AMFA Organizing Drive to Replace Association

[to much time to quit]

TMTTQ, When you say no benefit to switch until this contract is about to become amenable sound as though you are thinking of just yourself. That is exactly what the IAM/TWU are doing they thought of the dues so the association got formed. You'll make more money if we get rid of the association and you get the 9%401k plan like everyone here on the LAA side. Like you said if you're vested then why are you willing to lose 4 yrs of 401k money into a multicompany plan. Makes No sense at all. On top of that the others forced into the plan lose as well. So if you really want those reps to come back to the floor because they are scamming. This is the Time to sign a card get a Vote and Bring AMFA Here.

You guys had a vote with the IBT, what did the IAM say to you about your PF then? You guys there got a Vote that is what we want a chance to VOTE, if AMFA gets in then OK, but if NOT the membership has had it's say and there should be NO Crying about it.

It will be the rank and file from all the companies that AMFA represents who will be able to put in for the Top positions. The best for the job will prevail.

I will await an answer from AMFA national on how the contractual iam pension contributions will be handled in the event of a change. If they will be changed to increase 401K from 5% to 9% in lieu of the pension contributions, then I can live with that. If I'm going to lose out on $$ contractually obligated to my future monthly retirement benefits then that's an issue for me and many others. If you say that's only thinking about myself, then you have a right to your opinion, but I have been boned just as good as everyone else around here for 30 + years and am not looking to screw myself over without the companys help.

 

[swamt]

He sold out for a quarter milion dollars a year and a very big TWU International pension package...……

Hopefully they wont need him when we vote AMFA in …...

Karma baby! KARMA!!

Thanks for your input. I know i'm going to hear a bunch of belly aching, but the way I see it for the minority on the Usair side, and IMO everybody is IF the TA passes it really is no benefit for us to switch to AMFA until the year before the new contract expires.That way if there isn't a bridge to not lose the pension contributions, we don't give away $$ back to the company for several years for free. I also feel it would be better for the current union to monitor the billable hours and administrating of the contract language that they are already familiar with. Don't get me wrong, there are PLENTY of IAM reps I would love to see come back to the ranks and work as mechanics like they were hired to do, but what everyone needs to understand is it's going to be up to the rank and file to step up into all the new union positions to make the new union work for all of us. I know that most of the people pushing for the change have no interest nor are capable of doing any of these jobs.

TMTTQ,
As I do understand your idea of waiting until close to amendable date of contract to get AMFA in, I would have to respectfully disagree, and here's why.
The main reasons we did it right after the teamsters got us a contract was the following: We new it would take some time to get the newly replacement union up and running. Takes time to install temp local leadership until perm ones are voted on. Another huge reason behind doing sooner rather than later would be for the new union to get familiar with the contract they are inheriting as it will be containing a many different groups and rules and regs. Another biggie will be all the open grev's and letters that the union will have to take over as well. As far as the PF or 401K, and yes, as you say, we will have to see the "final" language to determan, I don't think you would lose anything. Matter fact, I think if you are moved into the 9% 401K plan you will do very well and better than the PF. The biggest bonus is that "YOU" will have control of "YOUR" retirement plan.
Yes, the current membership will have to step up and run AMFA if voted in. They do not want a"ANY" of the current union's leadership to do it as they would just try to get in under AMFA to destroy it from the inside out, and trust me, it's been tried here a few times.
On your original question I am of no help until the written language is finished as it is NOT as of today. So we wait for that. Until then, I was very glad to see you reaching out for info other than just trusting what this fiasco asso. tells you, as at this point they will tell you anything to scare you into not signing a card when they know their representation is on the line as it is currently and heavily. Good luck with finding the answer to your question on the PF.
May I ask who you addressed at the National level? Or was it all??

