Dates set for ramp vote

[brokenwrench]

Congratulations! You have contributed to union rolls declining!

With all your chest thumping about unions I have no doubt that you did NOT cross any picket lines, have you? Say....back in 2005?

 

[Whipmaster]

You just don't get it, quit drinking the corporate america koolaid. 6.4% of what amount and take out your capital gains and taxes and you are left with 55% of that. BTW, I'm not bitching about that stacked vote and that the Union lost, just realistic about the truth of the situation.

From wikipedia

A capital gains tax (CGT) is a tax charged on capital gains, the profit realized on the sale of a non-inventory asset that was purchased at a lower price. The most common capital gains are realized from the sale of stocks, bonds, precious metals and property. Not all countries implement a capital gains tax and most have different rates of taxation for individuals and corporations.

Since the profit sharing is basically just an extra paycheck, capital gains is a non issue at this point.

 

[Kev3188]

While "capital gains" is the incorrect term in this case, the point that it's taxed at ~45% holds true.

 

[Whipmaster]

While "capital gains" is the incorrect term in this case, the point that it's taxed at ~45% holds true.

Generally, its 25% federal tax withholding and depending on what state you are in is about 8-10%. Thats around 35%. In my case, I live in a state were there is no state tax. (bonus for me) Unless you are an illegal alien working for cash only, you must pay this tax. Its taken out of everyones paycheck, its just a part of life. Even if you hit the lottery, you must pay! Put the blame where it belongs.

 

[Kev3188]

Generally, its 25% federal tax withholding and depending on what state you are in is about 8-10%. Thats around 35%. In my case, I live in a state were there is no state tax. (bonus for me) Unless you are an illegal alien working for cash only, you must pay this tax. Its taken out of everyones paycheck, its just a part of life. Even if you hit the lottery, you must pay! Put the blame where it belongs.

I'm not blaming anyone, just pointing out that the earlier point about supplemental income tax rates being high is accurate (certainly when compared to "regular" rates, anyway).

For our Exhibit J payout, mine wound up being ~40% total. Federal was 32.65%, State was 7.75%.

No state tax? Must be nice.

 

[metopower]

I'm not blaming anyone, just pointing out that the earlier point about supplemental income tax rates being high is accurate (certainly when compared to "regular" rates, anyway).

For our Exhibit J payout, mine wound up being ~40% total. Federal was 32.65%, State was 7.75%.

No state tax? Must be nice.

Kev...Do you get profit sharing by the same formula as Dl south ? Or is there a differrent formula for the Dl north union contract people. Also which was higher or were they basically the same. Thanks.

 

[Whipmaster]

I'm not blaming anyone, just pointing out that the earlier point about supplemental income tax rates being high is accurate (certainly when compared to "regular" rates, anyway).

For our Exhibit J payout, mine wound up being ~40% total. Federal was 32.65%, State was 7.75%.

No state tax? Must be nice.

the withholding rate is higher but when you file at the end of the year, generally you get a chunk of it back via a tax refund. so the profit sharing will pay off again slightly next year at tax time.

 

[Kev3188]

Kev...Do you get profit sharing by the same formula as Dl south ? Or is there a differrent formula for the Dl north union contract people. Also which was higher or were they basically the same. Thanks.

I'll be paid out according to the terms in the IAM contract. The plans are similar, but here's a couple of differences:

DL: Pays out at the first dollar of profit.
NW: Kicks in at the 1M mark

(note for the record, I consider this to be the same. It might not technically be accurate, but 1M divided by 70k employees is nominal. Just my opinion.)

DL: Pays 15% of eligible proifts on 1st 2.5B 20% thereafter.

NW: 10% if operating margin is 10% or less. 15% is greater than 10%. I honestly can't remember what the full year margin was for 2010.

According to DL, PMDL in ACS will receive a check equivalent to ~ 6.5% of their eligible earnings. PMNW will get ~3.2. Mine should be about $1300ish, pretax. Last go 'round I think mine was about 4%.

I was flamed off A.Net for suggesting it, but I still contend that ALL employees that worked the full year should see the total profit divided equally. That's a tangent for another day, though...

the withholding rate is higher but when you file at the end of the year, generally you get a chunk of it back via a tax refund. so the profit sharing will pay off again slightly next year at tax time.

(chuckle) I know man, I know... FlexSaver for day care is good for that too...

 

[WorldTraveler]

of course, tax rates are the same regardless of the source of income - so the goal should be to maximize the income knowing that the gov't will get its share one way or another.

