AA and Labor Negotiations-2020

[1986Mekanic]

If anyone here has a case of the arse it is you. Every post I have seen from you in the last 2 weeks has been confrontational and hateful. I think you are happy being unhappy. Unfortunately for everyone here misery loves company and you choose to make this forum your company.

By the way learn to spell my name.

Maybe even try to pronounce it to help you spell it. (Laa Lee Lou Lay Low) Hooked on phonics can work for you.

I actually tried to change my name to a more conventional name but the forum admins would not have it. Not my problem if you can't cope because of your lackluster reading and spelling skills MEKANIC.

Not every post lulu, just the ones towards you and and the Nyr guy. There not really hateful, nut, confrontational is a good description. See what I don't get about you is, you don't work here, yea I know, your "wife"does, whatever. Why doesn't she post? I see you have many issues, your gonna keep spouting them until the day you leave this world and go on to he next I fear.

 

[swamt]

Just another example of these industrial unions forcing a contract on their members. I call total BS on this issue. The Buy Laws govern how and what will happen in these cases. Pretty simple, if the membership voted down the contract, then voted NOT to strike, the union should get back to the table, this BS of enacting (forcing) the contract on the members after they voted it down is just dictators at work. Way to go IAM at Spirit! My Lord a 10 year contract? Never heard of one being so long. And they want an extension after 2800 gets or will get laid off. NOT a good mark on the IAM representation...

https://www.yahoo.com/news/m/2919063a-c98a-3425-9869-d89da9edf8ad/machinists-union-sets.html

"That 10-year agreement went into effect in June 2010. While union members at the time voted to reject the deal, it was enacted automatically after a separate measure didn’t garner the number of vote needed to go on strike."

 

[swamt]

Update on the meetings held Jan. 13th and 14th

So still "no details". He did state "items" as in plural items left open. That tells me the 5, or part of, is still remaining but not just down to the % raise as someone falsely reported before. But with "no details" what do ya expect?
I do like his reporting that the union is holding out for "restore and more" as well as the last para stating industry leading in "all" aspects and listed them. So that to me is good news. I know some are wanting this done so bad, but delays due to holding out for ILC and "restore and more" to me is a good thing. But I will add, if they didn't "restore and more" and they didn't get ILC, as promised, they know good and well that the AMFA card drive would just explode into the final numbers and a vote get called. But by all means don't allow an offer, AIP, and or T/A stop the card drive. The time is now for change for the better...

The self-destruction sequence started with the merger and the mismanagement by the AWA leadership 'team' .

Do you not also blame this asso. too?

 

[swamt]

You are talking to a guy that was stabbed in the back by the president of 514 (Sam Cirri a FSC) and the Chairman of Fleet Service (Debbie Tiller also a FSC).

They pushed acceptance of a concessionary contract then the company got rid of Fleet Service. First it was going to be half the shop.... then it was going to be most of the shop with them retaining a few people, then it was all of the shop but a few got local job offers. By the time the dust settled Sam and Debbie were the only 2 people out of over 100 at TUL and TULE that did not have to retire, bump, put in a local transfer and wait, or quit. Debbie was even awarded a job outside of seniority.

After I came on this very forum and outed their little scam my fellow coworkers turned on me like a bunch of jackals. They rather of hung on to their delusions that these 2 clowns were trying to get there jobs back than face the fact they got taken for a ride. There desperation overrode their logic.

Other high ups in the UNION were notified but chose to turn a blind eye.

So after having been stuck in JUNIOR Fleet, betrayed by the president and Fleet Service chairman of local 514, having my fellow workers turn on me, and then having the other high ups in the UNION turn a blind eye to 2 officers cutting an under the table deal..... after all that how would you feel in my place?

In a perfect world sure I would love the UNION to be unified, however I have seen far too much in my career to tell me it is the exact opposite.


What they did to me was attach my post to the news board and let my own coworkers tear me to pieces for a few months.

Every one of those worthless ass hats said the exact same thing in private, that everything I said was the truth but I should not have said it. I mean really...... if it is the truth why should it not have been said. What I did I did out of frustration for B.S. that had been going on for YEARS and was actually getting worse. I mean what a slap in the face..... you were totally right and I agree with you but I am going to treat you like sh*t for 2 months because you should not have said it.

Let me tell you guys.... having those things happen changes your perspective. These days I don't have "friends" at work. I only have coworkers. I learned the hard way that work people are not your friends and they will turn on you at the drop of a hat if it is fashionable.

So while I agree with your ideals my personal history tells me you better try to look out for your best interest and worry less about "saving the world". I tried to "save the world" and all I got for it was a slap in the face...... twice.

That gentlemen is why I have the attitude I do.

I make no apologies, not anymore.

I understand your frustrations. I really do. If you remember I to was condemning of the Sam and Debbie fiasco back then. I too said it twas dead wrong. I also suggested that the members do something about it. NOT through the union (TWU) as they were ramrodding the protections for those two. I suggested that the members go out on their own and file a class action lawsuit against the union(TWU) as well as Sam and Debbie to be included. Not one person would head the advice. It may not have been stopped, but It could have it reversed and turned over and applied by the proper buy-laws, rules and regs for what should have taken place.
I am not here to change your mind or your ideas, but in your case as well as several, several others, is an exact example of how this union (TWU) and now as the (TWU/IAM asso. merged) is just self destructing from within only to save their own asses. THIS will never stop unless the members can finally make the move to rid themselves of this total dysfunctional and scam of an asso.
I'm sorry for what you were put through and now understand why. All others should take the time and look back at "ALL" scams this union has pulled in the past and what they have really done in the past to members, to this day i still cannot fathom why in the world these two industrial unions are still on the property representing the mechanics and related, it is just beyond me how long they allow this to continue to go on.

