American Airlines and Labor Negotiations

[Vortilon]

i just listened to the M&R panel on the new video put out by the association. while dry it does explain a few things, and helps to clarify positions. what would have been nice if these videos were put out thru out the negotiation process not just when the association is threatened or pressured to supply information. we as a membership still deserve a score card of the comparisons between the two positions detailing what the differences are and what are the ramifications of each position.
there are a few things that do stand out:
in the beginning of the video its explained that they will take the position that the articles that have been T.A;'d are the ones actually agreed too. what have we been doing since the company published this? should we not have sub committees that are familiar with each article to proofread on a timely basis? after 4 years i would think there would be some type of familiarity.
for those in the conspiracy mode at the 27:27 mark of the M&R panel review the iam reps explains that there is an understanding on the amt position that any additional percent raises would be applied to all groups for fairness. and now that the company came out with the "southwest" proposal into the mix that has changed....

I noticed that as well. The redistribution begins....

 

[dfw gen]

i did forget to mention that it did get cutout but the same iam rep said "and vacations will be the same for all groups" not sure of the context of that remark. im sure someone will come on here and claim this is an "elitist" remark or an example of an "i got mine" attitude. but its just a simple example of furthering all work groups using one work groups "value" as leverage for another. another reason why we should separate the association represents to many varieties and types of jobs and classifications to reasonably and capably represent all the groups. that does not say we should not support each other as organizations its simply a fact there are too many voices at the table trying to be heard of each other. trying to merge two contracts for so many groups is not a task that can be easily accomplished with a cookie cutter type of strategy.

 

[B737 driver]

Wow you are SO smart. Whats your point

The only thing this Pod cast was good for. Is it shows you the Azz Clowns that we have at the Neg table.
What is the Education Level of any of them. Why is there not any Lawyers or Accountants at the table for us. Why didn't they just put it in writing for us to read and compare for ourselves. It's time to put something together to remove everyone of them from office. THEY ARE NOT QUALIFIED. This is why the Company laughs at us.

I know in AMFA negotiations with SWA our ALRs were there representing all 4 locals as well as our economist Peter, and our attorney, when we were meeting with the mediator. But it still took forever until the company finally got serious last year, and then in March of this year. But at least the guys who retired or passed away that were on property from Aug 2012 to March 31st 2019 will get part of this 160 million when it ratifies.

 

[skinvalve]

AA and the Association have put out a lot of info. What would be your guess as to when we will see an agreement? I am betting the day after never.

 

[WeAAsles]

i did forget to mention that it did get cutout but the same iam rep said "and vacations will be the same for all groups" not sure of the context of that remark. im sure someone will come on here and claim this is an "elitist" remark or an example of an "i got mine" attitude. but its just a simple example of furthering all work groups using one work groups "value" as leverage for another. another reason why we should separate the association represents to many varieties and types of jobs and classifications to reasonably and capably represent all the groups. that does not say we should not support each other as organizations its simply a fact there are too many voices at the table trying to be heard of each other. trying to merge two contracts for so many groups is not a task that can be easily accomplished with a cookie cutter type of strategy.

At one point as I’m sure you recall we all had 7 weeks of vacation. Early on it was actually Harry Lombardo who said that certain things should be uniform to all groups.

If Fleet Service gets full pay for its first sick call then so should you.

Besides the only “value” the Company claims you have is 6 weeks vacation. Same value they currently subscribe to Fleet too.

 

[conehead777]

i did forget to mention that it did get cutout but the same iam rep said "and vacations will be the same for all groups" not sure of the context of that remark. im sure someone will come on here and claim this is an "elitist" remark or an example of an "i got mine" attitude. but its just a simple example of furthering all work groups using one work groups "value" as leverage for another. another reason why we should separate the association represents to many varieties and types of jobs and classifications to reasonably and capably represent all the groups. that does not say we should not support each other as organizations its simply a fact there are too many voices at the table trying to be heard of each other. trying to merge two contracts for so many groups is not a task that can be easily accomplished with a cookie cutter type of strategy.

If you haven’t signed a amp card this should be the incentive to sign a card

 

[WeAAsles]

If you haven’t signed a amp card this should be the incentive to sign a card

Actually I think dfw gen is much smarter than that.