Kev,
the real question I think would have been whether DL would have provided IAM and AFA employees with the PMDL profit sharing had those representation elections been resolved by the end of the year.
I have seen references that DL provided an IAM specific payout to PMNW rampers that was specified in the IAM contract... is that true?
If so, it would appear that DL did honor the IAM and AFA contracts even if some PMNW people received other types of payments which PMDL people did not receive. do you agree with that assessment?

I do hope the day comes soon when the abbreviations PMDL and PMNW are dropped and all DL employees ARE paid and treated equally.... at that point, the merger process will truly be complete.

 

[Kev3188]

I have seen references that DL provided an IAM specific payout to PMNW rampers that was specified in the IAM contract... is that true?

Yes.

If so, it would appear that DL did honor the IAM and AFA contracts even if some PMNW people received other types of payments which PMDL people did not receive. do you agree with that assessment?

I never said they didn't.

 

[WorldTraveler]

Glad to hear that the IAM payment was made - I think you had expressed concern about DL honoring it.

I see that UA has reported its profit sharing and that DL (including PMNW) people earned more profit sharing than than those at any other US airline.
I do hope the day comes soon when your desire to see equalty between PMDL and PMNW people happens - and those terms are used only to refer to heritage instead of differences in pay and benefits.

 

[metopower]

I'll be paid out according to the terms in the IAM contract. The plans are similar, but here's a couple of differences:

DL: Pays out at the first dollar of profit.
NW: Kicks in at the 1M mark

(note for the record, I consider this to be the same. It might not technically be accurate, but 1M divided by 70k employees is nominal. Just my opinion.)

DL: Pays 15% of eligible proifts on 1st 2.5B 20% thereafter.

NW: 10% if operating margin is 10% or less. 15% is greater than 10%. I honestly can't remember what the full year margin was for 2010.

According to DL, PMDL in ACS will receive a check equivalent to ~ 6.5% of their eligible earnings. PMNW will get ~3.2. Mine should be about $1300ish, pretax. Last go 'round I think mine was about 4%.

I was flamed off A.Net for suggesting it, but I still contend that ALL employees that worked the full year should see the total profit divided equally. That's a tangent for another day, though...

Thanks....Kev

 

[southwind]

I'll be paid out according to the terms in the IAM contract. The plans are similar, but here's a couple of differences:

DL: Pays out at the first dollar of profit.
NW: Kicks in at the 1M mark

(note for the record, I consider this to be the same. It might not technically be accurate, but 1M divided by 70k employees is nominal. Just my opinion.)

DL: Pays 15% of eligible proifts on 1st 2.5B 20% thereafter.

NW: 10% if operating margin is 10% or less. 15% is greater than 10%. I honestly can't remember what the full year margin was for 2010.

According to DL, PMDL in ACS will receive a check equivalent to ~ 6.5% of their eligible earnings. PMNW will get ~3.2. Mine should be about $1300ish, pretax. Last go 'round I think mine was about 4%.

I was flamed off A.Net for suggesting it, but I still contend that ALL employees that worked the full year should see the total profit divided equally. That's a tangent for another day, though...

(chuckle) I know man, I know... FlexSaver for day care is good for that too...

So an employee, who's been with the company for 1 month should receive the same amount as an employee who's been there 10 years ?

 

[Kev3188]

You might've missed the part where I said "employees that worked the full year."

My contention is that each of us (you in GSE, me in ACS, etc) all worked to make DL a success, and that any profit sharing should be shared equally, across all divisions, from top to bottom.

Whether you agree with that specifically or not, just be aware that the current distribution amongst groups (by that I mean ACS, RES, IFS, Pilots, merit, etc., and NOT PMNW vs PMDL) is inequitable.

 

[WorldTraveler]

the current distribution amongst groups (by that I mean ACS, RES, IFS, Pilots, merit, etc., and NOT PMNW vs PMDL) is inequitable.

Kevin,
forgive me for not understanding that you meant equity vertically within the organization rather than horizontally.

As I am sure you are aware, the "norm" for profit sharing within large companies or those with significant differences in salary between people in the organizatinon is to distribute profit sharing proportional to the payroll.....
but leadership is about not necessarily doing it the way it has always been done "just because" that is the way it has been done but rather to explore new models....my guess is that the primary pushback with your idea would come from the pilots since I believe the executives of the company are not covered under the same profit sharing program as frontline employees anyway.... although perhaps they should be....

in reality, your idea is more like the shared rewards or whatever DL calls the operational rewards which I believe all employees participate in equally, including the pilots. correct?

You should know that DL distributed more profit sharing that the combined (and larger) UA-CO which means DL employees collectively had the richest profit sharing in the US network industry.... I need to verify what WN paid....