IAM FILES AT DELTA FOR UNION REPRESENTATION

[2BlacknBlue]

...and they are going to rapidly pass it on to the hardest working technicians

Gosh, this sounds like a good starting line of a new thread...



...insert next line here

Oooooo, can I, can I, can I.....

1o. "If you don't like it, you can leave."
9. "A union can't do nothin' for you."
8. "You all should go to school and further your education like Richard did. Then you can get stock like him."
7. "Look at your benefits and you don't even have to pay union dues."
6. "If you want a contract, then why don't you become a pilot?"
5. "Richard would never outsource the ramp work. RHS is just......there!"
4. "We have a strong stand-alone plan!"
3. "We have an open door policy."
2. "We have a direct relationship with management."

and coming in at number one....


1. "Look what happened to the Northwest mechanics."

 

[Delta Technician]

Oooooo, can I, can I, can I.....

1o. "If you don't like it, you can leave."
9. "A union can't do nothin' for you."
8. "You all should go to school and further your education like Richard did. Then you can get stock like him."
7. "Look at your benefits and you don't even have to pay union dues."
6. "If you want a contract, then why don't you become a pilot?"
5. "Richard would never outsource the ramp work. RHS is just......there!"
4. "We have a strong stand-alone plan!"
3. "We have an open door policy."
2. "We have a direct relationship with management."

and coming in at number one....


1. "Look what happened to the Northwest mechanics."

So roll the dice and vote union. #5 will most likely happen.

 

[2BlacknBlue]

So roll the dice and vote union. #5 will most likely happen.

It's just my opinion but if they don't get a union in there, all that will be left is DTW and MSP.

BTW-Richard said:

"Rest assured we will vigorously defend our employees’ right to choose whether to have union representation and work to ensure we are using a process that is legitimate and fair,â€￾ Richard said.

Are you saying you feel Richard's not telling the truth??

 

[Kev3188]

So roll the dice and vote union. #5 will most likely happen.

Wait, what?!


That runs counter to this blurb on DLNet:

"Currently, Delta has committed to keeping ramps in cities where Delta and/or Northwest currently have ramp locations."

Surely, they wouldn't try and blackmail the workforce; especially since that violates carrier interference rules.

 

[Delta Technician]

It's just my opinion but if they don't get a union in there, all that will be left is DTW and MSP.

BTW-Richard said:

"Rest assured we will vigorously defend our employees’ right to choose whether to have union representation and work to ensure we are using a process that is legitimate and fair,â€￾ Richard said.

Are you saying you feel Richard's not telling the truth??

Richard is telling the truth. It is the law to allow union representation. If you choose that route though he will contract out all ramp work. He will reject any bargaining by the union that will cause Delta to lose money (the company will allow due process). He and the board will say walk. Delta will replace you. It happened with NWA mechanics. It may cost Delta in the short term but it will work out. Do the history lesson with NWA mechanics. Go ahead, roll the dice. Won't matter to me.

 

[Kev3188]

Waste your time away from your family. Do it for free as you want to make us think. You will have wished you had done it for enough money to get you through the unemployment period. Your group has no bargaining power at this time.

My family is right here w/me. Also, I hate to break it to you, but the boring truth is that the only check I get is from NWA. Since you're so convinced that's not the case, let's see some proof.

What makes you think ramp service stays w/o representation? Faith in the CLT? Anderson's word?

The entire system will be "RHS'ed" in a heartbeat. People have nothing to lose.

I've been planning for the possibility of being unemployed for several years now. I have more than enough saved to get me through to my next job.

 

[2BlacknBlue]

If you choose that route though he will contract out all ramp work. He will reject any bargaining by the union that will cause Delta to lose money

C'mon man. They hadn't made a shiny nickel to pay investors back since 2000 and the ramp wasn't union. Delta will lose money regardless, ie fuel hedges, etc. Not sure whether you're up to date or not but it has become fashionable for a company to report loss after loss, thus continuing to pay the employees as little as possible....and it will continue.

I'd also like to know where I can locate the literature you're reading. Richard firmly denies he had anything to do with that 2005 NW debacle. He states that he had left for United Healthcare prior to NW request to outsource to foreign nationals also.

 

[SkyguyB727]

A unionized work environment is not a bad thing. In the '90s, I was making $5.00 per hour in the non-union environment at the wholly owned regional of a mAAjor carrier (when McDonald's was starting at $7.00 per hour). I left to do similar work in the unionized environment at a major, international airline. Overnight, my pay went from $5.00 per hour to $10.22 per hour. Tell me why the union is bad.

