United Mechanics Contract

swamt said:
A letter from MR to the AMT's stated that SWA's offer is 5% over AA and United. That tells me he already knows what the United mechanics are being offered.  And yes D757, the airlines talk to each other about what they are offering each group.  I think SWA is rushing to a contract all of a sudden to get done before UPS comes to terms.  Some on the floor are thinking we may get a final offer or a take it or leave it offer soon from the co. If anything comes out without any changes to the language asks by the co. we need to send an overwhelming 100% NO vote back to the co. I am done with any more outsourcing.  Over 68-75% is plenty and actually too much, but it is what the teamsters have allowed for decades when they were here, and it's nearly impossible to get that work back in house.  More tweeks are needed for the membership to buy off on it.  Birdman, notice how the co. has not bugged on the scope language so far?  The mediator needs to get them to move on this part, and they are still gonna have to tweek the economics side of it.  They did state when they left the table last time that this was not a final offer, even though it was stated as a "take it or leave it" offer in the updates. So wondering if we might see a final offer after this next weeks nego's?  If they do, and AMFA allows it to come out for a vote, it will be the first time the mechanics would get something to vote on in over 4 years, our Pilots and F/A's already had their first votes, and both were voted down by the membership even though the union leadership at both agreed in principle and the F/A's presidents and NC highly recommended a yes vote.  Now the union is looking to oust president of the F/A's union. This should have been done when the NC was replaced.

Sometimes the best way to send management a clear message is to let the membership send it. If you haven't voted on anything in 4 years now, I think your Union is doing you a massive disservice. In that 4 year span they could have put it in your hands with a strong NO recommendation. It seems to be a practice of your Union to never let the members get that ultimate shot at giving the company the middle finger.

The IBT gave these members that say and they gave the company a middle finger by 95%. And look where they are now. They have a new TA.
 
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WeAAsles said:
It seems to be a practice of your Union to never let the members get that ultimate shot at giving the company the middle finger.
That's hilarious Weaasles, it's your union that's given its members the middle finger since 2003 and the only thing you've gotten back is what your new CEO graciously gives. We have Q&A's with our airline rep and not one question raised about why we're not allowed to vote on the company's proposal. There's other ways to send a message than to take a vote few want that will do nothing but delay talks a minimum of 6 months.
 
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Birdman said:
That's hilarious Weaasles, it's your union that's given its members the middle finger since 2003 and the only thing you've gotten back is what your new CEO graciously gives. We have Q&A's with our airline rep and not one question raised about why we're not allowed to vote on the company's proposal. There's other ways to send a message than to take a vote few want that will do nothing but delay talks a minimum of 6 months.
4 years. 365 times 4 = 1460 days. 

Your message obviously isn't working.
 
WeAAsles said:
Sometimes the best way to send management a clear message is to let the membership send it. If you haven't voted on anything in 4 years now, I think your Union is doing you a massive disservice. In that 4 year span they could have put it in your hands with a strong NO recommendation. It seems to be a practice of your Union to never let the members get that ultimate shot at giving the company the middle finger.

The IBT gave these members that say and they gave the company a middle finger by 95%. And look where they are now. They have a new TA.
Why the rush when the co. is looking to dismantle our scope language.  They can offer us 100 bucks an hour, but if we have no scope we have no jobs to come to and earn the 100 bucks per hour. Eventually with what the co. wants there will be nothing but graveyard, Line RON, Hangar RON, Line Maint, and overnight maint., and that's it. Our co. has always said they would love to get rid of all shops within SWA, the only thing left is 4 lines and C-check which they want as well and switching to health, 2-3 day checks, and cabin visits.  Too many LOA's tied to scope and need to be installed into the contract.  They still have alot of work left before this membership will pass a vote. We will see what route the co. will take this week after nego's.
Still awaiting the United mechanics offer.  Kinda surprised we haven't heard something yet.  I guess if it were super great it would have been leaked by now, if it was super low, then we probably would have heard something.  So it may be right there in the middle. Hopefully the union has been following all the offers in the industry being passed back and forth and they are using this as a template. If so then maybe they are gonna go to mid 50's or better, I hope so...
 
C'mon E. Even you know this is about all of us in the industry. We will share all info across the board. And BTW he, asked about our 4 years of nothing so I responded. Get over the this is all about UA, because it is not. It's about ALL of us in the industry. When everyone out here gets that we will be a better group as a whole over all.
 
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I don't enjoy responding off topic but sometimes it's unavoidable. I'll have to agree with swamt that although it's a UA thread it's an industry issue and we should be at liberty to interject common subject matter. In regard to UA's "agreement in principle", I thought there was a gag order initiated which should have prevented WN's management from getting information from United that could be used to leverage negotiations. Either WN's Mr. Ryan misspoke when stating their proposal was 5% over AA and UA or he has information he's not entitled to have. Regardless if there are violations, I don't believe mediators have the authority nor the will to impose penalty's.  
 
