Feb / Mar 2013 US Pilots Labor Discussion

[luvthe9]

Wow, in addition to knowing what's going to happen in the future, you can also read the minds of most of the West pilots.

Is there a neon "Psychic Readings" sign in your living room window?

No you idiot you talk in CLT at the Crown. Now run along Chippy is calling for you.

 

[luvthe9]

Nice job self eliminating the Nic. You just stepped on your cranks on the orders of your crack reps. You just got napalmed. I love the smell of napalm on the Nic

"It smells like VICTORY"

 

[Claxon]

I doubt you read the 9th's decision or comprehend the decision if you did. I'll go with the latter..

Dissent by Judge Bybee

I agree with the majority that this case would be ripe if​

USAPA and U.S. Air had entered into a CBA. That is not the question that this case presents. We are asked whether our Article III jurisdiction extends to a DFR claim based on a union “constitutionally committed,” Maj. Op. at 8001, to voiding a binding arbitration award and adopting a “date of hire” seniority principle that plainly favors one side of a merger. When the question is posed in this way, I believe the ripeness of the West Pilots’ claims becomes clear.​

We employ a two-part test to determine whether a claim is ripe for review, evaluating “(1) whether the issues are fit for judicial decision, and (2) whether the parties will suffer hardship if we decline to consider the issues.” San Diego County Gun Rights Comm. v. Reno, 98 F.3d 1121, 1132 (9th Cir.2006). The issues raised by the West Pilots’ DFR claim are straightforward, and the uncontested facts of this case make clear that the issues involved are fit for decision on this record.​

The West Pilots’ DFR theory does not depend on any contingen future events such as the memorialization of a finalized CBA or seniority integration agreement. The district court explained why the issues were fit for decision and the parties will suffer hardship if we decline to consider the issues: The issues fit for decision are these: Whether USAPA adopted and presented its seniority proposal without any legitimate union objective, solely to benefit East Pilots at the expense of West Pilots, and if so whether the West Pilots are entitled to damages and an injunction therefor . . . . USAPA concedes it will never bargain for implementation of the Nicolau Award. It is constitutionally hostile to doing so. The Airline has accepted the Nicolau Award, expressing no opposition to it, and the union has failed to show any legitimate reason (or plausible future reason) for abandoning it. Liability flows from the process and aims of USAPA’s seniority position. The outcome of negotiations is irrelevant. Without an injunction, USAPA’s seniority position inevitably impairs the collective bargaining process.​

For this same reason, denying judicial review would​

work a substantial hardship upon the parties, including the Airline . . . . In addition to depriving the West Pilots of legitimate representation, USAPA’s bargaining position leaves the Airline to decide between a lack of a single CBA and an unlawful single CBA.
(Emphasis added).

Recognition by the court:

1The dissent asserts that “nothing would be gained by postponing a decision, and the parties’ interest would be well served by a prompt resolution of the West Pilots’ claim.” Diss. op. at 8017 (internal alterations, quotation marks, and citation omitted). To be sure, the parties’ interest would be served by prompt resolution of the seniority dispute, but that is not the same as prompt resolution of the DFR claim. The present impasse, in fact, could well be prolonged by prematurely resolving the West Pilots’claim judicially at this point. Forced to bargain for the Nicolau Award, any contract USAPA could negotiate would undoubtedly be rejected by its membership. By deferring judicial intervention, we leave USAPA to bargain in good faith pursuant to its DFR, with the interests of all members— both East and West — in mind, under pain of an unquestionably ripe DFR suit, once a contract is ratified.​

Is USAPA bargaining in good faith? No.

Does USAPA bargain with my interests in mind? No

Keep heading the direction you are going, continue following the road signs which read DFR.

Dissenting opinions are like body parts, everyone has one and they all smell.

Brucia, the Continental now United pilot wrote a dissenting opinion as the ""pilot neutral"" in the US, America West seniority. In the CAL, UAL merger (he is on the CAL merger committee), I guarantee he will be a hypocrite. In the US, America West seniority Brucia was all longevity, in the UAL CAL he will be all slotting.

