Industrial vs. Craft

[700UW]

He worked for AA from 1959 to 1965, thats six years.

Have a comprehension problem?

The facts are he hadnt turned a wrench nor worked for an airline since 1965, but yet one of your AMFA supporters said every leader is a current Airline A&P.

So I bet he didnt even have a license anymore.

And when you own the board, you can tell people what to do.

 

[700UW]

The man is retired and living in an assisted living center, Louie Key and Floyd Looney are now the National and Assistant National Directors respectively

By the way, has James C Little, James P Hoffa, R. Thomas Buffenbarger held a License or turned a wrench on an Aircraft recently? What difference does it make when viewing a comparison ?

Oh wait, maybe we should make this an issue because,
I know the the current leaders of AMFA are not only licensed but also current.

Buffenbarger built Jet Engines for GE in Ohio, and no one ever claimed he had an A&P or worked for an airline, like your AMFA people claimed about its leaders.

 

[aapitbull]

Don so you think telling people to shut up is going to help get AMFA in at AA B)
next you will be calling people a cave man, that worked out great for Luis.
AC Tynker is right I am soooo sick of the turmoil.

Dan, I am simply getting tired of this guy finding some fact he thinks is important coming in here and trolling for someone to answer him so he can try to spring something on them, he does not know what he is talking about he cannot even read his on post and see it say AMFA start in 1962 so yes I answered him knowing it was a set up and baited him by telling him to shut up he sprung what he thought was going to suprise me and I slammed is ass and told him to shut up again. the fact is if you have something you think is important post it out here and make your point do not be trying to play gotcha with me.

I have not disrespected you or AC and believe me it would not be hard to do but if this guy wants to play then game on.

 

[aapitbull]

He worked for AA from 1959 to 1965, thats six years.

Have a comprehension problem?

The facts are he hadnt turned a wrench nor worked for an airline since 1965, but yet one of your AMFA supporters said every leader is a current Airline A&P.

So I bet he didnt even have a license anymore.

And when you own the board, you can tell people what to do.

Your post clearly said he worked at AA for 3 year before he and his friends started AMFA that would have been 1962 just as I said from 1962 to late 1964 when they organized Ozark would have been the 2 years he worked at AA while leading AMFA are we clear now?

Finally you have no idea what he was or was not doing on the side that could have kept his A&P current the fact remains that every man to hold the National Director postion was a A&P period.

By the way he is a Charles Taylor award recipient for more than 50 years of distinguished service in aviation do any of the leaders of the IAM/TWU/IBT hold that award?

 

[aapitbull]

Yes let's just let the AMFA guys talk, everyone else shut up & let them go on and on, 12 months from now we will still have TWU with our divide & we can have some peace & quiet for another 10 years or so hopefully.

Do not preach at me about who is talking in less than 2 months you have surpassed my total number of post over the last over the last 91/2 years you have been giving your say.

 

[Raptorman49]

Do not preach at me about who is talking in less than 2 months you have surpassed my total number of post over the last over the last 91/2 years you have been giving your say.

That was in reply to the telling people to shut up thing, yes we all should have our say & be able to vent some because we are all frustrated at the state of things right now, I do think we should try to stay professional though & not make it personal & I don't agree with berating Delle, he's retired & should be left alone.

 

[Anomaly]

Yes let's just let the AMFA guys talk, everyone else shut up & let them go on and on, 12 months from now we will still have TWU with our divide & we can have some peace & quiet for another 10 years or so hopefully.

How I wish this were true Raptorman. These guys never go away and the fighting and turmoil always persists. We still have our crowd here at United that refuse to let things lie, and they keep the workplace in a constant state of frustration. While they get very little traction and we are all tired of hearing them squawk, they never stop. Regardless of what happens, I hope you can get at least 10 years of peace, but I have my doubts.

 

[TWU informer]

Buffenbarger built Jet Engines for GE in Ohio, and no one ever claimed he had an A&P or worked for an airline, like your AMFA people claimed about its leaders.

The AMFA leaders do have their A&P, but if your leaders do not, what the hell do you make an issue of it for?

 

[TWU informer]

How I wish this were true Raptorman. These guys never go away and the fighting and turmoil always persists. We still have our crowd here at United that refuse to let things lie, and they keep the workplace in a constant state of frustration. While they get very little traction and we are all tired of hearing them squawk, they never stop. Regardless of what happens, I hope you can get at least 10 years of peace, but I have my doubts.

Giving up on an ideal situation where your entire union is about the profession, ran by those in the profession, will never go away.
And I can assure that a real craft unionist will never be happy in your peice of crap industrial unions. And Thank God for now they don't have to be silent. Almost like your AFL-CIO advertisements dragging Polltical Figures through the mud will never stop.

You are likely unskilled or appointed and will never give up on riding the backs of the skilled, so I guess it is even.

The debate of craft unions vs industrial unions has gone on for 100's of years, and as the ecomonic pressures on the middle class grow, because the AFL-CIO experience of steal money and accomplish nothing fails us all, then the debate will only get more intense and possibly even violent in some circles. The skilled will not be taxed to death to pa for the lazy anymore than they will have their pay and benefits taken to keep jobs for the unskilled above market rates. You can count on that until you die and beyond.

 

[Anomaly]

TWU-Bus driver Union Teamsters-Truck Driver Union AMFA-AMT Union I made it easy to understand !

TWU- Successful Transportation Union Teamsters- Successful Overall Union AMFA- Failed AMT Association

Now it is clear....

 

[Realityck]

Didn’t the Seham’s represent American’s Allied Pilots Association at one time and get fired by the Pilots Union?