 

[AMFAinMIAMI]

I will await an answer from AMFA national on how the contractual iam pension contributions will be handled in the event of a change. If they will be changed to increase 401K from 5% to 9% in lieu of the pension contributions, then I can live with that. If I'm going to lose out on $$ contractually obligated to my future monthly retirement benefits then that's an issue for me and many others. If you say that's only thinking about myself, then you have a right to your opinion, but I have been boned just as good as everyone else around here for 30 + years and am not looking to screw myself over without the companys help.

TMTTQ; If you have over 30+ yrs then you know how the industrial unions look out for them and NOT US. Not saying this is fact but I assume that any money that was supposed to go to the IAMPF will just go into your 401k just like the TWU members. so the total you and I rcv will be 9%. Like you said you can live with that and I assume most on the LUS side will as well. I hope that you went to the AMFA National web site and emailed the Nat. Dir. Bret. on a guess he will tell you the same thing. But he will add without seeing the language for the contract and IAMPF rules it's an unknown.

With that said I along with many others here at LAA hope you guys on the LUS side sign cards to give us all a vote. You will have you voice and we will as well, what and how you vote will be on you. IAM, Association, AMFA, None, whatever the NMB puts on the ballot.

 

[1AA]

I will await an answer from AMFA national on how the contractual iam pension contributions will be handled in the event of a change. If they will be changed to increase 401K from 5% to 9% in lieu of the pension contributions, then I can live with that. If I'm going to lose out on $$ contractually obligated to my future monthly retirement benefits then that's an issue for me and many others. If you say that's only thinking about myself, then you have a right to your opinion, but I have been boned just as good as everyone else around here for 30 + years and am not looking to screw myself over without the companys help.

Unless it changed on the upcoming JCBA or the IAMPF changed their rules the more you earn in pay the more goes into your 401k. Your contributions are not fixed to a set amount. Work OT or Holiday pay will increase your dollar amount into your account that's controlled by you. Something to think about. If your at a station with an abundance of OT you can literally MAX out your 401k and if your in a catch up account you can dump into that as well. If you MAX out your 401k then you free up capital to invest elsewhere. I doubt you can even come close to that with the IAMPF.

 

[Rogallo]

I will await an answer from AMFA national on how the contractual iam pension contributions will be handled in the event of a change. If they will be changed to increase 401K from 5% to 9% in lieu of the pension contributions, then I can live with that. If I'm going to lose out on $$ contractually obligated to my future monthly retirement benefits then that's an issue for me and many others. If you say that's only thinking about myself, then you have a right to your opinion, but I have been boned just as good as everyone else around here for 30 + years and am not looking to screw myself over without the companys help.

Here's a novel idea......

LET THE MEMBERSHIP DECIDE!

 

[to much time to quit]

Karma baby! KARMA!!


TMTTQ,
As I do understand your idea of waiting until close to amendable date of contract to get AMFA in, I would have to respectfully disagree, and here's why.
The main reasons we did it right after the teamsters got us a contract was the following: We new it would take some time to get the newly replacement union up and running. Takes time to install temp local leadership until perm ones are voted on. Another huge reason behind doing sooner rather than later would be for the new union to get familiar with the contract they are inheriting as it will be containing a many different groups and rules and regs. Another biggie will be all the open grev's and letters that the union will have to take over as well. As far as the PF or 401K, and yes, as you say, we will have to see the "final" language to determan, I don't think you would lose anything. Matter fact, I think if you are moved into the 9% 401K plan you will do very well and better than the PF. The biggest bonus is that "YOU" will have control of "YOUR" retirement plan.
Yes, the current membership will have to step up and run AMFA if voted in. They do not want a"ANY" of the current union's leadership to do it as they would just try to get in under AMFA to destroy it from the inside out, and trust me, it's been tried here a few times.
On your original question I am of no help until the written language is finished as it is NOT as of today. So we wait for that. Until then, I was very glad to see you reaching out for info other than just trusting what this fiasco asso. tells you, as at this point they will tell you anything to scare you into not signing a card when they know their representation is on the line as it is currently and heavily. Good luck with finding the answer to your question on the PF.
May I ask who you addressed at the National level? Or was it all??