 

[Vortilon]

At one point as I’m sure you recall we all had 7 weeks of vacation. Early on it was actually Harry Lombardo who said that certain things should be uniform to all groups.

If Fleet Service gets full pay for its first sick call then so should you.

Besides the only “value” the Company claims you have is 6 weeks vacation. Same value they currently subscribe to Fleet too.

You're funny, AMTs have been screwed out of their sick pay since 2003. No other work group took the shaft as bad as AMTs. Not a peep from the union. Stores retains the 6th week of vacation all the way through, and no sick pay penalty either! Not a peep from the union! So much for flow through. Now, word is out that the AMTs had TA'd the 7th week of vacation not that long ago - to match UAL - so guess who started crying about it in negotiations? "If we don't get it. nobody gets it." The other title group negotiators - who had no problem with AMTs getting hosed all these years!

So here we are, the company matches AA AMTs up with SWA AMTs pay, and there is no equivalent for some of the others to match up to, all of a sudden it's not fair? Look for the International's go to move - screw the AMTs, and let the redistribution begin. Funny, how nothing changes.

If any fence sitters were looking for a reason to sign an AMP card, look no further than this sort of BS!

 

[bigjets]

You didn’t even watch or listen to the videos did you?

I know watch the videos, why would the association not give us the all the info they’re completely above board. They have been completely honest with us from day 1.

That’s why we voted for the association, strength in numbers. And it’s clearly better to have several different objectives and of course the cherry on top. Different unions with different work groups all saying no unless they get what they want. And the bonus each union has a different culture.

The pilots and FAs were fools for taking those contract improvements YEARS ago.

Come on guys WATCH THE VIDEOS !!!!!

 

[WeAAsles]

You're funny, AMTs have been screwed out of their sick pay since 2003. No other work group took the shaft as bad as AMTs. Not a peep from the union. Stores retains the 6th week of vacation all the way through, and no sick pay penalty either! Not a peep from the union! So much for flow through. Now, word is out that the AMTs had TA'd the 7th week of vacation not that long ago - to match UAL - so guess who started crying about it in negotiations? "If we don't get it. nobody gets it." The other title group negotiators - who had no problem with AMTs getting hosed all these years!

So here we are, the company matches AA AMTs up with SWA AMTs pay, and there is no equivalent for some of the others to match up to, all of a sudden it's not fair? Look for the International's go to move - screw the AMTs, and let the redistribution begin. Funny, how nothing changes.

If any fence sitters were looking for a reason to sign an AMP card, look no further than this sort of BS!

Oh Brother.

 

[WeAAsles]

I know watch the videos, why would the association not give us the all the info they’re completely above board. They have been completely honest with us from day 1.

That’s why we voted for the association, strength in numbers. And it’s clearly better to have several different objectives and of course the cherry on top. Different unions with different work groups all saying no unless they get what they want. And the bonus each union has a different culture.

The pilots and FAs were fools for taking those contract improvements YEARS ago.

Come on guys WATCH THE VIDEOS !!!!!

Since the Bankruptcy I believe and correct me if I’m wrong you’ve gone up over 40% in wages so far.

Am I wrong or are you still wallowing with what you were making back in 2011?

 

[bigjets]

Since the Bankruptcy I believe and correct me if I’m wrong you’ve gone up over 40% in wages so far.

Am I wrong or are you still wallowing with what you were making back in 2011?

I agree with you, I like the fact that the association gave away all its negotiating power by having the union members satisfied pay wise and allowing for cross utilization.

And two unions negotiating for at least 5 different work groups is by far the best avenue

 

[WeAAsles]

I agree with you, I like the fact that the association gave away all its negotiating power by having the union members satisfied pay wise and allowing for cross utilization.

And two unions negotiating for at least 5 different work groups is by far the best avenue

So you would have preferred they had kept the cross utilization language for one of the two groups and kept your original Bankruptcy wages for perhaps the length of the Agreement September 2018?

 

[dfw gen]

My understanding is that initially the association was going to release the ask the pass backs etc. Then all of a sudden there was a back peddal. Something is going on,

 

[WeAAsles]

My understanding is that initially the association was going to release the ask the pass backs etc. Then all of a sudden there was a back peddal. Something is going on,

Where did you hear what they were going to do and who did you hear it from? Maybe they still are planning to do more than the videos?

Did you notice the amount of paper they had on that table BTW?