Brucia dissenting opinion, nicolau fiasco;;

"Captain Jim Brucia would have an informed opinion about this question. Captain Brucia wrote the "Concurring and Dissenting" opinion for the USAirways/Nicolau award. Here is a quote from his written opinion regarding this type of issue:

He says in part: "I do not agree with the Board's decision, in the particular circumstances of this case, to integrate only working pilots as of the date announcement, leaving all those on furlough at that date on the bottom of the combined seniority list. As a consequence of the Boards decision, America West pilot Odell, who was hired less than 2 months before the merger was announced, has been placed immediately senior to US Airways pilot Colello who was hired more than 16 years earlier and who had over 16 years of credited length of service. I disagree with this placement, which disregards Colello's substantial service time.(emphasis added)"

 

[Claxon]

I'm so glad that you are "supremely confident" of your position. If you are so sure, WYE do you keep posting it?

You were hired by america west because that was all you could get at the time, major airlines had standards which you could not meet. Your seniority will have to be earned, sucks for an under achiever, deal with it.

 

[luvthe9]

You were hired by america west because that was all you could get at the time, major airlines had standards which you could not meet. Your seniority will have to be earned, sucks for an under achiever, deal with it.

OUCH!!!!!!!!

 

[traderjake]

The NIC...Soon to be dead and gone, finally and forever.

..................................................................................................................................right after Kasher pays.

Sure, your imaginary friends know more about the consensus opinion of the West pilots than the West Reps.

 

[luvthe9]

..................................................................................................................................right after Kasher pays.

After your recall.

 

[Claxon]

MEC Chairman’s Message January 18, 2008
This is MEC Chairman Jack Stephan with a Chairman’s message to the pilots for Friday, January 18, 2008.
As you know, the US Airways MEC and America West MEC have appointed members of Steering Committees to address the major issues between us, including our issues with the Nicolau award. On January 11, 2008, all US Airways and America West pilots received a letter from ALPA President Captain John Prater, pledging his support and the support of the Association for the steering committee process. We have also received support from ALPA’s Executive Board, and this week, ALPA’s Executive Council is working on a resolution that would financially commit the Association to further funding this important work.
For the second week in a row, I have worked with the members of our Steering Committee who are charged with directing this process. These pilots have the responsibility of “exploring consensual approaches that promote mutual career protections and mutual success, as part of achieving acceptable collective bargaining outcomes that improve pay, benefits, work rules, and career security for both pilot groups.” Captain Prater also went on to write in his letter to us that in order to satisfy the requirements for membership ratification, “the proposed joint contract must address the concerns of both pilot groups.” Addressing the negative effects of the Nicolau Award and mitigating its damages is our concern.
The Three Man Steering Committee will be meeting next week with their AWA counterparts to determine if there is enough common ground to move forward to a “lock-down negotiating session.” If the discussions next week with the AWA pilots are successful, we would then agree to meet at a neutral location for a period of no less than 10 consecutive days to work through issues important to both pilots groups. I believe it is safe to say that implementing the Nicolau Award and contract advances are important to the AWA pilots. And we know that along with much-needed contractual advances, we need to address and resolve our issues with the negative effects of the Nicolau Award.
The success or failure of our endeavors will fall squarely on whether or not we can address the Nicolau Award in a manner that is acceptable to both pilot groups. We will find out in short order during our lock-down negotiations with AWA if such actions are possible. If they are, we will continue in this process that would also address all open outstanding JNC issues. The final product, if acceptable to both Steering Committees, would then be presented to each MEC for their approval and review. If both MECs are satisfied that the entire package adequately addresses the issues that are important to each, JNC negotiations would resume with management.
As you can see, there are a lot of “ifs” in this process. There are no guarantees here, just a commitment on the part of your MEC to engage in a process that might produce something that would be acceptable to you. If it is not, we are no worse for trying. If we fail in our efforts, both pilot groups will resort back to separate operations under their current contracts.
So that’s where we are right now. If our meeting next week is successful, the individuals participating in this process (right now, that is our Three Man Steering Committee—Garland Jones, Don Iorio and Rocco Spartano; our Merger Committee; our JNC, including Dean Colello; MEC Vice Chairman Kim Snider and myself) will pack our bags in preparation for the 10-day lock down negotiations with the West pilots. At the conclusion of that lock down, we will let you know whether or not there is anything for your MEC to consider and whether or not there is any chance that JNC negotiations would resume. Until then, all we ask is that you give this process every chance to succeed.
In the meantime, as always, fly safe, continue to look out for each other and thanks for listening.

