American Airlines and Labor Negotiations

[737823]

I'm kind of torn on this one......
As a member of said Local (LL914) Some people have been wondering what this union have been doing with all of their dues money. Like the complaint states, these 3 CSR's were PMCO, and they didn't have a union. IMHO, they were treated much better (by hub management) than the ramp. When the cuts came, they got theirs back faster than we did (along with all of the other unionized groups). There were no union drives on that side of the house. We felt we had to go Union because of a upcoming merger and a "staple job" might happen because we were smaller group than PMUA. But that is history now.

A lot of people are pissed with the local because of the attendance issues (and other things....) Some miss the flexibility that no union rules had. But the trade off is having definite work rules that were much needed (especially on the ramp side) Like all things, there are pros and cons. District 141 needs some changes big time, and now that I have been on both sides of the Union / Non-Union fence, is it worth paying sixty plus dollars a month for what???

EDIT: Oh and I forgot... The District doesn't seem to care because they will be getting new members once UGS hits the property... I guess they will be members of our LL as well.

I hope it works out for you all and these three agents. The correspondence from the District seemed to address them as “new members” which I found bizarre. Regardless this could have big positive implications for airline workers and promote accountability to make the unions earn their dues (or agency fees)

Josh

 

[robbedagain]

There’s never been any last, best, final, complete, this is it, take it or leave it, we ain’t kidding here offer.

If there was robbed then Nilsson would be able to fill in those blanks and not tell me to look elsewhere.

Negotiations continue next week in San Francisco.

Agree WeAA. I was being lil sarcastic there knowing there really is nothing in terms of an agreement

 

[WeAAsles]

i dont think you fully understand. The company offered that nobody (current snapshot) would be necessarily displaced. That means not displaced to pt.
At any rate, you had it in writing about the scope, so you dont have to rely on me.
The union confirmed in your update that the company did offer all current scope. But the union didnt listen and it drove the company into section 6. Funny thing is that fly said it was a helluva offer and that the company was shocked that the association flushed the offer down the toilet cuz it wanted to use fleet as a chip for mx.

I don’t think you fully understand even if you now throw in the word “necessarily” to give you that back door way out when Members ARE bumped down to PT.

The Company videos were quite specific in their meaning that there would be no Station displacement but ZERO Mention of Status displacement. Unlike you I need it in very clear Legal language before I buy it.

I’m 100% positive that no one said they wanted to use Fleet as a chip for MX but yes I’m sure in Solidarity we all go in together, and we all come out together. And that will be even with the NMB involved.

Tim we have gotten items agreed to (TA’d) because of the Solidarity of the Maintenance Negotiators so I consider us honor bound to support them. (You don’t care about those items Honor, Integrity or Credibility though)

 

[WeAAsles]

Weez... I have a question-- How does someone like Tim know what the last offer actually entailed? He is not on the N/C... he is said to not even a member in good standing... How can he know these things... unless... WAIT... he has an insider on the Company side of the table!

He doesn’t know anything. He makes things up as he goes along. Make up enough stuff and something is bound to be true.

 

[WeAAsles]

Agree WeAA. I was being lil sarcastic there knowing there really is nothing in terms of an agreement

Lord knows I understand sarcasm since I’ve written a few books on the subject.

 

[Tim Nelson]

l

I don’t think you fully understand even if you now throw in the word “necessarily” to give you that back door way out when Members ARE bumped down to PT.

The Company videos were quite specific in their meaning that there would be no Station displacement but ZERO Mention of Status displacement. Unlike you I need it in very clear Legal language before I buy it.

I’m 100% positive that no one said they wanted to use Fleet as a chip for MX but yes I’m sure in Solidarity we all go in together, and we all come out together. And that will be even with the NMB involved.

Tim we have gotten items agreed to (TA’d) because of the Solidarity of the Maintenance Negotiators so I consider us honor bound to support them. (You don’t care about those items Honor, Integrity or Credibility though)

Look, the displacement language already exist. You are creating fake news.
At any rate, for a moment, lets all say that the company isnt compelled to offer any more. What is the exit plan, other than a vote?
Members wanna know.

Btw, i think the company is fine with the whole honor stuff and just riding out the bankruptcy contract for years to come.
But i can promise that if the union refuses to allow a vote very much longer, that it will be raided by another organization that will guarantee a vote by the members and finish the job.

 

[ALUS78]

I'm kind of torn on this one......
As a member of said Local (LL914) Some people have been wondering what this union have been doing with all of their dues money. Like the complaint states, these 3 CSR's were PMCO, and they didn't have a union. IMHO, they were treated much better (by hub management) than the ramp. When the cuts came, they got theirs back faster than we did (along with all of the other unionized groups). There were no union drives on that side of the house. We felt we had to go Union because of a upcoming merger and a "staple job" might happen because we were smaller group than PMUA. But that is history now.

A lot of people are pissed with the local because of the attendance issues (and other things....) Some miss the flexibility that no union rules had. But the trade off is having definite work rules that were much needed (especially on the ramp side) Like all things, there are pros and cons. District 141 needs some changes big time, and now that I have been on both sides of the Union / Non-Union fence, is it worth paying sixty plus dollars a month for what???

