American Airlines and Labor Negotiations

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I’ll admit that I only watched the AMT portion once as I do find some of it complicated and haven’t worked to verse myself more because it doesn’t directly affect me. 700UW has tried to educate me more but your Scope involves a lot of mathematics.

Actually the smaller groups were easy to understand and it seems like at least 2 of them are pretty much done. (Not Facilities and Automotive)



Ok but you know the cars drivers are going to be here to blast them when they don’t get everything they’re going for which of course is inevitable. I just hope their agenda doesn’t derail the rationalities of your voting process?

I have to agree with what Tom Regan said that Negotiations shouldn’t be out here on Social Media and in Breakrooms but here it is now.

I don’t like to be a pest actually and have given the guys my opinion privately on the videos. I watched the Fleet and Wage and Benefits section 3 times because I like to immerse myself in what was said so when people ask me questions I can be credible and sure that was said.

I don’t think it’s a secret here on Forums that I already knew what the Associations current positions were.
what i keep trying to drive home is why do you know what the associations current positions are, and why do you have "inside information" everyone need to have access to whats going on not just the special few.
 
im a little confused we have an agreement that we intend on getting everyone into the plan (in writing). but we are not going to honor that now we are not going into the plan? now they are listening to the membership. is it selective hearing or selective adherence to agreements. the membership wants a clear concise plan of whats being asked and what is the differences and ramifications in writing to compare.

Go back and look at exactly how that part was written. It didn’t say anything about intention or that it would be a no go item in talks that we wouldn’t be included. I always understood how that was written but others seem to have read it as an absolute.

The stronger part of the writing is that we would support the IAM in continuing their participation. Obviously the IAM has softened their stance on their LUS guys staying in the fund and are willing to make the exchange to a 401K Contribution.

Perhaps if Little and team had continued on there would have been a stronger motivation to include us in the IAMNPF? But Little and team did not survive the purge.
 
They already pointed the finger at the NMB for a No Representational Vote on the Association. They are 1 for 1. 2 for 2 is going for greatness like the boarding video says.

Hey “Bad Salesman” we’re in the middle of an adult conversation here. If you don’t have the ability or desire to contribute to that, beat it. Scram.
 
see how easy it is to use your words? i didnt even put much thought into the response. if i sat and thought about it for a while i can come up with an even more convincing argument. the point is
WE ARE GETTING OUR ASSES KICKED AND THE RESPONSE FROM THE ASS IS WOEFULLY INADEQUATE.


Looking at all the responses on Jetnet and the overall feel of the Membership by that gauge I can’t honestly see where you’re getting that we’re getting our asses kicked?

The Company has even been sending out Senior Managers now to try to gauge the pulse.

They were shadowed by Union Reps here in MIA and I was told they weren’t exactly well received.

They were asked some very tough questions which they were not precisely able to answer.
 
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what i keep trying to drive home is why do you know what the associations current positions are, and why do you have "inside information" everyone need to have access to whats going on not just the special few.

It’s easy why. I make friends and support these guys. I reached out years ago to the IAM side and was one of the first guys to do so. I read something in their contract that I didn’t understand and wanted some clarity on it. I wound up on the phone with this guy for an hour and it wasn’t Charlie Brown or P. Rez either.

And the information I’m given when it’s given to me the guys know they can trust me to be responsible with it. I don’t have to even be told what could be a little sensitive if it was out there because I don’t betray my own common sense.

And I’m not special. Anyone can have the same benefit I have if they just reach out and be courteous and civil. You reached out to Charlie Brown didn’t you?

You did what most here on Forums never do. Too many here on Forums only seem to want to throw rocks.
 
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im a little confused we have an agreement that we intend on getting everyone into the plan (in writing). but we are not going to honor that now we are not going into the plan? now they are listening to the membership. is it selective hearing or selective adherence to agreements. the membership wants a clear concise plan of whats being asked and what is the differences and ramifications in writing to compare.

Back to this one more time and I’m pretty sure I know why I have to pound this drum. The agenda pushers need something to push as a means to their end (1AA/ “Bad Salesman”)

85B7FC6E-8D6A-4915-BFFC-F74CFCCF4E22.png
 
the iam has put themselves in a corner. when they got their contract as payment for the takeover they had a very secure feeling with the company and having the twu handcuffed and gagged in the association. when the iam leadership decided "it was not the right time" to protest or show any type of solidarity it showed the company where to drive the wedge. when the company came out and wanted out of the iam pension and the iam medical THEN IT BECAME TIME for solidarity. unfortunately after the hosing the twu side has received there would not be much or any support for the association.

so what in it for Sito?
if they can drag this out until a contract is imposed they can point at the nmb and the membership why they lost both.

so whats in it for Sito? hopefully a political excuse/solution to resolve a piss poor performance as a partner in the association. will they learn from this? no. reference the association's response to the companies offer, low quality videos and nonsense when the membership wants a clear explanation and side by side comparison of all the positions

how will it end up? one of two ways

they drag it out the company imposes a contract and the iam ran association points fingers at the nmb and the membership.

a deal is cut sacrificing something to save the iam pension, since they know the medical is done. can you guess who or what will be sacrificed again?


