DALPA MEC Chair to step down

[WorldTraveler]

Let's see DL's pilots got a 20% raise in exchange for 33% reduction in PS and non-union got anywhere from 2%-8% raises in the same time frame.

and you are simply not telling the truth. DL non-contract employees received 2-5% PER YEAR over the same period that the pilots got 20%. Surely you don't think that DL employees are that gullible, do you? You never stop trying to manipulate the facts in order to come up with a winning argument, though.


and again you fail to mention that the pilots gave up scope in order to get those increases. no other workgroup did. IN fact, most DL ground employees work whatever aircraft pulls up - and it may be DL mainline, DCI, or alliance partner aircraft.


PMDL pilots also are the only group that had terminated pensions in BK.

as hard as it is for you to accept, there are very valid reasons why DL pilots got a different rate of increase than other groups.

 
 

...Only because those same DL employees are generating record setting revenues...

...History also shows that commercial aviation is about as cyclical as it gets...

In the meantime, Wall St. likes those revenues, and want that stream to continue as long as possible. That's where the pressure for a "good" pilot deal will ultimately come from most.

so wait.... are you as a DL employee arguing to monetize some of your PS? remember, DL employees earned more PS for this quarter than WN and UA combined.

PS is a great idea and has paid out billions of dollars to DL employees...

but 20% of your salary in PS is a lot that is dependent on the company. That is why WS and the company want to flatten out salaries even while not decreasing what DL employees take home.

 

[700UW]

The time frame was June 29, 2012 till the end of 2014.
 
Manipulate this:
 
So that means non-union got a raise in April of 2013 and a raise in April of 2014.
 
So that means the pilots are up anywhere from 10%-16% over non-union in raises.
 
Only person that makes up "facts" is you and you get caught out there all the time.
 
And the real reason, you know the thing called the truth, oh wait you wouldnt, the pilots got the great raises they did is because they NEGOTIATED it and VOTED on it, unlike non-union who had NO say in what DL took from them.

 

[WorldTraveler]

no, your math is wrong.

if you actually KNEW the facts, you could cite them correctly.

DL's non-contract employees had THREE pay raises over the period that the pilots got 20%. Your statement of 10-16% advantage by the pilots is laughably wrong.

You are the one that throws out charges of lying because your "facts" are nothing more than manipulations and intentional omissions.

All you do is show why one statement you and the IAM makes are wrong and why DL employees have wisely and correctly chosen to not only remain non-union since the merger but insured that tens of thousands of former NW IAM membership cards are now worthless.

DL employees know better which is why they continue to democratically say NO to the IAM.

 

[700UW]

Prove me wrong with facts, oh wait you cant, because you like to make facts up.
 
Bottom line is Pilots got 20% raise in lieu of negotiating a 33% reduction in PS and the most a non-union DL employee got was a 10% raise in the same time period.
 
Now make up some more misinformation.

 

[WorldTraveler]

what is wrong is that DL non-contract did not receive ONLY a 10% raise and there was NO reduction in profit sharing.

DL non-contract employees received more than 10% and gave up no scope and also did not have terminated pension plans in BK.

ALL DL employees had a reduction in the profit sharing calculation percentages but received higher profit sharing and total compensation as a result.

until you acknowledge that the changes in profit sharing resulted in higher profit sharing and total compensation, you are manipulating the data to paint a story that isn't true.

When you accept that your facts are wrong and incomplete, then you have no choice but to quit calling other people liars because the only lies are what you write.

 

[700UW]

Are you on drugs?
 
DL cut the non-union PS from 15% to 10% payout, that is a 33% reduction payout, which happened in 2013 payout and 2014 payout.
 
You are a common and pathological liar.
 
Those are the facts and ACTUAL DL employees like Dawg and Kev have confirmed the reduction, not some early out revenue management cubicle dweller who left DL over eight years ago.
 
You really need some professional help with your lies.
 
10% is less than 15%, it was a 33% reduction in payout.
 
