American Airlines and Labor Negotiations

[Buck]

Timmy's at it again. How long was that pipeline again?
View attachment 14752

Timmy may be at it again but it is more information than the Unions or Association has ever brought forth.

 

[Phoenix757767]

Timmy may be at it again but it is more information than the Unions or Association has ever brought forth.

It’s not information, it’s bullcrap.

 

[CremaDiLimone]

I’m sure there will be things on both sides maint and fleet won’t like and some they do but until we see an actual agreement nothing is set,
I just hope we see something soon I don’t want this to go past the holidays

i have 30+ years..i'm not a c/c...there's nothing that 'i won't like', unless the medical gets to where it erases my DOS raise. i also expect retro.

one main thing is the bonus. i don't like $3k for everyone, i prefer x-amount for every year service.

if the c/c language changes...too bad. from what i understand, the scope issue was purposely muddied by both parties and that will be the issue that cause some to vote no.

i can see those looking to leave hoping for more than the 'proposed' $65k/$105k. i can see someone not liking that if it's capped at a low number of those allowed to take a buy-out or the money shrinks.

i'm thinking the company will let everyone leave, but in a metered way. a few hundred here, and few hundred 2 months later, etc.

 

[V.O. Reason]

i have 30+ years..i'm not a c/c...there's nothing that 'i won't like', unless the medical gets to where it erases my DOS raise. i also expect retro.

one main thing is the bonus. i don't like $3k for everyone, i prefer x-amount for every year service.

if the c/c language changes...too bad. from what i understand, the scope issue was purposely muddied by both parties and that will be the issue that cause some to vote no.

i can see those looking to leave hoping for more than the 'proposed' $65k/$105k. i can see someone not liking that if it's capped at a low number of those allowed to take a buy-out or the money shrinks.

i'm thinking the company will let everyone leave, but in a metered way. a few hundred here, and few hundred 2 months later, etc.

I’m with you, there were some concerns when that proposal was on Jetnet and then they made some positive changes and there wasn’t much I could not live with.
Yes the money per years of service would be great and truly be a nice bonus for many.
It’s just a shame we are still talking about wanting a deal as we approach November when this should have been done months ago

 

[ALUS78]

That won't fly.

I doubt it went that way. Assuming it was more like what would it take to get more stations? And that started a "what if" conversation.

Do you honestly think one group subsidizes another? Im pretty sure the company has a budget for each group.I dont (if there's any truth to it) jobs for wages thats the union taking care of itself.Dl +3% anything else would be a disappointment

 

[ALUS78]

It’s not information, it’s bullcrap.

Well you said they were dotting the Is crossing the Ts

 

[NYer]

Do you honestly think one group subsidizes another? Im pretty sure the company has a budget for each group.I dont (if there's any truth to it) jobs for wages thats the union taking care of itself.Dl +3% anything else would be a disappointment

It must of misunderstood the answer. Don't know how you reached the conclusion, that I believe one group subsidizes the other. Doesn't work that way.

Our comparators are the other groups in the industry, Fleet v. Fleet.

 

[dfw gen]

It must of misunderstood the answer. Wine know how your teched the conclusion I believe I've group subsidizes the other. Doesn't work that way.

Our comparators are the other groups in the industry, Fleet v. Fleet.

Sorry disagree with that. Years ago i worked with jim little on the junior mech program. We had a few frank discussions on that issue and he did admit that it was a twu strategy to use one group to further the interest of another group. Another example are "flow thru items"

 

[Kev3188]

It’s not information, it’s bullcrap.

So says the resident expert on BS...

i have 30+ years..i'm not a c/c...there's nothing that 'i won't like', unless the medical gets to where it erases my DOS raise. i also expect retro.

one main thing is the bonus. i don't like $3k for everyone, i prefer x-amount for every year service.

if the c/c language changes...too bad. from what i understand, the scope issue was purposely muddied by both parties and that will be the issue that cause some to vote no.

i can see those looking to leave hoping for more than the 'proposed' $65k/$105k. i can see someone not liking that if it's capped at a low number of those allowed to take a buy-out or the money shrinks.

i'm thinking the company will let everyone leave, but in a metered way. a few hundred here, and few hundred 2 months later, etc.

That’s almost how it has to go- and the metering will differ between stations, work areas, etc.

 

[ALUS78]

Sorry disagree with that. Years ago i worked with jim little on the junior mech program. We had a few frank discussions on that issue and he did admit that it was a twu strategy to use one group to further the interest of another group. Another example are "flow thru items"

Further the interest of one group at the expense of another???

