Ass. And AA should bring proposal to employees

Discussion in 'American Airlines' started by bigjets, Oct 23, 2018.

  1. bigjets

    bigjets Veteran

    Joined:
    Jan 14, 2011
    Messages:
    1,881
    Likes Received:
    1,304
    Does anybody else think that AA should offer a proposal to ass. and ass. should bring it to membership for a vote, just to see where the membership stands?

    We would be able to see if AA is offering an industry leading contract, and if we vote it down, the ass negotiators would have the full backing of union membership.

    Meeting at the end of October then not again until end of January seems like a good timeline to see how membership feels.
     
    • Agree Agree x 4
  2. dfw gen

    dfw gen Veteran

    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2011
    Messages:
    3,439
    Likes Received:
    2,542
    #2 dfw gen, Oct 24, 2018
    Last edited: Oct 24, 2018
    Im assuming that you have read whats on jetnet? The parts that say the company may replace or may not replace people as they leave, at their discretion? And i assume that you trust the company to stand by their promises? When they say they will staff line stations, they wouldn't leave one person and claim its "staffed"?so if they offer an early out and the top 15% leave and the company elects to not replace them how does that help your seniority? Days off? Shifts? So that 15% that left will they come off of midnight shift? Or day shift? Or afternoon shift? How about we vote on it and we can write that part later? I cant believe we fall for this every time.
    What we need to do is motivate the iam leadership to start fighting or get rid of them.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
    • Winner Winner x 2
  3. There is NOTHING to vote on! Do you want to vote on bullet points? Worry about the details later? That kind of thing has worked SO WELL in the past.
     
    • Winner Winner x 2
  4. 1AA

    1AA Veteran

    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2002
    Messages:
    5,592
    Likes Received:
    4,136
    I can tell you from feedback in Aircraft Maintenance the company wants to outsource as much as possible. They would love to get rid of all AA AMT'S if they could. Downsize many stations staffed with aircraft maintenance personnel. Have contractual maintenance like Envoy move in and do our work. Envoy is AA's low cost labor entity. They already perform various levels of work at AA. Add Brazil and Mexico in the mix and we have become a low cost, low class carrier competing with Spirit. It's all about making money, filling seats and cutting labor costs to achieve this. In the meantime Delta and United are upping their service and amenities. Somehow they can do it and still make profits and cover their labor expenses. It shows our management team can not compete for the same customer service level and maintain a friendly employee relationship.
     
  5. bigjets

    bigjets Veteran

    Joined:
    Jan 14, 2011
    Messages:
    1,881
    Likes Received:
    1,304
    That sounds like business school 101, how many mechs does delta and united have? I don’t know what the numbers are, but I think we have most mechs and even with what AA wants we would still be outsourcing less then all other airlines at 35% total outsourcing. I don’t like it, but I think that’s the environment we are in now.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
  6. bigjets

    bigjets Veteran

    Joined:
    Jan 14, 2011
    Messages:
    1,881
    Likes Received:
    1,304
    That’s why said offer a proposal and not to vote on bullet points.
     
  7. bigjets

    bigjets Veteran

    Joined:
    Jan 14, 2011
    Messages:
    1,881
    Likes Received:
    1,304
    That’s why I said to offer a proposal and not go by what’s on jetnet. That means we get to read what would be in a contract. I don’t believe in givebacks for jobs that are not maint related.

    An example would be aircraft movement crews. If AA wanted to they could give that to ramp. It’s a job that works better if we do it. Shift protection is one of the dumbest fights there is. We gave to protect mci AFW and TAESL and look what happened. Garentees of shift and station protection is like nailing jello to the wall.