 

[swamt]

https://seekingalpha.com/article/43...is-in-perpetual-state-of-uncontrolled-descent



this guy hits the nail on the head.

I agree. Even better than the article I posted in a new thread about Parker. Hope ya don't mind but I am going to copy and paste your article to add it to that thread as it is ties directly to the topic.

 

[swamt]

Update on the meetings held Jan. 13th and 14th

Thanks to the Pres Andre Sutton for taking the time to address the members. Just still pathetic it takes a Pres of a local and not a single nego, or exec cmte member.
So nice to have someone take the time to write something out and sign it by name. Only wish he was able to give more detailed information, but understand his hands are tied by the International that called for the gag order (not the co. and not the NMB).

 

[NYer]

Thanks to the Pres Andre Sutton for taking the time to address the members. Just still pathetic it takes a Pres of a local and not a single nego, or exec cmte member.
So nice to have someone take the time to write something out and sign it by name. Only wish he was able to give more detailed information, but understand his hands are tied by the International that called for the gag order (not the co. and not the NMB).

Um. He's a TWU International VP and is frequently in the room. He's not like the other Local Presidents who are out of the loop.

 

[Duke787]

Watched the 4q state of airlines. Watch the video for negotiations. Why can’t we have Dale in charge of the union rather then Samuelson. He is impressive

 

[2ndGENAMT]

Update on the meetings held Jan. 13th and 14th

Actually IMO this is informative, it tells me what is going on and has been going on for some time. The Association passes a proposal across, the company then passes a cost out across and the counter proposal will specify where else in the agreement it will be paid for. The monetary amount is on the table and not negotiable and the problem is the Association can’t figure out how to carve it up!

 

[La Li Lu Le Lo]

Not every post lulu, just the ones towards you and and the Nyr guy. There not really hateful, nut, confrontational is a good description. See what I don't get about you is, you don't work here, yea I know, your "wife"does, whatever. Why doesn't she post? I see you have many issues, your gonna keep spouting them until the day you leave this world and go on to he next I fear.

How is me spouting issues any different than every other swinging dick in this forum?

I don't really know what you have against me. Truthfully I did not even take note of you until about 2 weeks ago. We have no bad history as far as I know. Like what I say or not at least I say what I believe, even if it is not popular.

She does not post because she does not care for politics or activism, she lives in the moment. I am more of the type that I prepare and plan.

 

[Rogallo]

Watched the 4q state of airlines. Watch the video for negotiations. Why can’t we have Dale in charge of the union rather then Samuelson. He is impressive

"You're Out Of Order, Brother"

 

[La Li Lu Le Lo]

Just another example of these industrial unions forcing a contract on their members. I call total BS on this issue. The Buy Laws govern how and what will happen in these cases. Pretty simple, if the membership voted down the contract, then voted NOT to strike, the union should get back to the table, this BS of enacting (forcing) the contract on the members after they voted it down is just dictators at work. Way to go IAM at Spirit! My Lord a 10 year contract? Never heard of one being so long. And they want an extension after 2800 gets or will get laid off. NOT a good mark on the IAM representation...

https://www.yahoo.com/news/m/2919063a-c98a-3425-9869-d89da9edf8ad/machinists-union-sets.html

"That 10-year agreement went into effect in June 2010. While union members at the time voted to reject the deal, it was enacted automatically after a separate measure didn’t garner the number of vote needed to go on strike."

The membership IS the UNION.... or at least that is the lie we are told.

In fact the international IS the UNION because they OWN the contract.

You are subject to a contract you have no control over. Let that sink in.

I mean sure you can vote in the dog and pony show but it really doesn't matter because the international can accept it "in your best interest".

I mean you have to laugh at the absurdity of it.

You show me any other instance of someone being at the mercy of a contract they have NO control over.

It is to laugh.

XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX

I had to edit this. That was supposed to say

You show me any other instance of someone being at the mercy of a contract they have NO control over.

 

[Shafted]

Watched the 4q state of airlines. Watch the video for negotiations. Why can’t we have Dale in charge of the union rather then Samuelson. He is impressive

Dale could hardly speak and took forever to get to the point clearly ! I agree with you that Samuelson is not the right guy, but Dale isnt the guy to speak in the public.

 

[NYer]

Actually IMO this is informative, it tells me what is going on and has been going on for some time. The Association passes a proposal across, the company then passes a cost out across and the counter proposal will specify where else in the agreement it will be paid for. The monetary amount is on the table and not negotiable and the problem is the Association can’t figure out how to carve it up!

That's usually the process. When the sides can't get an agreement and the union expects a certain return the airline usually gives a number and suggests several ways it could be carved up.

 

[icebloodhockey]

https://viewfromthewing.com/american-airlines-has-terrible-employee-morale-its-ceo-is-clueless-why/