US Pilots Labor Discussion 6/2- STAY ON TOPIC AND OBSERVE THE RULES

[233KILLS]

I am sure Generalissimo Cleary will be canvassing the pilots in the PHX crewroom, as any good union leader would.

Cleary and the girls do not have the spine to show there faces in a PHX crew room. It will never happen.

 

[233KILLS]

Speaking of cleary. Why has he or usapa never made comment on the DAL/NWA seniority list? It's has if that merger never happened. Heads in the sand.

 

[EyeInTheSky]

As long as the Westies remain lawsuit happy it's clear where this whole scenerio is going - two separated groups with two separate contracts. I don't think any East pilots have a problem with that. Westies can rot in PHX where their career expectations began and will probably end. Oh well...

Later,
Eye

 

[nic4us]

As long as the Westies remain lawsuit happy it's clear where this whole scenerio is going - two separated groups with two separate contracts. I don't think any East pilots have a problem with that. Westies can rot in PHX where their career expectations began and will probably end. Oh well...

Later,
Eye

Eye, long time no no-see.

Lawsuit happy? we only filed one and you guys were found guilty. You filed the appeal that is going to be held up at the 9th for a while.

You are correct things will stay seperate for now. Rot in PHX?, have you not heard, we are adding 70 flights a day this fall, and there is talk about a West staffed FLL base. Enjoy loa93. and your fleet min. How did the meeting with Kirby go at scum central, ( I mean usapa headquarters)?

At least BlackSwan is encouraged when there is news that will get furloughs back. The rest of the east pieces of work are only encouraged when there is news that supports their wet dream of furloughs stealing their West's co-workers jobs.

Later,

 

[nic4us]

Oh well...

Later,
Eye

One liner hit and run from the always entertaining unkown comic.

Fortunately, Chuck Barris was unable to stop Phyllis Diller from stiking the gong.

 

[767jetz]

Speaking of cleary. Why has he or usapa never made comment on the DAL/NWA seniority list? It's has if that merger never happened. Heads in the sand.

Head in the sand is right. They always want to point to Allegheny/Mohawk but ignore the most recent, relevant, successful merger that we all know was not DOH.

 

[nycbusdriver]

Usapa is going to be able to create a fair section 22? Who gets to decide what is fair. East pilots get to decide what they think is fair for west pilots. How many west pilots are in the room crafting this “fair” piece of documentation? That would be none.

"None" is all that really have to be present.

Who gets to decide? First, the west pilots decide if they think it's fair. Undoubtedly, some will think so. If the AWPC (Angry West Pilots Club,) thinks it's unfair, they will likely sue. Ho hum.

Ultimately, then, the fairness test will be given in a courtroom with ALL the evidence heard. Personally, I'm not worried that a judge and/or jury will find it fair given decades of industry precedent on DOH.

 

[luvthe9]

The Leonidas are insinuating they have two opinions, Bybee, from Las Vegas, and Wake , a former union buster atty, in their favor. They are digging deep for a west morale builder on that one. They forgot the Ninth Circuit Chief Judge Alex Kosinski, oversees and recommends, allows or disallows requests for deviations. He did not allow deviation from the definition of ripe, and said this was NOT a special circumstance that warranted a one time change of the interpretation. That makes three at the Ninth Circuit in our favor. Not ripe means just that. Seeham predicted everything that would happen, and he was right. He also inferred, we can now focus on a joint contract and there will be nothing unfair in the DOH List or in the fences and protections. Any further action on their side will be a tough case to win.

Not to mention the costs that they have already incurred, still owe and would have to spend to keep this going. I don't see it happening. The majority of money they have collected came from the Captains that would not be affected. I think those six plaintiffs are on the hook for the rest of the monies owed. Think those Captains are going to give another $1,000 each to continue this? I don't think so, but I have been wrong before.

 

[nycbusdriver]

Well, I will admit that I have a very limited understanding of trial procedure, however, I would think that wether or not the jury verdict in the Addington trial would be admissable in a future trial would be up to that trial judge.

If I were that judge, I would allow it, and of course I would allow usapa to explain to the jury that the trial was dismissed on appeal due to lack of ripeness. Then usapa could also explain exactly what was not ripe the first time and exactly why we are all here again.

Pass anything less than the Nic, get sued, waste money, lose DFR. But that is okay with busdriver, he will be gone by then.

Dismissed means dismissed, Try to find any legal precedent anywhere that is based on a dismissed case.

