More MEM cuts

[WorldTraveler]

I am simply noting that you and E seem to be completely incapable of participating in a conversation without throwing in some sort of diss at me... and then you with the aid of Kev complain about the DL forum being a wasteland because no one wants to participate.

If you want a viable board, then develop the backbone to admit that you (collectively) made a lot of incorrect assessments of where the industry is.

And ps... the sooner you ditch your need to diss me, the sooner I might think about not touting your (collective failures) such as the fact that you predicted DL would fall to WN and the unions who were themselves outsmarted by mgmt. who put an entire workforce of the highest paid ground workers at NW on the street when they arrogantly thought they could come after more than the company was willing to give them.

But I'll stop mentioning all of that when you learn how to participate in a conversation without resorting to your juvenile tactics.

 

[737823]

Update at 0440GMT 11NOV13

As per 11NOV13 GDS timetable/inventory display, DELTA from early-January 2014 cancels additional 4 routes from Memphis. These affected routes currently served at least once a day.

Cancelled from 06JAN14:
Memphis Boston
Memphis Columbus OH (Previously to be cancelled from 03DEC13)
Memphis Nashville
Memphis Washington Reagan

http://airlineroute.net/2013/11/11/dl-mem-jan14/

Josh

 

[WorldTraveler]

I know its a rhetorical question but I'm still going to respond. DL is and for a long time has been a global airline and even before the NWA merger had large operations outside the south in places like BOS, DCA, LAX, NYC, SLC. DL gave MEM a good run and maintained flights and employment for the pm-NW workers based there for five years. DL is under no obligation to maintain unprofitable flying, and if Steve Cohen and the other MEM leaders were gullible enough to take Richard Anderson and Doug Steenland for their word of no hub closures and growth and are now disappointed. Not sure what some people expect. How come no one shed a tear for the UA employees at MIA when they closed the hub there? Or when the IAM facilitated UA outsouring the station to UAX in 2009? There are many examples, not sure why everyone is hung up on MEM.

Josh

let's also keep in mind that jet fuel was just over $2/gal when the DL-NW merger was announced and over $3/gal by the time the MEM hub began to be dismantled.

As much as some people want to believe that MEM had a bullseye on its back from the beginning, DL gave MEM a good shot despite the very radical and different economic situation that took place in the industry as the result of higher fuel prices.

The irony is that AA and US have now agreed to a merger that essentially requires them to maintain their current hub operations for several years....do you not think that WN and a whole lot of other carriers are salivating at the prospect of trashing the weakest parts of new AA's network now that AA/US has no choice but to maintain it?

Some people are about ready to find out what the real price of maintaining unprofitable service is and the price will be high.

DL's employees will be very glad they are not having to subsidize thru their own paychecks unprofitable hubs which is equally what AA/US employees will be doing over the next few years.

 

[737823]

Yep I wonder what necessary 'adjustments' CLT and PHX will see in 18-24 months time.

Josh

 

[WorldTraveler]

they can't reduce those hubs.. they have to remain service levels at their current hubs for 3 years.... competitors are absolutely going to love going after AA/US hubs knowing that AA/US have no choice but to bleed money.



In the settlement agreement with the state Attorneys General, the new American has agreed to maintain its hubs in Charlotte, New York (Kennedy), Los Angeles, Miami, Chicago (O'Hare), Philadelphia, and Phoenix consistent with historical operations for a period of three years. In addition, with limited exceptions, for a period of five years, the new American will continue to provide daily scheduled service from one or more of its hubs to each plaintiff state airport that has scheduled daily service from either American or US Airways. A previous settlement agreement with the state of Texas will be amended to make it consistent with today's settlement.

 

[blue collar]

I am simply noting that you and E seem to be completely incapable of participating in a conversation without throwing in some sort of diss at me... and then you with the aid of Kev complain about the DL forum being a wasteland because no one wants to participate.

If you want a viable board, then develop the backbone to admit that you (collectively) made a lot of incorrect assessments of where the industry is.

And ps... the sooner you ditch your need to diss me, the sooner I might think about not touting your (collective failures) such as the fact that you predicted DL would fall to WN and the unions who were themselves outsmarted by mgmt. who put an entire workforce of the highest paid ground workers at NW on the street when they arrogantly thought they could come after more than the company was willing to give them.

But I'll stop mentioning all of that when you learn how to participate in a conversation without resorting to your juvenile tactics.

Now you're just getting cranky. Did you miss your nap today? You sound like you're in damage control on how the aa-us merger will positively affect delta. That must be why they complained and turned those emails over to the doj. So, now that the merger that you said wasn't going to happen is actually happening, don't you owe someone (etops) a gift card?

 

[WorldTraveler]

I didn't say the merger wasn't happening... quite the opposite. I said for quite some time that there was no basis for saying a civil lawsuit couldn't be resolved.. that is the basis of civil law.

