Results are out: F/A seniority Intergration team

[jalbalpa]

AFA has no means of verifying the accuracy of the list. Delta is not required to provide any personal information including telephone numbers and/or addresses to AFA. The only thing they provide is a name. How is AFA supposed to verify that the list is indeed accurate?

We obviously know this did not happen during the 2008 election. Delta knew of the passing of this flight attendant in January, AFA filed in February and the election took place in April.

There is obviously no way that AFA can check the accuracy of the list, yet another means of preventing the employees from organizing.

 

[Dignity]

has no means of verifying the accuracy of the list. Delta is not required to provide any personal information including telephone numbers and/or addresses to . The only thing they provide is a name. How is supposed to verify that the list is indeed accurate?

We obviously know this did not happen during the 2008 election. Delta knew of the passing of this flight attendant in January, filed in February and the election took place in April.

There is obviously no way that can check the accuracy of the list, yet another means of preventing the employees from organizing.

I am referring to actual numbers...there has to be a number and a way to check that is an accurate number for a list..

wasn't a combined seniority list recomendation just made available...wouldnt that be a start?

 

[jalbalpa]

No, by my count there are at least 33 members of management on the list. This is only after a quick scan, others have reported that there are several members on that list that work at the GO and that haven't flown in years. Again, no way to verify this information.

How do you verify the list?

All you get is names, no phone numbers, no addresses, nothing.

Hey look flight attendant John Smith is on the list, good luck verifying that.

The flight attendant eligibility list is diluted beyond reach, this is also another reason for waiting to have the election.

 

[Dignity]

How do you verify the list?

you actually go through and count the numbers.

Hey look flight attendant John Smith is on the list, good luck verifying that'

you claimed you were able to count 33 managers why would John Smith be difficult to verify if you can point out managers with a quick scan?

The flight attendant eligibility list is diluted beyond reach, this is also another reason for waiting to have the election.

there is a combined seniority list recommendation made available, there is no way to dilute the list unless there are numbers added to the end.

 

[Kev3188]

you actually go through and count the numbers.

Counting numbers on a list is actually very easy, and is somewhat irrelevant.

Verifying the names that comprise that number-and their eligibility is what matters. It also takes a long time/lot of effort.

 

[Dignity]

Counting numbers on a list is actually very easy, and is somewhat irrelevant.

an actual number is relevant if the election is determined to be 50 percent plus 1, it is also relevant how many numbers are cast regarding a laker ballot. I am actually surprised you dont see it that way. you just cant guess the number.

Verifying the names that comprise that number-and their eligibility is what matters. It also takes a long time/lot of effort.

for an issue this important.. if in fact does take a long time and effort, it should have already been addressed and especially when so much is at stake. now the length of time to actually accomplish that is...irrelevant.

regarding seniority..

they have adjusted their seniority dates within the past few months(while I agree with the training credit) I think some of us would appreciate someone on the NW integration team to sit down and have those people explain exactly what they did, why they did it and why they have decided to slot some people with the same class date ahead of others and also verify it was done fairly.

so basically the union is going to allow their own interpretation of their adjusted list to stand as DOH.. without one meeting at all prior to the vote.. then for the rest of us to accept that afterward with a successful representation?

they adjusted their dates and a ratio of some ahead of other regarding overlapping class dates.

a full explanation is necessary prior to the vote from the NW integration committee or do we just have to accept the DL list without even one meeting?

 

[jalbalpa]

Dignity...

Delta could have easily added 100-200-300 names to that list, there is just no way to verify if all the names on that list are of REAL flight attendants. If a laker ballot was in effect, then it wouldn't matter because if those people don't exist then they won't vote and they will not be rewarded with a NO vote. However, by adding names to the list who don't exist it like adding more NO votes.

Lets say I go thru the numbers on that list, how am I supposed to know that Michelle Barnes is a flight attendant? I have no way of contacting her, and nobody knows who she is.

So how do I verify that she is in fact a flight attendant?

 

[jalbalpa]

Dignity, we aren't accepting ANYTHING from the DL committee.

We aren't even recognizing them. We believe that representational issues will be settled before seniority issues. Simple, end of story. Delta management isn't used to having people running the show...because they always have. We (the flight attendants) will decide when we will have the vote and when to recognize the Delta committee.


Here is what a member of the Delta committee had to say...

I was elected by people I value, to a committee whose mission I felt was corrupted by being premature. Management is rushing the integration process to squeeze out the union. Trying to grab the gold ring, without having negotiated the price of the ride.

 

[Dignity]

Dignity...

Delta could have easily added 100-200-300 names to that list, there is just no way to verify if all the names on that list are of REAL flight attendants. If a laker ballot was in effect, then it wouldn't matter because if those people don't exist then they won't vote and they will not be rewarded with a NO vote. However, by adding names to the list who don't exist it like adding more NO votes.

Lets say I go thru the numbers on that list, how am I supposed to know that Michelle Barnes is a flight attendant? I have no way of contacting her, and nobody knows who she is.

So how do I verify that she is in fact a flight attendant?

I think something could have been accomplished if someone from the NW seniority committee sat down with their group.. since they were forming a combined list while adjusting their seniority numbers.. but apparently that isnt going to happen.

 

[Dignity]

Dignity, we aren't accepting ANYTHING from the DL committee.

they have already adjusted their seniority dates, so when the election is held and if it is successful we will have to accept their adjustment as DOH without an explaination what they did, why and that ratio of overlapping classes?

 

[jalbalpa]

No we wont. This is just the recommendation from the Delta committee. This is the proposed integration. Nothing has been changed.

We won't have to accept a thing. I believe you are a bit confused as to what this is.

This is not what we will all get, this is what a committee "recommended", Delta management can still turn around and say...well...hmmm....we think this works better.

Also, I just got confirmation that a dead flight attendant, retired flight attendants, and of course members of management are on that list.

This means nothing, its just management trying to stir the pot.

 

[dapoes]

No we wont. This is just the recommendation from the Delta committee. This is the proposed integration. Nothing has been changed.

We won't have to accept a thing. I believe you are a bit confused as to what this is.

This is not what we will all get, this is what a committee "recommended", Delta management can still turn around and say...well...hmmm....we think this works better.

Also, I just got confirmation that a dead flight attendant, retired flight attendants, and of course members of management are on that list.

This means nothing, its just management trying to stir the pot.

And what makes you think DAL FA's will accept any ridiculous AFA cram downs?

Yawn :down:

 

[Dignity]

No we wont. This is just the recommendation from the Delta committee. This is the proposed integration. Nothing has been changed.

well of course something was changed..they changed their seniority numbers because they are merging with us, do you think maybe we can at least get an explanation prior to voting? I hardly think that is asking too much from the NW seniority committee.

I believe you are a bit confused as to what this is.

with all due respect, with all your insinuations, I believe that would be you.

This is not what we will all get, this is what a committee "recommended", Delta management can still turn around and say...well...hmmm....we think this works better.

they are not recommending changing their seniority dates, that has already happened, again is it asking too much for an explanation prior to a vote?

Also, I just got confirmation that a dead flight attendant, retired flight attendants, and of course members of management are on that list.

so the deceased individual has shown up again on the list the second time? are you reading what you are writing?

This means nothing, its just management trying to stir the pot.

it appears they are not the only ones...

 

[jalbalpa]

Dignity I expected you to understand, but you obviously don't. Contact a member of your LEC and have them explain you the process.

 

[Dignity]

Dignity I expected you to understand, but you obviously don't. Contact a member of your LEC and have them explain you the process.

I was hoping you could manage to explain your reasons.. regarding a different series of questions posed and real concerns.

thank you for... trying.