme. That said, the majority are better off, learning with the guidance of professionals such as fido, and learning/saving/owning it themselves. Nothing more revolting than Prez on here one bemoaning wall street, biggest wtf is he talking about at all, better to have afl cio/iam run and own it, inherit. also he went on paraphrasing, hey a lot of guys won't collect on it actuarial, so don't worry about it not being fully funded.

Trumka is an authoritarian who loses argument after and then resorts to ad hominen attacks, basically a blowhard, how he became in charge after being part of the structure that outsourced this country and watched the middle class be devastated, by the pension crisis and ninja loans. The guy's a phony.

Due Diligence. they cannot legally put anyone in that fund without declaring its problems. Where the hell is the TWU protecting not only its members, but also future iam members. Trumka must go.

Does anyone look out for the workers anymore?

 

[swamt]

Although a good amount of folks on here are MTR but I as a Fleet Service have been telling our new hires to set up a 401K as it wld benefit them more when their time comes. Hopefully theyll heed my advice

Good advice robbed, and doesn't matter what group anyone is a part of.

Is it fair to say that this forum is "dead" as far as making predictions for a TA? Obviously there's more work to be done and Tim's timeline fell flat.

Well, when you have someone stating 4 times thus far that there is a T/A coming out, and nothing has come to fruition, yes we can all say the T/A idea is dead. Notice the individual is no longer here. He got his pee-pee spanked by the upper minions of this asso., more than likely threatened with legal action from the asso. or Exec Cmte..

 

[anotherdelay]

i know afl cio is purportedly not involved in the negoiations, but the afl cio is the is the reason the association came into being.

 

[swamt]

I have been railing against that for years. What is the point of having top out take 25 percent of your career (if you start young and put in 40 years) to reach?

You are not responsible for new hires. You are responsible for YOU and YOUR family.

Look I appreciate your noble outlook and that you want to look out for others but that is not the world we live in today. Today the only question people ask when they look at a UNION is what can it do for ME.

I mean who are you fighting for? A bunch of self important, spoiled millennials. At some point you have to ask yourself if the people you are fighting for are actually worth it. Sometimes people need to fight their own fights so they "get it".

You may see that as selfish and heartless but to that I say you have had people accepting bad contracts for years trying to maintain headcount and everybody lost. If those people were to insist on a lucrative contract instead of trying to save headcount the industry today would be in a lot better position as a whole.

You are a good, moral person and unfortunately that is what makes you absolutely wrong. This is business, treat it as such.

LuLu, C'mon man! Your first post says how much you support getting rid of a 10 year top out in supporting new hires, then you post that everyone should only support what is good for them and only them. I am sick and tired of the IGM'ers and yes that is an IGM'er statement. I also do not support retirees voting yes just to move on. These two examples are exactly what the company wants, division amongst the new hires, soon to retirees, and the middle of the road folks. Think about it. With division within the ranks, and the division between the TWU, IAM as well as between fleet, mechs, gse, fm,pm etc all this division needs to stop! Everyone needs to get on the same page, get unified and stop this IGM mentality.
Remember this LuLu, let say you guys decide to hose the new hires now. Do you really think they will forget? Do you really think it won't affect you?? WRONG--DEAD WRONG! Think about this, new hires come into a complete fiasco of a new contracting just throwing them under the bus, don't think they won't vote for a future contract or buy-out offer that will totally screw the old timers (that's you at a later date) and force them to take in the shorts as you are trying to do to them now. Gee; again let's think about this for a moment, Hmmm, kinda like how the IAM stuck in the shorts of the TWU when the TWU wanted IAM side to support and help them with the info pickets and other means of support. And now IAM is asking for the members to support their issue at hand for keeping what they have in the contract. You really think that will happen??? Hell no. It's the exact same thing. And this division and IGM mentality will eventually DESTROY the membership from within itself by self destruction. I have seen it happen so many times before, and by the time the members really start feeling it, it will be way too late. HENCE why the mechanic and related need to get out of this fiasco and pathetic representational organization called an Employee Asso. and get their very own Class and Craft union. Once they get AMFA in the division amongst the mechs and related will completely halt. As far as you guys that remain in the asso., well, the asso. will keep the division going as long as it benefits them all the way to the bank.
Mechanics and Related, sign them cards and get yourselves out of this IGM mentality asso. Don't wait until it's too late and the self destruction from within takes over...

 

[swamt]

In this case he gave you good advice. I know that for a fact due to personal experience. That being said I would forget about 99 percent of what that manipulative douche told you.

Can confirm. I took the same ride LaLi did...

As we have had these forums and threads brought up in our nego's, they too have come to discussions in your nego's as well as discussions amongst AA legal and upper, upper management at AA. They have a whole department that works 24/7 on social media comments. Most are looking for customer complaints to fix before getting out of hand, but some are also looking for any negative comments upon the co., and yes, as you guessed they also have some searching thru these forums to get feelers and ideas about nego's. Mark my words on this, I have seen it on certain company computers in their offices by co. negotiating cmte members that were at the table. Even two guys, in our case, admitted to using some comments made here, at the table. Not good for professional nego's to do as most comments are opinions and guesses, but anything that might favor their side of an argument they will use. Even as far as pulling individuals into offices for talks and questioning, as has happened at AA. Right fellas???

 

[1AA]

As far as the IAMPF goes?
If you are to be enrolled into the loser pyramid scam pension fund at some point along the line you as the individual that is enrolled into it must sign some kind of legal paperwork allowing the company to deposit funds into it on your behalf. My suggestion is don't sign anything involving the IAMPF contributions. Opt out of it. You may not get the 401k match but why give the IAMPF money you'll never see? It's really not your money until you withdraw from it which you probably won't see anyway so screw them over by not releasing the funds to them. They can force enrollment as your only choice but they can't get the funds until you give the ok to be enrolled.

 

[swamt]

Where or where is little Timmy? Has he been silenced by the asso. leaders?? Are they just tired of him spreading doom and gloom???
If it wasn't for "bad luck" on these T/A guesses there wouldn't be any luck.
Where are you Timmy?:
Click on the "You Were Gone" and the "Gloom Despair and Agony"

You Were Gone - YouTube




1:26NOW PLAYING

WATCH LATER
ADD TO QUEUE
Gloom Despair And Agony On Me (marriage , money)

 

[1AA]

Speaking of doom and gloom here is the next lame reason AA will use against us in negotiations.
Time will tell if it holds true and if it will also affect the negotiations process with the APA.

https://www.fool.com/investing/2020/01/25/the-boeing-737-max-crisis-will-crush-american-airl.aspx

 

[swamt]

Speaking of doom and gloom here is the next lame reason AA will use against us in negotiations.
Time will tell if it holds true and if will also affect the negotiations process with the APA.

https://www.fool.com/investing/2020/01/25/the-boeing-737-max-crisis-will-crush-american-airl.aspx

No doubt they will.
Hate to add to that Gloom, but just caught a blip on the news that they are starting to ban flights already for the Caronna virus issue. Not sure the exact locations as of yet or if they are only discussing it but it did say the bans are coming soon if not already.
They say that's why the market is down 4-500 this morning. Here we go...