DL execs are either laughing their heads off at the prospect of AA/US being hit by 5 dozen new low fare carrier flights at DCA and LGA on top of what will happen at DAL - a half hour drive from AA's massive DFW hub - or else DL is standing in line waiting to pick up slots to serve the small and medium sized cities that AA/US will choose to drop.

Either way, DL wins.

If you think otherwise, stick around.

 

[Kev3188]

it is either equally as incoherent as his assessment of what I wrote or it matches precisely what he said.

So you were just throwing a tantrum then?

Since you, E, and Q have apparently decided that since your collective ability to engage in the topics at hand is not sufficient to carry on a conversation, the best you can do is resort to character assassination as the method of last resort.

Nice try. It was an honest question. Since you consistently prattle about having meaningful discussions, maybe you should take your own advice and answer it.

So, did DL have a lot of "west" route authorities pre- 1978? If you don;t know, it's okay to say so...

You three might also consider the fact that your collective group mugging is precisely why the DL forum is a wasteland as you like to refer to it.
You are your own worst self-fulfilling prophecy.

Lol.

Doesn't change that MEM is and never has been west of the MS river despite E's statement that DL couldn't have known anything about MEM because DL had virtually no routes west of that river... again despite the fact that DL's earliest route extended from Texas (which is ALL west of the MS) east ACROSS the MS to Georgia.

Wicked. So that's one route. How many more(ish) were there?

How did their operation stack up with, say, Southern or even RC "back in the day?"

Why'd the keep the MEM-LIT tag on well into the late '90's?

Doesn't change either that DL knew about MEM and gave it time to but the city is fundamentally incapable of supporting a hub.

...And water is still wet.

I still have yet to see a single post arguing that. Not sure why you keep insisting on bringing it up.
 
 

There are many examples, not sure why everyone is hung up on MEM.

Maybe 'cause it's a thread about DL's operation at MEM?


 
 

I am simply noting that you and E seem to be completely incapable of participating in a conversation without throwing in some sort of diss at me... and then you with the aid of Kev complain about the DL forum being a wasteland because no one wants to participate.

No diss. Just a low tolerance for spin. BTW, if you'd like to "participate," there's a couple a questions in the queue for you...

And ps... the sooner you ditch your need to diss me, the sooner I might think about not touting your (collective failures) such as the fact that you predicted DL would fall to WN and the unions who were themselves outsmarted by mgmt. who put an entire workforce of the highest paid ground workers at NW on the street when they arrogantly thought they could come after more than the company was willing to give them.

But I'll stop mentioning all of that when you learn how to participate in a conversation without resorting to your juvenile tactics.

Easy there, Joan of Arc...

 

[eolesen]

Here's DL's 1945 route map:

and 1958

and finally, 1979, which is when deregulation kicked in:

Yes, the point still stands: DL had minimal service west of I-35 (since WT wants to nitpick about the generally used concept of the west starting at the Mississippi River). A whopping six cities served nonstop, plus the tag to Reno.

Still waiting to hear how the lineage of the DC9's makes a difference...

 

[Kev3188]

Thanks for posting those, E!

 

[WorldTraveler]

the west comment was because you, E, said that DL had little presence west of the MS river. YOU defined what was west and your comment made no sense in a discussion about MEM because MEM is east of the MS River and always has been.

It also doesnt' change DL is larger than AA now and DL continues to grow its presence in the west, has already announced further growth in the key west coast markets where it has said it will grow, and continues to do. Trotting out a 30 year old route map means nothing in terms of the competitive environment new AA faces now.

You can argue all day long that DL was of no consequence in the west as if it makes some sort of difference as to whether DL had a "right" to shut down the MEM hub or not but DL knew the MEM hub long before you ever graced the earth with your presence and knew the MEM market when it made the decision to gut the hub. And there is nothing that MEM can do.

And despite your wishful hopes otherwise, AA/US do have obligations to maintain their current hub structures as part of the merger agreements, something DL didn't have to do. If you think that AA/US will be able to just walk away from the agreements it made in order to get the merger approved, you should get another think coming....

So even though AA will continue to struggle to compete with low fare carriers, new AA will be forced to maintain those flights that will lose money - even more than they do today.

DL didn't and doesn't have any such requirements.

 

[LD3]

 

In the settlement agreement with the state Attorneys General, the new American has agreed to maintain its hubs in Charlotte,

When did North Carolina join the lawsuit? No need to maintain service levels in CLT....

 

[WorldTraveler]

the quote is from the press release. Ask AA.

 

[LD3]

You posted no link....so you posted bad info.....

 

[WorldTraveler]

the info is right out of the press release. If you didn't bother to read a press release as significant as this, then it is doubtful you have enough knowledge to talk about the subject.

It was widely copied elsewhere on the internet and in popular media. If you can't recognize it as text from a press release by AA....