EDIT: Oh and I forgot... The District doesn't seem to care because they will be getting new members once UGS hits the property... I guess they will be members of our LL as well.

Excellent post

 

[WeAAsles]

At any rate, for a moment, lets all say that the company isnt compelled to offer any more. What is the exit plan, other than a vote?

I deleted the nonsense. You know how the RLA and Mediation work.

That’s the exit plan.

 

[Tim Nelson]

I deleted the nonsense. You know how the RLA and Mediation work.

That’s the exit plan.

yes i do and the iam already told us and said that if a ta is voted down then the next one will be worse. Should i post it again?
Basically, here is the deal. If the union kicks the can then in about 2 years...after being iced, the process will be for the union to accept arbitration or something much worse. And 0% self help as well.
And none of this is new. 5 months ago, after a year of sito talking big, he agreed to arbitration for our railway employees.
Listen up, because what im about to say is important. The arbitrator cant pick and choose. It has to agree with the company offer or the union proposal. The measuring stick is "The Industry Pattern".
You remember i told you that parker came in at 10% above United?

Tell me who has leverage?

At the end of the day, the union should ta now. But what may happen is that the union will rob us of pay increases, although it just gave eachother big ones, and blame an arbitrator like sito did in the rail.

morons

 

[WeAAsles]

Should i post it again?

This was the only thing I could find to work with on the last one. Please post something from someone official. Anyone or anything at all Tim.

You can’t post things your mind makes up unfortunately.

In the meantime Timmy. Take a chill pill. Go see a Concert or something. The Who will be touring with an orchestra. That should be cool. They’re even working on a new album. Smoke a joint while you’re at it.

http://ultimateclassicrock.com/who-2019-north-american-tour/

 

[Tim Nelson]

This was the only thing I could find to work with on the last one. Please post something from someone official. Anyone or anything at all Tim.

You can’t post things your mind makes up unfortunately.

In the meantime Timmy. Take a chill pill. Go see a Concert or something. The Who will be touring with an orchestra. That should be cool. They’re even working on a new album. Smoke a joint while you’re at it.

http://ultimateclassicrock.com/who-2019-north-american-tour/

ok. ill post the letter from sitos attorney that there would be no self help granted at UA and if they voted the ta down, the next one will be worse.
Ill post the sad arbitration ruling from 5 months ago after all sito tuff talk to the 10,000 iam rail members.
At American, the NMB will recognize pattern bargaining and will NEVER allow self help.
The only choice will be to sign now or blow smoke up everyones arse and sign the same thing in 2 years. Or if the industry continues downward pressures, alot less.
Your members would betotally hosed.
There is no significant support to switch unions on this property now for fleet, but if the association doesnt allow a vote then ill put out feelers in about 6 months.

 

[WeAAsles]

ok. ill post the letter from sitos attorney that there would be no self help granted at UA.


Ill post the sad arbitration ruling from 5 months ago after all sito tuff talk to the 10,000 iam rail members.

UA? United Airlines? WTF do I give a squirrel’s air fart takeoff about United Airlines?

I thought you had something to show (us) about American Airlines that (we) haven’t seen?

Nothing personal to UA but I don’t give a pluck, puck, phuck about your old news letters to the editor.

And I don’t care about any Rail Crap you got either. Go dump it on the farm with the pig slop.

American Airlines Nelson. (We) work for American Airlines. Jeez Louise.

And the rest of your posting rant was again not worth my attention so it was deleted.

 

[Tim Nelson]

UA? United Airlines? WTF do I give a squirrel’s air fart takeoff about United Airlines?

I thought you had something to show (us) about American Airlines that (we) haven’t seen?

Nothing personal to UA but I don’t give a pluck, puck, phuck about your old news letters to the editor.

And I don’t care about any Rail Crap you got either. Go dump it on the farm with the pig slop.

American Airlines Nelson. (We) work for American Airlines. Jeez Louise.

And the rest of your posting rant was again not worth my attention so it was deleted.

I know you dont. I wrote that for the audience. You could care less about our negotiations, because the entire mediation process is on the patterned foundation.
Where is this giant slowdown that you and peterson and baskett declared?
I hate to be the one to tell you this but NOBODY is interested in a slowdown, they wanna vote. Very few support this association. And if, by some dumb miracle, peterson gets a handful to slowdown then my gut feeling is that the company will send your worthless union a bill.
You Lose!

 

[Tim Nelson]

and if sito runs the exact same play he did everywhere else then the following will be the broken record.
1. we had a productive week of negotiations
2. The company is bad.
3. We had a bad week of negotiations.
4. There has been progress.
5. The company wants to contract out work
........and just repeat the above until this last one...

We have agreed to arbitrate your negotiations.

Game Over. You Lose!

 

[ALUS78]

In my career I can probably count more representatives that were terrible than I can say were any good honestly. Overall the goal should be to replace the dead and rotted wood with some sturdy timber.

Nelson is absolutely not sturdy timber.

Tim s priorities are the workers not the union that is why he fell out of favor with the IAM and they had to let a very talented recruiter/ organizer go.Tims been at it for years thats bedrock to me