Thanks for your take on everything. I'm not here to get in an online internet pissing match with anybody and will listen and respond to any reasonable reply's. I just sent a general inquiry (yesterday) question thru the AMFA national website. Didn't have a direct email address for any individual rep who may best be suited to answer my concerns so had to use the contact link on their website. Obviously by the last 2 reply's to me, NOBODY is taking their time to read what my post is even asking about. I know how 401K match works and I'm not living here at the airport for OT, nor am I concerned about 401 catch up. Just wanting to know what can legally be done contractually to shift my contractually obligated $2.40 an hour contribution to a 401K, or will the company get off the hook for several years without having to pay those funds? Very basic inquiry.

 

[scorpion 2]

Thanks for your input. I know i'm going to hear a bunch of belly aching, but the way I see it for the minority on the Usair side, and IMO everybody is IF the TA passes it really is no benefit for us to switch to AMFA until the year before the new contract expires.That way if there isn't a bridge to not lose the pension contributions, we don't give away $$ back to the company for several years for free. I also feel it would be better for the current union to monitor the billable hours and administrating of the contract language that they are already familiar with. Don't get me wrong, there are PLENTY of IAM reps I would love to see come back to the ranks and work as mechanics like they were hired to do, but what everyone needs to understand is it's going to be up to the rank and file to step up into all the new union positions to make the new union work for all of us. I know that most of the people pushing for the change have no interest nor are capable of doing any of these jobs.

Sounds like your a proponent or at least have faith that you will receive your money back once it’s deposited into the PF. You need to ask your own union what will happen not one that is not in negotiations for you. How should AMFA know the answer to that?
The money that’s put into that pension goes into a general fund not set aside for just you. There may be a dollar figure that’s associated with your name but it’s not in safe keeping just FOR you. Your contributions are used for guys retiring now not setting there waiting for just you to draw on later.
As far as the current union managing the billable hours they are not doing it right now, let alone after the contracts been TA’d. We have hundereds if not thousands of grievances that need to go to arbitration that the international refuse to sign off on. What will be different next year?

 

[AMFAinMIAMI]

Thanks for your take on everything. I'm not here to get in an online internet pissing match with anybody and will listen and respond to any reasonable reply's. I just sent a general inquiry (yesterday) question thru the AMFA national website. Didn't have a direct email address for any individual rep who may best be suited to answer my concerns so had to use the contact link on their website. Obviously by the last 2 reply's to me, NOBODY is taking their time to read what my post is even asking about. I know how 401K match works and I'm not living here at the airport for OT, nor am I concerned about 401 catch up. Just wanting to know what can legally be done contractually to shift my contractually obligated $2.40 an hour contribution to a 401K, or will the company get off the hook for several years without having to pay those funds? Very basic inquiry.

TMTTQ; I don't think anyone is trying to get into any match with you about the IAMPF or AMFA I think that they are giving you information that they have found out or researched about how it works for us LAA guys, and are applying it to your question. If you don't get the reply from Amfa without sending it to anyone directly send that to either the Nat. Dir or his asst. Their emails are on the amfa national site under officers.

So are you trying to get amfa to say what they would do against AA or the IAM if you lose any money in the future.
Having 30+ yrs are you old enough or secure enough to take the package if offered at your station? If the thought of loosing any money going forward is a big gamble you should join those of us who are going to retire soon.

What has the IAM told you they would do with your money should they get voted out? What will they do to protect your money if the fund goes deeper into the red. Should the fund get discontinued will the IAM put pressure on AA to add the money into your 401k? Have you emailed the District Lodge with those questions? Lets be fair here ask them .