 

[traderjake]

U.S. Trustee objects to merger proposal because of management compensation

http://aviationblog.dallasnews.com/2013/03/u-s-trustee-objects-to-merger-proposal-because-of-management-compensation.html/

AMR CEO Horton’s $20 Million Severance Draws Objection

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-03-15/amr-ceo-horton-s-20-million-severance-draws-objection-from-u-s-.html?cmpid=yhoo

 

[traderjake]

After your recall.

The Recall was a success, it ensured the MOU was put out for a vote.

 

[Claxon]

The Recall was a success, it ensured the MOU was put out for a vote.

News Release​

February 14, 2002​

America West Pilots Elect Union Leader, Prepare to Resume Contract Talks​

PHOENIX — With the election of a new chairman and the re-appointment of a negotiating committee, the pilots of America West, represented by the Air Line Pilots Association, International (ALPA), are set to resume mediated contract negotiations with the airline in March.
The America West pilots’ union governing body, the Master Executive Council (MEC), voted unanimously yesterday to elect Captain Herb Holland as the union’s new chairman. Holland replaces Captain Roger Cox, who was recalled from office by the MEC in January.
"I am honored to serve my fellow pilots as we resume negotiations for a fair contract with America West," Captain Holland said. "With the outstanding team we have in place and the support of all America West pilots behind us, we are ready to return to the table to achieve a working agreement that recognizes the sacrifices the pilots have made to help our airline survive and succeed."
Holland, a former Marine Corps pilot and Vietnam combat veteran, has been with America West since 1990. Holland previously served as the union’s Grievance Committee chairman.
In addition, the MEC appointed Captains Kimble Neel, Doug Dotter, and Jeff O’Connell and First Officer Russ Payne to the union’s Negotiating Committee. Captain John Chesire will serve as an alternate member of the committee.
Negotiations between the pilots and America West began in February 2000 and their current contract became amendable on May 1, 2000. Beginning in May 2001, talks were conducted under the auspices of a federally appointed mediator but were postponed after the Sept. 11 terrorist attacks.
Including the 1,800 America West pilots, ALPA represents 64,000 pilots at 45 airlines in the United States and Canada.

# # #​

ALPA Contact: Scott Sherrin, (602) 306-4100

 

[luvthe9]

The Recall was a success, it ensured the MOU was put out for a vote.

You are an idiot, we signed on for another bankruptcy deal, but hey, majority rules this is one lame weak ars pilot group and you are right up there with them. Can't wait for the 195 announcement.

 

[cleardirect]

No windfall? Really? Starting with the Nic is a west windfall. Your dream gives away all east attrition, Nice Try. I forgot, attrition isn't important because you have so little. And your #1 pilot belongs with the rest of 1983 hires, he needs 10 more years to be even close.

Step up.

How would you put together a fair and equitable seniority list? Keep in mind that usapa has a duty to represent ALL US Airways pilots fairly. DOH does not do that.

Show us how smart you are and create what you think is the list we can all live with.

If attrition is important. How would you protect it? Is that the only thing that is important? What are you willing to exchange for "your" attrition? You do understand that American pilots have about double the attrition right.

Dazzle us with your list.

 

[cleardirect]

AMERICAN is a legacy carrier DOH should prevail, why not?

The legacy carrier American does not want DOH. They know as well as the west what that does. Read the APA update. You ain't gettin DOH.

 

[traderjake]

No you idiot...

You are an idiot,...

I can't put my finger on it but I'm sensing less than your usual level of reverence and admiration tonight.