JCBA Negotiations and updates for AA AMTS

[Matt1200]

You must be TWU, I have heard nothing but complaining since the merger. Both unions are a disgrace! What are you willing to do to get yours????

 

[dfw gen]

Ignore him he's just a bater, think he's a master at it.
He shows up tries to stir it up then moves on .

 

[Matt1200]

Ignore him he's just a bater, think he's a master at it.
He shows up tries to stir it up then moves on .

Thx

 

[WeAAsles]

You must be TWU, I have heard nothing but complaining since the merger. Both unions are a disgrace! What are you willing to do to get yours????

I don't care what you think. I was just trying to explain the 4% to you because you were confused and incorrect about it.

If you want to continue on being mathematicaly foolish that's not any of my concern.

 

[WeAAsles]

Ignore him he's just a bater, think he's a master at it.
He shows up tries to stir it up then moves on .

Don't care about any of that foolishness any more. If you aren't at least at the moment satisfied with your raises then satisfying you is impossible and not worth anyone's effort.

Especially not mine.

 

[dfw gen]

You come off as a condescending fool.don't waste your time with us go pollute the fleet circus thread.

 

[WeAAsles]

You come off as a condescending fool.don't waste your time with us go pollute the fleet circus thread.

Ok maybe using the "Oh Boy" to respond to the guy about the 4% was admittedly condescending.

I was being presumptuous to think that everyone would have understood it by now was all.

And I'll never consider you a waste of time. It's the Humanist in me that says everyone has the propensity to learn.

So I will continue to drop in from time to time.

 

[OldGuy@AA]

Ok maybe using the "Oh Boy" to respond to the guy about the 4% was admittedly condescending.

I was being presumptuous to think that everyone would have understood it by now was all.

And I'll never consider you a waste of time. It's the Humanist in me that says everyone has the propensity to learn.

So I will continue to drop in from time to time.

Weaasles your analogy is not correct. In reality we were promised Delta plus 7. The pilots got it and the FAs got it. What we got (we were told) was Delta plus 3. The explanation was that we were now going to get profit sharing so we woudn't get the extra 4% everyone else got. Knowing that the pilots (Who will get much more PS than we do) and the FAs (Who will probably get more too) are also going receive profit sharing but didn't have to give back the extra 4% that makes our "Whole Pie" missing 4%. If you consider 96% of a pie as whole then you might want to re-evaluate your point. Of course I suspect your intent was to stir the pot and not to be accurate. Slow day?

 

[WeAAsles]

Weaasles your analogy is not correct. In reality we were promised Delta plus 7. The pilots got it and the FAs got it. What we got (we were told) was Delta plus 3. The explanation was that we were now going to get profit sharing so we woudn't get the extra 4% everyone else got. Knowing that the pilots (Who will get much more PS than we do) and the FAs (Who will probably get more too) are also going receive profit sharing but didn't have to give back the extra 4% that makes our "Whole Pie" missing 4%. If you consider 96% of a pie as whole then you might want to re-evaluate your point. Of course I suspect your intent was to stir the pot and not to be accurate. Slow day?

Old Guy I SWEAR I'm not looking to stir the pot. And I apologize for the "Oh Boy"

Think back to when and why that 4% was given to the FA's and the Agents who already had JCBA's. It was because Delta had announced a leap over them and Parker leaped over that. The original 4% for us disappeared when Delta went above us and then UAL went above that (For Fleet)

I went up 1% over UAL and you went up 1% over Delta. Again seriously the 4% was absorbed back in the distance.

Now when you get a JCBA they will either compare you again to Delta or UAL whichever is higher. Both groups at UAL now have contracts to gauge that off of.

Question to you guys? Come April who's rates will be higher for Maintenance? Delta or UAL.

BTW I hope you have noticed the Pilots complaining about being stuck in 4th place now?

 

[WeAAsles]

BTW Old Guy the FA's may get more PS than you this year since they got their raises a while back? But I'd still tend to doubt it actually.

On a yearly basis against you I'm sure they were still making less than you were last year if you factor in average Flight Hours flown.

You absolutely will make more than them next year as you definitely should.

The pecking order for wages will be considering non management of course Pilots first, Mechanics second, Fleet, FA's and PSA third and Support Staff last.

Of course this is for the top paid in all those groups.

 

[WeAAsles]

Weaasles your analogy is not correct. In reality we were promised Delta plus 7. The pilots got it and the FAs got it. What we got (we were told) was Delta plus 3. The explanation was that we were now going to get profit sharing so we woudn't get the extra 4% everyone else got. Knowing that the pilots (Who will get much more PS than we do) and the FAs (Who will probably get more too) are also going receive profit sharing but didn't have to give back the extra 4% that makes our "Whole Pie" missing 4%. If you consider 96% of a pie as whole then you might want to re-evaluate your point. Of course I suspect your intent was to stir the pot and not to be accurate. Slow day?

One more time on this. Yes it's a different scenario than the one I think the guy was talking about but you are correct about that drop down of 7% above the top because of the now added PS.

And since we have exactly 1/2 in PS what the other airlines provide I do think the 3% line should actually be 3.5% just to quibble.

Unless of course and I'd love to see an accounting of it in the end. We have more items in our CBA that add up above our peers?

Bill Swelbar I believe is back doing the updates on the Airline Data Project page since it wasn't being done for the last few years when he took another job and left it behind.

I'm glad to see those numbers again.

 

[bigjets]

Old Guy I SWEAR I'm not looking to stir the pot. And I apologize for the "Oh Boy"

Think back to when and why that 4% was given to the FA's and the Agents who already had JCBA's. It was because Delta had announced a leap over them and Parker leaped over that. The original 4% for us disappeared when Delta went above us and then UAL went above that (For Fleet)

I went up 1% over UAL and you went up 1% over Delta. Again seriously the 4% was absorbed back in the distance.