    AA is a business and we all work for a corporate culture and industry that isn’t overly worker friendly. I want to know who is being unreasonable the company or the ass.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  8. anotherdelay

    anotherdelay Senior

    Joined:
    Jun 26, 2012
    Messages:
    255
    Likes Received:
    29
    #8 anotherdelay, Oct 24, 2018
    Last edited: Oct 24, 2018
    all great points here. but let's see the total proposal, with the language as is,then storm Doug's and glass office if its a total screwing. And if its a total screwing, picketing and bullhorning should be the last thing you should be doing, after 17 years. but you damn better be sure, its a total screwing. we all know productivity changes are always coming. After 17 years of vagueness, its time we get to see the language, proposals. Holiday season is coming and stock has plenty of resistance zones now, twu mx, you had alot of power when things were going well. If you're reasonable with the demands, you have the same power, now that things are not. I still thnk Doug and the board is on the Twu tex/tul side.Show your members the language and the ask. Don't give two chits about iam side, hopefully their side does better.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  9. anotherdelay

    anotherdelay Senior

    Joined:
    Jun 26, 2012
    Messages:
    255
    Likes Received:
    29
    the members will always be stronger than the intl if the members are united. If the intl doesn't want to respond to the members, then let the intl fire you. They aren't the company, somewhere you guys let cart go before the horse, and you guys are the horse. Get away from both intls, but be united. twu supposed to work for you, but you have to finally show a united front against them.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  10. bigjets

    bigjets Veteran

    Joined:
    Jan 14, 2011
    Messages:
    1,881
    Likes Received:
    1,304
    Thx for the input fellas, that’s what I hear in the breakroom and from guys I know at other stations.
     
  11. MikeS

    MikeS Member

    Joined:
    May 30, 2018
    Messages:
    61
    Likes Received:
    14
    Just my opinion I think it should be brought back for a vote, let's let the members decide. Everyone has one vote and one vote only so no matter how strongly I feel about an issue we collectively must agree. Take scope for example, I don't really care about scope. That's only a benefit for the union to collect dues. Let me ask this question, would you take a pay raise, more holidays, more vacation and better 401K if there are 500 less mechanics on the seniority list. For me the answer is easy, yes. But again my vote only represents me, so if there is no vote I get no say in the process. I also don't trust the union at all, there are a lot of people in the union who have their own personal agendas and could care less about the group as a whole. My trust level with the company isn't that great, but i would take my chances with them over the union.
     
    • Winner Winner x 2
  12. 1986Mekanic

    1986Mekanic Senior

    Joined:
    Jun 1, 2018
    Messages:
    476
    Likes Received:
    81
    It's all good unless your one of the 500. On top of that, we should not be letting go of any work we currently do, including aircraft taxi/moves.
     
  13. bigjets

    bigjets Veteran

    Joined:
    Jan 14, 2011
    Messages:
    1,881
    Likes Received:
    1,304
    Again,
    We voted in paycuts in 2003, 2012 to save jobs. We lost mci, AFW, TAESL and a good chunk of TUL.

    Right now AA could do away with all the movecrews throughout system and all our union could do is file a presidents grievence which they will lose.

    The old timers like to brag that they fought for us to get uniforms. In 2003 we gave back half our uniforms because they had a monitary value. Meaning our old timers took less money for uniforms in essence leasing polyester pants.

    So no I am NOT willing to except less in order to save non A&P work.
     
  14. NewHampshire Black Bears

    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2002
    Messages:
    8,776
    Likes Received:
    654

    What KIND of a so - called Union Man, would advocate for the Loss of 500 UNION JOBS, in exchange for his own personal $$$ benefit ????
     
  15. UPNAWAY

    UPNAWAY Veteran

    Joined:
    Aug 17, 2005
    Messages:
    2,147
    Likes Received:
    681
    The very idea of fighting for someone else's future Job is in fact nonsense and just shows the power of union brainwashing. Your only responsibility is to yourself, your family and you can maybe stretch that reason a bit to your current co-workers. The idea of hurting yourself now by buying into the union line that we need to "protect future generational jobs" is counterproductive for everyone except the association. Beside who knows what the industry will look like in the future, even great Scope maybe realized useless by changing environment. Add in the background fact that Unions overall are costing jobs not protecting them, makes this philosophy a very hard one to understand.
     
    • Winner Winner x 3
    • Agree Agree x 1

Share This Page