He more than likely misspoke. Here's my thinking. MR wanted to rush out an offer before the UAL's mechanics offer was released. I would be pretty confident that UAL's offer is a little higher than AA's but he wants us to believe him (before the numbers are public) so we will continue to think we were put 5% above both AA and UAL. And BTW, we have 1/4 of the amount of mechanics compared to AA and UAL, they can afford to put us right where we were above number 2 before which was 10-12% above number 2.  Also MR also wants us voting on something long before UPS releases their offers out to their mechanics, because they know we will successfully be compared to UPS just like our dispatchers did during mediation, and I have heard UPS is passing numbers in the 60's across to the co.  And of course we still do not know where the AA mechanics will end up as they are still in nego's and their union is going for industry leading as well.  All of a sudden the co. wants to rush and get a contract done. Well too bad, they should have thought about that from day one. If they would have nego in good faith from the get go they might have had a contract by now and got all 3 groups at a much cheaper cost. Now, just how smart was this plan to drag out nego's for now going on 5 years. GK will indeed get his 5 year pay freezes he wants.  Sorry for rambling but it just kills me what the co. is asking for when currently under our contract as it is today we are making record after record profits.  They have no leg to stand on for the ask.  Wake up Southwest, they are losing touch with their very senior and dedicated employees.  Change is needed before it explodes into never coming back, there is time to repair going forward and the ball is in the co. court, let's see how they "choose" to serve it up...
 
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Im not feeling real jiggy with this gag ordered UAL situation, supposedly in meetings finalizing language. My confidence is not high. 
 
WeAAsles said:
4 years. 365 times 4 = 1460 days. 
Your message obviously isn't working.
why don't you stay out of mechanic issues . No one cares about the twu/Iam are ibt they have put amts so far back it is pathetic n701 get back to work loading bags you lazy
 
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D7571987 said:
Im not feeling real jiggy with this gag ordered UAL situation, supposedly in meetings finalizing language. My confidence is not high. 
So sorry to hear that D.  Hoping some good news comes soon...
 
D7571987 said:
Im not feeling real jiggy with this gag ordered UAL situation, supposedly in meetings finalizing language. My confidence is not high. 
 
All the rumors I have heard is basically the same turd with more pay. 
 
swamt said:
He more than likely misspoke. Here's my thinking. MR wanted to rush out an offer before the UAL's mechanics offer was released. I would be pretty confident that UAL's offer is a little higher than AA's but he wants us to believe him (before the numbers are public) so we will continue to think we were put 5% above both AA and UAL. And BTW, we have 1/4 of the amount of mechanics compared to AA and UAL, they can afford to put us right where we were above number 2 before which was 10-12% above number 2.  Also MR also wants us voting on something long before UPS releases their offers out to their mechanics, because they know we will successfully be compared to UPS just like our dispatchers did during mediation, and I have heard UPS is passing numbers in the 60's across to the co.  And of course we still do not know where the AA mechanics will end up as they are still in nego's and their union is going for industry leading as well.  All of a sudden the co. wants to rush and get a contract done. Well too bad, they should have thought about that from day one. If they would have nego in good faith from the get go they might have had a contract by now and got all 3 groups at a much cheaper cost. Now, just how smart was this plan to drag out nego's for now going on 5 years. GK will indeed get his 5 year pay freezes he wants.  Sorry for rambling but it just kills me what the co. is asking for when currently under our contract as it is today we are making record after record profits.  They have no leg to stand on for the ask.  Wake up Southwest, they are losing touch with their very senior and dedicated employees.  Change is needed before it explodes into never coming back, there is time to repair going forward and the ball is in the co. court, let's see how they "choose" to serve it up...
Pfft.....don't think you have to worry too much about UPSers getting a deal done anytime soon.
They won't even be back at the table until October.....
There's no urgency whatsoever here.
Probably another year or so.....or at least what I'm told by senior guys here.
 
Well at least you UPS guys have been $28,000 a year higher than us for years and years already. 
 
And we have heard nothing from company or union when supposedly 2 weeks ago they had an agreement in principle. 
 
787nightmare said:
Pfft.....don't think you have to worry too much about UPSers getting a deal done anytime soon.
They won't even be back at the table until October.....
There's no urgency whatsoever here.
Probably another year or so.....or at least what I'm told by senior guys here.
Thx for the info. Any idea what the hold ups are? Just curious as our contract and your contract was amendable at approx the same time of 8-16.  Would like to hear more from you guys about contracts in the future, as it will help us all out.  From what I have been told you guys are now down to economics, is that true?  Good luck  in your future contract talks. Hope you all get what what your asking for, including all the retirement stuff...
 
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