 

[TWU informer]

TWU- Successful Transportation Union Teamsters- Successful Overall Union AMFA- Failed AMT Association

Now it is clear....

Yeah here is a chart showing that success alright. The AFL-CIO since 1955 has done nothing but destroy organizied labor and the middle class. It should be noted that every chart available shows the decimation began in 1955 when the industrial unions and craft union combined into the AFL-CIO. That is not just by coincidence either. How the hell, can anyone with half of a brain claim success. You are a brain washed idiot.

Just like the other Industrial Union Lies, the facts fall short of the claims of success.
Doesn't matter how it is charted, graphed, or meassured, the AFL-CIO and all of their unions are failing miserably.

AFL-CIO Annual Membership Report Reveals Weakened Movement

4/16/12

The AFL-CIO released its annual membership report at its Executive Council Meeting in March, and for leaders of the organization it must make for grim reading. The report points out that the AFL-CIO lost more than 100,000 members in 2011 — roughly a 1.2% drop that jibes with the overall decline of union membership nationally according to the Department of Labor’s Bureau of Labor Statistics. This drop brings the overall membership of the federation to 8,455,042.

This comes on the heels of a less than stellar 2010 membership report. In that report, the AFL-CIO tried to put a happy face on the numbers by asserting a net increase in membership of 45,668. However, this was primarily due to the return of 222,098 members of the Laborers International Union of America (LIUNA), which had withdrawn from the AFL-CIO back in 2006 to join the rival Change to Win Federation.

Without the LIUNA addition to hide behind this year, the AFL-CIO’s net membership decrease amounted to 101,021— resulting in a 34% decline since its peak 35 years ago. Indeed, a closer look at the affiliates reveals that of the 56 unions that comprise the AFL-CIO, only 14 showed positive growth, while 28 declined in membership and the remaining 14 showed no net change.

The most notable growth in this year’s report came from LIUNA, which added 35,552 members to its ranks, making it quite an outlier among the unions. In addition, the American Federation of Government Employees (AFGE) added 9,917 to its rosters, growing from 258,083 to 268,000, while the Boilermakers went up by 7,821 members and the United Auto Workers increased by 5,401. All told the remaining unions that grew added just 21,735 members among them. Put another way, these AFL-CIO unions added 78,363 members to their rolls, while the rest of the AFL-CIO lost 181,477 members, a loss-to-gain ratio of over 2:1.

It is no secret that the union movement in America has been facing a membership decline for several decades, which the Bureau of Labor Statistics reports each year. The AFL-CIO’s membership report confirms this observation, and is illustrative of why organized labor is so eager to have the government change regulations to make organizing easier.

 

[Anomaly]

Here is a good video highlighting the work done by Seeham and Seeham. They bill by the hour....

 

[OldGuy@AA]

I pray if you ever run for elected office again in whatever Union we may have that your only votes come from the same people that supported you last time you ran without campaigning so you say and I think we may know who they were. (AMFA Supporters) Your double standards, inability to take any suggestions on what a true Leader really is and all that you display daily here I believe has been proof positive having your ideals of what is best for our Craft would only hinder any kind of progression of gaining the respect that an AMT should have. In layman terms the way you flip flop and go from good cop to bad cop and every other analogy one could think of would make our worth as aircraft maintenance professionals null and void I do believe. I do believe there is worth beyond words for what we do keeping birds in the air at a standard unmatched elsewhere around the world in my opinion. To have someone such as yourself trying to stand behind a Craft Union and use it in my opinion to make yourself finally be somebody in life is thankfully transparent with your feeble use the browbeating tactics in text. I guess what I am trying to say is I would genuinely take an Industrial Union over what You make a Craft Union any day and I believe there are many more like me such as Raptorman. I believe he is strong in his convictions and fed up with all the turmoil we have endured through the years and to try and make a mockery of that fact helps the open minded understand what I described in the beginning of this post.

Not fair AC. If Informer is not leading then what is he doing? The rest of us complain about how we are screwed in a union that looks out for everyone but mechanics but Informer has spent a lot of time and a lot of his own money to try to bring about change and make it better for us all. He doesn't expect everyone to agree with everything he believes, but is willing to debate the points. He has been insulted and threatened on this board for giving his opinions. He is also readily available to anyone at any time to meet face to face. How many of us are that dedicated to any cause? In my opinion he is trying hard to be a leader and believes his way is better than any other option at this time. I ask everyone to put differences aside and think about what we are up against in this struggle. The truth is that we have not had any leadership here in Tulsa and Informer is willing to be the face of the cause. I have disagreed with him in the past but we have put those differences aside for the good of us all. I think this is a sign of a good leader. I respect this man for his courage and his integrity. He will not compromise his beliefs, unlike those who have sold their souls to the international.

 

[TWU informer]

Here is a good video highlighting the work done by Seeham and Seeham. They bill by the hour....

Do you have anything to offer besides FEAR and SMEAR?
Anything?

Like the membership involved in ALL of those carriers and issues got no vote, and the Law Firm is responsible.

At least we see that the ATTACK ad ideals that litter our political system is alive and well here.

Want to know why the public hates unions, want to know why union members are apathetic?
Look no further than that which you posted as a tool to bolster your position.

And we have the moral police on this board wearing Teamsters buttons to work, and they are silent on this type of posting.

Lee Seham has surely made mistakes in his career, but I have no doubt that he is a better than most of you that drag his name through the mud for political gain and don't even know the man.

Thanks for the post, I am now motivated more than ever, to continue to rid ourselves of this filth and disgust that you all call unionism.