How can you post this and believe what you post?
 
You have serious issues.

 

[WorldTraveler]

the only pathological liar is you who cannot admit that DL employees ended up with more profit sharing despite a reduction in the percentage.

Now, for the record, did DL employees see a larger percentage of profit sharing even after DL reduced the percentage?

How can you spend so much of your life arguing against pure and obvious facts just so you can continue down your campaign of attacking anyone that points out something that doesn't meet your narrative?

whether you can acknowledge it or not, DL employees received more profit sharing and more total compensation IN ALL WORKGROUPS despite the reduction in the profit sharing percentage.

 

[700UW]

You are beyond help

 

[WorldTraveler]

yes or no.

Did DL employees ACROSS THE BOARD receive higher profit sharing and higher total compensation despite the cut in profit sharing?

that is the only question you need to answer to determine who is telling the truth.

 

[Kev3188]

what is wrong is that DL non-contract did not receive ONLY a 10% raise and there was NO reduction in profit sharing.

That is because we helped generate record setting revenues, and hit the higher threshold.

DL non-contract employees received more than 10% and gave up no scope and also did not have terminated pension plans in BK.

You can't give up something that doesn't exist in the first place.

ALL DL employees had a reduction in the profit sharing calculation percentages but received higher profit sharing and total compensation as a result....

...of generating record setting revenue(s), not because of a unilateral change in a compensation policy.

until you acknowledge that the changes in profit sharing resulted in higher profit sharing and total compensation, you are manipulating the data to paint a story that isn't true.

Which-intentionally or not- is exactly what you've repeatedly done when discussing PS and total compensation.

 

[700UW]

Lets do a simple math lesson WT,
 
10% is <, >,or = to 15%?
 
Kevin, what were the non union raises from June 29, 2012 till December 31, 2014?

 

[WorldTraveler]

huh? you worked for free before? that is the only way you could have not received more than a 10% increase in base salaries ON TOP OF an increase in profit sharing despite the decrease in profit sharing percentage.

700 simply cannot bring himself to acknowledge that DL employees ended up with more money including more profit sharing despite the reduction in profit sharing percentage but he sure doesn't hesitate to call other people liars even though he is the one that presents incomplete and wrong "facts."

and I have freely acknowledged that DL employees are the best in the business and are running the best operation - and profit sharing is a huge motivation to do that.

but the financial results that have been posted for the big 4 shows that DL is quite simply kicking butt in the industry with revenue performance including knowing where to pull back in markets and where to grow and by how much.

Pilots frequently argue that it isn't their job to determined where DL flies - and they are right. But DL has some very, very good people who do figure that out and they are allowing DL to far outperform its peers in revenue performance - and that is a huge part of profit sharing as well.

It takes a team for DL to generate the finances as strong as it is doing.

Recognize that there are people who are making decisions at DL that you will never make and they are doing a very good job at it and you will receive the credit you are rightfully do for the quality of operation that DL is running and of which you and the pilots are a key part.

 

[700UW]

And you simply cant admit the Pilots made out way better than the non-union DL employees.
 
You cant admit 10% is less than 15%, by the way which was a 33% reduction in payout.
 
You cant admit non-union DL employees didnt receive a 20% raise from June 29, 2012 till December 31, 2014 like the pilots did.

 

[WorldTraveler]

I have never argued that the reduction in PS percentage took place.

I have noted and you have refused to acknowledge that it came with HIGHER profit sharing and higher total compensation.

yes or no. Did DL employees across the board see an INCREASE in profit sharing payouts even after the percentage change.

Yes or no question only.

I also have not tried to say that DL non-contract employees received 20%.

 

[Kev3188]

700 simply cannot bring himself to acknowledge that DL employees ended up with more money including more profit sharing despite the reduction in profit sharing percentage...

I have never seen you make that distinction, either.

And just to tie this even tangentially back into the original topic, the pilots- by virtue of enjoying representation- have the freedom to decide via vote on whether or not to accept such changes in compensation.