FYI. Sito Pantoja is closing in on 65 years old. He’ll likely be announcing his retirement soon. The IAM has a behind the curtain philosophy that once a rep reaches 65 its time for them to move on and let someone else step up. (Otherwise we get guys like Biden, Bernie and Trump running for POTUS, old dirt)

The 65 caveat was why you saw Rich Delaney just suddenly drift off.

Like I said. When you talk to people you learn things.
 
Thank you, for your promotional information, I wish you guys luck, that IAM pension is a sinking ship, just like the Teamsters , which when we were, tried to get us to join their plan, we said no thanks, and never looked back from our 401ks.

Not my promotional information. Actual information. Again it may not suit the agendas of some of the Airline Forums posters but if anyone is left coming here to read and learn, the facts are going to be posted for them to have it.
 
Not my promotional information. Actual information. Again it may not suit the agendas of some of the Airline Forums posters but if anyone is left coming here to read and learn, the facts are going to be posted for them to have it.
The,fact is Weazz pensions everywhere are underfunded or taken over. People are sold a bill of goods the money will be there, when they retire. Most times you are lucky if you get 40 to 50% of what you were promised. You are better with a 401k, and what you yourself can put in a Roth IRA. Plus your social security, or military retirement.
 
So you would have preferred they had kept the cross utilization language for one of the two groups and kept your original Bankruptcy wages for perhaps the length of the Agreement September 2018?
I would prefer to have no union or one union with AMTs only. I would prefer every mechanic not work OT and not take a break, not open a laptop until a contract is in place. Better for AA and AMTs. To all you guys who say, I’ll take their money and just work slow, you’re not fooling anyone, and that hasn’t worked for 16 years now. ATC controllers decided not to work OT during GOV shutdown. GOV shutdown ended.

The reason we are all lumped together is because when the railroad engineer went on strike the firemen would step in same with the porters, etc that way of thinking carried over to airlines and gov went along with it to weaken trade unions and keep economy flowing.

With airlines, AMTs are too busy to load bags and ramp doesn’t have the required licenses or aircraft schooling to do AMT job. So the way I see it unions keep us lumped together to further dues payments with a bloated work force.
 
The,fact is Weazz pensions everywhere are underfunded or taken over. People are sold a bill of goods the money will be there, when they retire. Most times you are lucky if you get 40 to 50% of what you were promised. You are better with a 401k, and what you yourself can put in a Roth IRA. Plus your social security, or military retirement.

The information I provided has zero to do with the viability of any particular type of retirement investment.

The information is provided for American Airlines Employees because we are actively involved in Contract Negotiations against our employer.

I provide facts regarding those talks for my fellow employees, not promotional material.
 
I would prefer to have no union or one union with AMTs only. I would prefer every mechanic not work OT and not take a break, not open a laptop until a contract is in place. Better for AA and AMTs. To all you guys who say, I’ll take their money and just work slow, you’re not fooling anyone, and that hasn’t worked for 16 years now. ATC controllers decided not to work OT during GOV shutdown. GOV shutdown ended.

The reason we are all lumped together is because when the railroad engineer went on strike the firemen would step in same with the porters, etc that way of thinking carried over to airlines and gov went along with it to weaken trade unions and keep economy flowing.

With airlines, AMTs are too busy to load bags and ramp doesn’t have the required licenses or aircraft schooling to do AMT job. So the way I see it unions keep us lumped together to further dues payments with a bloated work force.

Thank you for your response even if you didn’t actually answer my question.
 
Go back and look at exactly how that part was written. It didn’t say anything about intention or that it would be a no go item in talks that we wouldn’t be included. I always understood how that was written but others seem to have read it as an absolute.

The stronger part of the writing is that we would support the IAM in continuing their participation. Obviously the IAM has softened their stance on their LUS guys staying in the fund and are willing to make the exchange to a 401K Contribution.

Perhaps if Little and team had continued on there would have been a stronger motivation to include us in the IAMNPF? But Little and team did not survive the purge.
personally i offer the same support to the iam and their position that they offered to us from the beginning. not much
 
personally i offer the same support to the iam and their position that they offered to us from the beginning. not much

I can honestly understand that. But many of their issues also coincide with our own issues. Scope particularly in Maintenance and Related. I’m sure the IAM would like more work compared to what they have now. Medical, why would any of us not want to pay less or at least know the Company isn’t trying to rip us off not having a cap and being able to audit their costs?

Even the IAMNPF. If the Company wants out so badly the Association (TWU/IAM) are saying fine. But it’s going to cost the Company more than they’re offering. Who wouldn’t want a 10% Contribution over a 9% Contribution/Match combination?
 
Thank you for your response even if you didn’t actually answer my question.

No raise until full contract renegotiated. Gives both parties plenty of motivation. That’s what I would have preferred.

Now we are just satisfied to show up and no one is angry enough to start a card drive to motivate association
 
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