Now when you get a JCBA they will either compare you again to Delta or UAL whichever is higher. Both groups at UAL now have contracts to gauge that off of.

Question to you guys? Come April who's rates will be higher for Maintenance? Delta or UAL.

BTW I hope you have noticed the Pilots complaining about being stuck in 4th place now?

We did get that 4% raise in August (nov 5) we just got the 4% raise a year after everybody else. Thank you Doug and Delta management.

Contract Rumor
Contention points are vacation, we get 5 and UAL 7, and how OT is called. Management doesn't want to run OT list.

Management got everything they wanted out of our contract in 2003 and then picked it dry in 2012, maybe they shouldn't use the excuse of dealing with a union, when they should look at the management style they currently have. if AA can't run Maint with this contract then maybe the system should be changed. I would use the stick and carrot approach rather then the all stick approach.

When they're asking for OT at the time clock at punch out time, we are not thinking cool, we are thinking how did you not know you needed man power 2 hours ago.

 

[OldGuy@AA]

Old Guy I SWEAR I'm not looking to stir the pot. And I apologize for the "Oh Boy"

Think back to when and why that 4% was given to the FA's and the Agents who already had JCBA's. It was because Delta had announced a leap over them and Parker leaped over that. The original 4% for us disappeared when Delta went above us and then UAL went above that (For Fleet)

I went up 1% over UAL and you went up 1% over Delta. Again seriously the 4% was absorbed back in the distance.

Now when you get a JCBA they will either compare you again to Delta or UAL whichever is higher. Both groups at UAL now have contracts to gauge that off of.

Question to you guys? Come April who's rates will be higher for Maintenance? Delta or UAL.

BTW I hope you have noticed the Pilots complaining about being stuck in 4th place now?

I am not by any means an expert and have not spent a lot of time looking at the UA contract but it appears they actually are being paid a few cents less than we are in their new contract. But when you consider 7 weeks vacation, and 5 more holidays that means we have to work three more weeks per year than them to make just those few pennies more. I wish we all would think that way instead of allowing the company to disregard those things. I would also like to tell you that the flight attendants top out at 35 days vacation per year which also equals 7 weeks. If we are willing to accept 5 weeks vacation then there is no other way to say it except that we are stupid. If we are being forced to work three weeks more per year than United then we should be paid the equivalent of those three weeks more than them. Personally I would rather have the 7 weeks of vacation and 5 more holidays. I am aware the pilots are complaining and I'm sure DP will take care of them after he is done low balling us. If we accept less then we are indeed idiots.

 

[DallasConehead]

I am not by any means an expert and have not spent a lot of time looking at the UA contract but it appears they actually are being paid a few cents less than we are in their new contract. But when you consider 7 weeks vacation, and 5 more holidays that means we have to work three more weeks per year than them to make just those few pennies more. I wish we all would think that way instead of allowing the company to disregard those things. I would also like to tell you that the flight attendants top out at 35 days vacation per year which also equals 7 weeks. If we are willing to accept 5 weeks vacation then there is no other way to say it except that we are stupid. If we are being forced to work three weeks more per year than United then we should be paid the equivalent of those three weeks more than them. Personally I would rather have the 7 weeks of vacation and 5 more holidays. I am aware the pilots are complaining and I'm sure DP will take care of them after he is done low balling us. If we accept less then we are indeed idiots.

The vacation weeks lost from 13 on should be retro'd in cash along with the holidays missed and the higher rate that our counterparts on the LUS side have been getting all along. The 4% should be retro'd back to when everyone else got it and our sick bank should be retro'd with the missing days since 13. Any increase in 401k match should also be retro'd back into our 401ks.

This will not happen and I expect we will accept less then what we deserve which would partially correct the harm done since 03.

This is because there are people on this board and out on the floor that think we should just be happy and accept the fact that it is what it is and that the ASS has been great for us and we should be ecstatic about it.

What's more, some of those in other title groups find it objectionable that we in maintenance have skills they do not possess. Their only way to deal with these objections are to attempt to belittle those with skills on an open forum. There are indeed some on this board that follow these beliefs and have the audacity to call people names for disagreeing with them. They use bullying and intimidation to try and bring you to their belief.

They should be ignored and reported to the moderator as objectionable since they cannot control their outbursts.

 

[WeAAsles]

I am not by any means an expert and have not spent a lot of time looking at the UA contract but it appears they actually are being paid a few cents less than we are in their new contract. But when you consider 7 weeks vacation, and 5 more holidays that means we have to work three more weeks per year than them to make just those few pennies more. I wish we all would think that way instead of allowing the company to disregard those things. I would also like to tell you that the flight attendants top out at 35 days vacation per year which also equals 7 weeks. If we are willing to accept 5 weeks vacation then there is no other way to say it except that we are stupid. If we are being forced to work three weeks more per year than United then we should be paid the equivalent of those three weeks more than them. Personally I would rather have the 7 weeks of vacation and 5 more holidays. I am aware the pilots are complaining and I'm sure DP will take care of them after he is done low balling us. If we accept less then we are indeed idiots.

OldGuy thank you very much. It was a pleasure reading your response and I'd like to say I hope you had a Great Christmas and New Year and I hope that the rest of the year is great for all of us.

I hope that you get the contract that you expect that is one extremely deserving of the sacrifice you have for many years now gave. I hope it's one that recognizes and respects what you and all you work with have provided and continue to provide to this now hopefully new Airline.

You take care of yourself Sir. It's my belief that you're both a pleasure to know and work with.