IAM Fleet Service topic

[necigrad]

So reading the past two weeks of posts had reminded me of why I could never be any higher a union official then Shop Steward; I can't sell steaming piles. That's right, I've seen mass quantities of brown matter flying around this thread, and it disgusts me. The sad thing is, I'm not sure why. It's either because the BS is so depressing or the fact that there is actually some good in unions. It's one or the other, I'm just not sure which.

 

[Jester]

Before any CBA is presented to the company a lawyer does review it, as a matter of fact the offer we gave the company for M&R during bankruptcy was typed up by the lawyer in his office after reviewing it all.

Then why is our CBA so jacked?! Basically a blank check on an Attendance Policy given to the Company and more gray areas than an old B&W TV!

And the IAM doesnt have an MEC, never has never will, where are you pulling that from?

Then who were the clowns on the front cover of the four-color fish wrapper a few years ago who boasted about their executive experience earned by means of fixing pay phones and changing tires?

Maybe you need to educate yourself on the structure of the IAM.

So did I use the wrong phrase or term to describe your Grand Poobah organization as to who are "The Big Dogs"... "The Masters of Disasters"... "The Big Kahunas"... "The Top Bananas"... and that somehow discredits my general complaint about the glaring lack of achievement by this leadership???

You won't need a life vest in that intellectual pool of shallowness.

So Condemns Jester.

 

[Tim Nelson]

Before any CBA is presented to the company a lawyer does review it, as a matter of fact the offer we gave the company for M&R during bankruptcy was typed up by the lawyer in his office after reviewing it all.

And the IAM doesnt have an MEC, never has never will, where are you pulling that from?

Maybe you need to educate yourself on the structure of the IAM.

700, I would be interested in your take of those 1113 letters. I was a Local Chairman and went to a meeting in PIT and we were told by those 'outside' attorneys and the negotiations committee, including Canale, that those 1113 letters prevented management from coming back for any more concessions. I instructed the Negotiations committee, the attorney and Canale that they were full of crap and should quit lying. Tony A flipped out and said I was out of line, but I wasn't. Those 1113 were a scam, just like when they told us that the IAM Pension had a future defined benefit that was 'guaranteed'. I still have that flyer from during the TWU/IAM mini organizing campaign.

Since you were on the MX negotiations committee, please tell me that you didn't come back and blow the same smoke up your members collective arses and tell them that the 1113's were golden. Were you educated enough yourself [outside of labor classes from the kool aid school] to be able to understand that the 1113's weren't worth the paper they were printed on?

Collective Bargaining Agents and management count on ignorance. And they need to hope Delaney gets back in so the status quo can continue.

regards,

 

[700UW]

The issue with the 1113 letters were with the first chapter 11, I was not on the NC at that time, we never had an issue with it in the 2nd chapter 11 as we knew they werent worth the paper they were written on.

We as a committee couldnt even come to a consensus on a recommendation, I held votes in ATL and CLT and when I was asked I said I am voting "NO" and thats what I did.

The International handcuffed us at every opportunity. Myself and others had a big issue with this, like the Intl all ready had a side deal in what was going to happen and didnt inform us.

 

[ograc]

The issue with the 1113 letters were with the first chapter 11, I was not on the NC at that time, we never had an issue with it in the 2nd chapter 11 as we knew they werent worth the paper they were written on.

We as a committee couldnt even come to a consensus on a recommendation, I held votes in ATL and CLT and when I was asked I said I am voting "NO" and thats what I did.

The International handcuffed us at every opportunity. Myself and others had a big issue with this, like the Intl all ready had a side deal in what was going to happen and didnt inform us.

This issue should be kept in mind by all members regarding contract negotiations or District Officer elections. I believe all Districts within the IAM, are under the International's control. Contracts, District By Laws etc... are all subject to the oversight and approval of The Grand Lodge (the International). Contract Negotiating Teams and all District Officers, including Presidents, answer to the International. The IAM Constitution seems to supercede any proposed changes to District By Laws that may be in conflict with the Constitution. Proposed changes to the Constitution must be approved by the Delegates at the IAM Convention. Please correct me if I am wrong. I don't proclaim to be an expert.
ograc

 

[700UW]

The international was the main problem, not the district.

 

[niblet]

The international was the main problem, not the district.

I agree that the International is a problem. Thats where the dues structure is broken. The per capita tax is the weighted average of all the members. The airline division average wage is much lower than the per capita tax. Thus the 55 plus dues. As for the 1113c bankruptcy rule. I remember being told that meant the judge could abrigate the contract.

 

[ograc]

The international was the main problem, not the district.