Also in the '90s in the non-union environment of a regional airline I'll call "Calm Air", prospective employees were shown a list (not to keep, of course) of wonderful benefits they would receive (e.g. passes, health insurance, dental insurance, etc). After the people had accepted employment and quit other jobs to do so, they were told that they wouldn't receive any of the benefits they were promised at the interview. They would receive $5.00 per hour, split shifts, and split days off if they were lucky enough to have two days off. There were no benefits of any kind other than passes only on the very limited route structure of "Calm Air." Employees were not even allowed to pay 100% of the premium to have health insurance. The company president's rationale for that was "only people who planned to use the insurance would buy it." The promise of benefits was just a ruse to get people to take the job. The same airline also refused to provide hearing protection to its ramp staff. The company's management claimed the ramp was not a high noise work environment. Tell me again why a union is bad.

 

[Kev3188]

I say let 'er rip...

Maybe then we can have DGS people pissing in airplanes all over the system.


You stay classy vendors!

 

[john john]

QUOTE (john john @ Sep 22 2009, 06:24 AM)
DL NW UA US don't have a defined pension plan

Sure they do and they are still paying into it, millions and millions into it. Once you see it fully funded though this company will start to make tons of money.

I wasn’t aware that all Delta/Northwest non-management and lower level management had a true define pension plan that is still increasing with employee’s longevity

 

[fudgerunyard]

Sure they do and they are still paying into it, millions and millions into it. Once you see it fully funded though this company will start to make tons of money.

Actually, DAL's pension obligations are only 46% funded as of 2008. DAL pensions of course were frozen in 2005 (or was it 2003?)if i'm not mistaken, and were replaced with a "lump sum" account, which itself was frozen after only 1 year. The major airlines lobbied Congress to enable the airlines to stretch out their underfunded pension liabilities, and were successful in doing so. DAL, and as far as i know, other major carriers were given a full 20 years to fully fund their pensions.

 

[WorldTraveler]

There are no active defined benefit pension plans at DL or NW. The Federal law that was passed that allowed airlines to push out their pension obligations also required those airlines to freeze their defined pension plans. US and UA do not have active defined benefit pension plans and most of the latter two carriers' plans were terminated. DL and NW have FROZEN plans - except for the DL pilots meaning there is no further accrual of benefits whether for age or seniority. What employees have in that benefit plan is what they had as of the day the plan was frozen; DL now is responsible for funding the plans. UA and US have TERMINATED plans meaning the PBGC is now responsible for the plans in their entirety.
AA and CO did not participate in the legislation to push back their pension deferrals but have repeatedly asked for legislative consideration so they could be in the same boat as the other network carriers.

Kev,
you won't be laid off. Glad the savings are there but you won't be needing them unless you want to leave DL/NW. There are more important things for you to use that money for

 

[700UW]

Your info is wrong, the law did not require them to freeze the DBPs to stretch out the payments. It required it to be frozen but future increases could be applied so technically it was not frozen.

Your wrong about US, the Mechanic and Related and Fleet Service are both participants in the IAM National Pension Plan, which is a Defined Benefit Plan where the company pays into the Plan for each member. And M&R also have a Defined Contribution Plan.

And UAL Ramp I believe is also in the IAMNPP.

Go check your facts before posting incorrect information.

Fleets plan was frozen years ago, and both plans were terminated in the last bankruptcy, but Fleet since 02 and M&R since 07 have been in the IAMNPP.

 

[WorldTraveler]

I'm sorry but the pension plans are indeed frozen. There are no benefits that are being accrued beyond the date of the freeze at any airline. Whether you want to call it frozen or not does change the fact that no future benefits are being accrued.

And all of the pension plans you posted are not controlled by the airlines at all. They are controlled by unions. The uinions were not required to freeze their plans because they weren't on the verge of fililng for BK. There are no company controlled pension plans at UA, US, DL, or NW.

 

[700UW]

Read the law, it has future increases which still accrue for future benefits.

Wrong again, the IAMNPP is maintained independent of the union, it is made up of trustee appointed by the board which is made up of half appointed from the union and half appointed from the companies that participate.

Google IAM National Pension Plan and you will see its web page.

You make this too easy, like I said, educate yourself, they are defined benefit plans, and yes at US the company controls the DCP plan that was put in place after chapter 11 #2.


And NW participates in it also.