 

[2ndGENAMT]

Thanks for your take on everything. I'm not here to get in an online internet pissing match with anybody and will listen and respond to any reasonable reply's. I just sent a general inquiry (yesterday) question thru the AMFA national website. Didn't have a direct email address for any individual rep who may best be suited to answer my concerns so had to use the contact link on their website. Obviously by the last 2 reply's to me, NOBODY is taking their time to read what my post is even asking about. I know how 401K match works and I'm not living here at the airport for OT, nor am I concerned about 401 catch up. Just wanting to know what can legally be done contractually to shift my contractually obligated $2.40 an hour contribution to a 401K, or will the company get off the hook for several years without having to pay those funds? Very basic inquiry.

I honestly don’t think that question can be answered until you see the final language on retirement in the AIP/TA. The IAM will probably fight to keep those funds going into the IAM pension as long as possible even if the members get different representation. It will be a contract so it’s all in the language. JMO.

 

[Buck]

Everyone realizes there is going to be a further shortage of A&P's. Logically supply and demand will affect the Mechanics.
I believe that WN mechanic top out is 5 years while AA is 8 years.

 

[swamt]

Everyone realizes there is going to be a further shortage of A&P's. Logically supply and demand will affect the Mechanics.
I believe that WN mechanic top out is 5 years while AA is 8 years.

WN is 5 years with an additional "there after" year, but top out is considered at 5 years.

 

[AMFAinMIAMI]

We all know that forever the TWU and AA have been ONE, no matter when it's been, one piping after another. I read a lot from unhappy people here on the forum both in the Maintenance topic, contract negotiations. Having talked with other organizers around the system there are still many of you who in the past have signed cards more than once that are holding off signing a card this time. The Tulsa Prez recently put out a video, did you all see it? The Association announced our AIP T/A back at the end of Jan. Yet we still get updates about how we are still working on the final draft. How the monetary language for maintenance is still being worked out. My belief was it was just a tactic to maybe slow the card drive long enough for them to come up with some way to PIPE US ALL AGAIN.

On the LUS side in Maintenance many still think the IAMPF is going to save them when they retire. If any of you are reading this do the Math, more money from the 9% 401k going out the door.

There is also a lot of talk on how the voting is going to be done. TWU line has 591, Tulsa has it's own local but most cities don't have a local. So voting in one day no matter when and not by phone or electronic on the LAA side since the LUS guys do it another way is to me a setup for the benefit of them TWU/IAM. If it's not done in person by each member their voice will not be heard FOR/AGAINST.

When we do get to see the actual draft of this T/A we will also see just how the association protected the Facilities and GSE guys as well.

We all have heard rumors of the $$$$ disparity between the work groups, Just remember your NEGOTIATING TEAM did this. Each gave up something to keep the head count so that dues would continue to flow into them.

Cards are still flowing in to our PO Box each day but each of you need to find ways to help us get to where we need to be to file for an election to rid AA of the Association.

Everyone throughout this forum is bringing up old stuff that the TWU or IAM has done to us all. There are many of you saying this is my last contract and I want the money and don't care about the guys who will be here after I'm gone. To me that has been the problem here at AA since the beginning.

No matter what's going on at Delta, SWA, United, what they have or got is on them.

So with all this continued BS that has been going on here, I have a question.


HAVE YOU ALL HAD ENOUGH OF THIS AND ISN'T TIME FOR EACH ONE OF YOU TO SIGN A CARD OR GET ONE OF YOUR CO-WORKERS TOO.

 

[AMFAinMIAMI]

Soon we will be voting on our T/A, we have many of our fellow mechanics who have said as soon as we get our T/A I will sign a AMFA Card. Since most of us think it will pass you will need to revisit these mechanics and have them sign a card. We are very close to having the required number to petition the NMB for a vote lets get this done ASAP.

 

[dfw gen]

Here's a novel idea......

LET THE MEMBERSHIP DECIDE!

the iam doesnt do it that way........

 

[Rogallo]

the iam doesnt do it that way........

Now they get to vote the TWU way. Electronically.

And they seem a bit confused!