700UW,
My point exactly. We should not blame our district officers or negotiating committees, who are "handcuffed" by the internatoinal's constitution or agendas. Maybe the change of direction needs to start at the top. Just throwin it out there for consideration.
ograc

 

[ograc]

I agree that the International is a problem. Thats where the dues structure is broken. The per capita tax is the weighted average of all the members. The airline division average wage is much lower than the per capita tax. Thus the 55 plus dues. As for the 1113c bankruptcy rule. I remember being told that meant the judge could abrigate the contract.

I agree the International is a problem. Perhaps the main problem within the airline division. It's hard to sell a dues increase to a membership that has experienced nothing more than concessions, give backs, grievance procedure inefficiencies and sub contracting language in our CBA that has cost hundreds of Fleet Service jobs. Not to mention the countless members who were forced to either uproot their families or commute to another city in order to maintain their employment. We've got a huge problem. A problem, that I believe does not rest, or can be resolved, on a District level.
ograc

 

[700UW]

Its not the constitution, its the people in positions of power at the international and the district.. I know first hand.

 

[niblet]

I agree the International is a problem. Perhaps the main problem within the airline division. It's hard to sell a dues increase to a membership that has experienced nothing more than concessions, give backs, grievance procedure inefficiencies and sub contracting language in our CBA that has cost hundreds of Fleet Service jobs. Not to mention the countless members who were forced to either uproot their families or commute to another city in order to maintain their employment. We've got a huge problem. A problem, that I believe does not rest, or can be resolved, on a District level.
ograc

The District negotiates the contract. Then the membership votes on it. We are to blame for the mess and the District for crap we voted on. I dont think the International had anything to do with our contract. The international drives the dues. If they have the stronghold over the district then that needs fixed. But i've never heard any District official cry foul about the International. The airline Locals are the ones who are left holding the bag. They decide the dues rate based on per capita tax for the International. 30.73 is the tax. The districts per capita's vary depending on the district. They range from 18.00 and up. Then the Local decides how much it will take to survive. Its tough to fix the International from the Local level. The districts would have a much greater power to force change. Change also has to start somewhere.

 

[ograc]

Its not the constitution, its the people in positions of power at the international and the district.. I know first hand.

700UW,
Would you agree then a "whole house" cleaning is in order. From the ranks of the International on down to the District level? If this is indeed what needs to occur where do we begin with such an apathetic membership? If we cannot engage the membership to buy into such change we are destined for the same representation in the future. It won't matter who obtains District office. They will hit the same wall.
ograc

 

[Jester]

700UW,
Would you agree then a "whole house" cleaning is in order. From the ranks of the International on down to the District level? If this is indeed what needs to occur where do we begin with such an apathetic membership? If we cannot engage the membership to buy into such change we are destined for the same representation in the future. It won't matter who obtains District office. They will hit the same wall.
ograc

ograc,

I know you are new to the Board, but some would no more support a broad broom to sweep away the deadwood and hangers-on, than they would sell their first born... in fact, between the two, I would need to ask their first born which would be more important. It is their life... their religion... their creed... their moral code... it is their passion... it is their very being. It an organization which is beyond reproach and nary an unkind word will cross their lips. Some have not worked for the airline or been a working member of the IAM in nearly a decade, and like any true believer, they spend time opining on issues which affect them not.

Instead the blame will be placed before the membership for refusing to worship the Gods of clay feet, and the membership's unwillingness to blind obedience for "the cause" while invoking the early days of labor activists and movements. We will be rebuked for refusing to hold those ideals with that same sense of piety.

If you want objectivity, you need to understand who is posting.

So Advises Jester.

 

[Dog Wonder]

Stereotypes aside, the vast majority of the membership are workers. They know who the workers, and the players, are.

They don't want the aggravation of fighting the company so they leave it to others.

Who are, in many cases, players instead of workers.

 

[ograc]

The District negotiates the contract. Then the membership votes on it. We are to blame for the mess and the District for crap we voted on. I dont think the International had anything to do with our contract. The international drives the dues. If they have the stronghold over the district then that needs fixed. But i've never heard any District official cry foul about the International. The airline Locals are the ones who are left holding the bag. They decide the dues rate based on per capita tax for the International. 30.73 is the tax. The districts per capita's vary depending on the district. They range from 18.00 and up. Then the Local decides how much it will take to survive. Its tough to fix the International from the Local level. The districts would have a much greater power to force change. Change also has to start somewhere.

niblet,
If a change in course is needed where do you suggest we begin? As Jester stated I am, in fact, new to the board and still in a learning curve so to speak.
ograc