 

[dfw gen]

Further the interest of one group at the expense of another???

basically yes. the twu philosophy has always been "a loaf of bread cost the same for everyone brother"
when bobby gless made his famous quote "you need to lower your expectations" it was made with that mantra in mind. that was the driving force behind separate locals for maintenance and fleet service. to give the illusion of separation. rest assured ALL contracts ave been negotiated the same way the committee gets together talks for a few years about bulletin boards, the color of the bathrooms and then one day its just the "executive committee" in negotiations everyone is locked out of the room. and POOF we have an A.I.P. leading to a T.A. . rest assured there is a lot of finagling of the pie. the company has a figure in mind once thats determined its up to he union to see how it gets divided. its simplified but thats the way it works. so yes its all about the dues and the internationals survival.

 

[dfw gen]

again, how did the association come to be? my personal theory and its probably closer to the truth then some might want to think. jim little whether he did or did not invite the teamsters in to counter an amfa drive is debatable. what lends credence to that theory was the company quick response to get the seniority list in to the nmb.as a side note amfa had enough cards to force an election. the committee screwed up but the companies quick response to the nmb was interesting, wonder what was promised for that response? just a theory mind you. anyway i believe that jim little came close to bankrupting or spent enough that they could not afford to counter a card drive by the iam. at the same time jim little and don vidivitch where convinced they would lose an election, so if you cant beat them join them. as good as negotiators they were we ended up with the association. and to answer a question why no vote? the association used the dues checkoff cards YOU signed when you got hired as a sign of interest in the association. there was a 30 day period where an intervener would be able to submit cards i.e. amfa, but they gambled that amfa could not get cards signed fast enough to make the 30 day period. they were right. an yes its legal the nmb followed the law, that unions pushed for.
personally if there were another card drive i think i wuld have everyone sign two cards.

 

[NYer]

Sorry disagree with that. Years ago i worked with jim little on the junior mech program. We had a few frank discussions on that issue and he did admit that it was a twu strategy to use one group to further the interest of another group. Another example are "flow thru items"

Negotiations were separated by group, with the President's of those Locals involved in the negotiations. No President from one group would agree to less so another group can get more.

 

[NYer]

basically yes. the twu philosophy has always been "a loaf of bread cost the same for everyone brother"
when bobby gless made his famous quote "you need to lower your expectations" it was made with that mantra in mind. that was the driving force behind separate locals for maintenance and fleet service. to give the illusion of separation. rest assured ALL contracts ave been negotiated the same way the committee gets together talks for a few years about bulletin boards, the color of the bathrooms and then one day its just the "executive committee" in negotiations everyone is locked out of the room. and POOF we have an A.I.P. leading to a T.A. . rest assured there is a lot of finagling of the pie. the company has a figure in mind once thats determined its up to he union to see how it gets divided. its simplified but thats the way it works. so yes its all about the dues and the internationals survival.

The Executive Committee today makes agreements and gets TA's without the President's and even the actual Negotiating Committee.

That didn't happen in the past, nothing came back unless the majority of the President's agreed.

 

[NYer]

again, how did the association come to be? my personal theory and its probably closer to the truth then some might want to think. jim little whether he did or did not invite the teamsters in to counter an amfa drive is debatable. what lends credence to that theory was the company quick response to get the seniority list in to the nmb.as a side note amfa had enough cards to force an election. the committee screwed up but the companies quick response to the nmb was interesting, wonder what was promised for that response? just a theory mind you. anyway i believe that jim little came close to bankrupting or spent enough that they could not afford to counter a card drive by the iam. at the same time jim little and don vidivitch where convinced they would lose an election, so if you cant beat them join them. as good as negotiators they were we ended up with the association. and to answer a question why no vote? the association used the dues checkoff cards YOU signed when you got hired as a sign of interest in the association. there was a 30 day period where an intervener would be able to submit cards i.e. amfa, but they gambled that amfa could not get cards signed fast enough to make the 30 day period. they were right. an yes its legal the nmb followed the law, that unions pushed for.
personally if there were another card drive i think i wuld have everyone sign two cards.

AMFA was created in 1964 by an American Airlines mechanic. To date, haven't been able to get a enough cards signed even when wine if the Local President's were pushing it.

If you can do it, go ahead. But taking about it for decades, then creating conspiracies to explain the failures is pretty tiresome.