If you were the judge, you would allow it? Why am I not surprised? If I were the judge I would have stapled you guys. So there. Guess it's good for both of us that we are not federal judges.

 

[oldiebutgoody]

The Leonidas are insinuating they have two opinions, Bybee, from Las Vegas, and Wake , a former union buster atty, in their favor. They are digging deep for a west morale builder on that one. They forgot the Ninth Circuit Chief Judge Alex Kosinski, oversees and recommends, allows or disallows requests for deviations. He did not allow deviation from the definition of ripe, and said this was NOT a special circumstance that warranted a one time change of the interpretation. That makes three at the Ninth Circuit in our favor. Not ripe means just that. Seeham predicted everything that would happen, and he was right. He also inferred, we can now focus on a joint contract and there will be nothing unfair in the DOH List or in the fences and protections. Any further action on their side will be a tough case to win.

Not to mention the costs that they have already incurred, still owe and would have to spend to keep this going. I don't see it happening. The majority of money they have collected came from the Captains that would not be affected. I think those six plaintiffs are on the hook for the rest of the monies owed. Think those Captains are going to give another $1,000 each to continue this? I don't think so, but I have been wrong before.

Exactly why they won't get an en banc hearing.

You were really nice to Judge Bybee. Don't forget he's the judge that said waterboarding wasn't torture, and is under investigation in other countries for war crimes. Yea, he has great judgement.

 

[nic4us]

Dismissed means dismissed, Try to find any legal precedent anywhere that is based on a dismissed case.

If you were the judge, you would allow it? Why am I not surprised? If I were the judge I would have stapled you guys. So there. Guess it's good for both of us that we are not federal judges.

I would allow the histroy of the case to be presented. You would get to cross,and explain that the case was dismissed, and why the case was dismissed, and why you are in front of a jury again now that your DFR is "unquestionably ripe".

Are you saying that the 9ths ruling on friday has no legal precedent, because it dealt with a case dismissed? That in the future no lawyer can point to this case and say, in Addington vs. usapa, the 9th circuit found that a fake union has not breached its DFR until they codify it in a ratified CBA. I am pretty certain a large percentage of SCOTUS rulings deal with cases that are won, then overturned on appeal, then again upheld by the Supremes. And I am also relatively certain, Supreme court decision carry legal precedent.(sarcasm)

You probably meant to say, if you were the arbitrator you would have stapled us. If you were the judge you would be under consideration for recall for your legislating from the bench.

 

[AWE Dog]

Why is it that when you guys start losing an argument you go to the it’s unfair argument and throw out the most extreme example? I know because you have no argument.

Take a look at the bottom 15 of each active list. Yes there is one west pilot that got hired at 26 years old. Now you want to penalize him for working hard and getting hired. Now look at the bottom 15 of the east list there are two pilot that were hired at age 26. Should they also be penalized for getting hired young?

Why don’t you ever point to the west pilot in that group that was 47 when he got hired. What career does he have left?

Average age of the bottom 15. West 34. East 49. But when they were hired the average age of that class was 32. So your new hires will have two more years to work then a west pilot.

Average age of east pilots 53. Average age of west pilots. 48. Stop the whining about how unfair life is. You got hired at an airline made your choice to stay. If after 17 years you were in the exact same spot you should have done something about it. Take responsibility for your choices.

Cleared, Where did you get a average East age of 53 from a list in 2006.

 

[nycbusdriver]

Rant and rave, rant and rave. If the east manages to get anything other than the Nicolau implemented you will set precedent. Precedent that we will than use when the west is the majority.

Fair enough. Let USAPA negotiate what it thinks is a fair seniority list now, and get a new contract,.

Then, when you are in power and have control of USAPA, rearrange the seniority list to suit the Nicolau list.

Sounds like a great plan.

Good luck with that.

(I'm not saying that simply because I will be long retired by the time you do your great list adjustment. But because it doesn't have a snowball's change in ... of actually happening.)

 

[nic4us]

You were really nice to Judge Bybee. Don't forget he's the judge that said waterboarding wasn't torture, and is under investigation in other countries for war crimes. Yea, he has great judgement.

I hope he is on the en banc panel. Bet he volunteers to help put the screws to the fake union for their breach of contract as well.

 

[nycbusdriver]

What are you guys so concerned about our finances for? It is our bill and we will pay it. How could you possibly know how much we do or do not owe the lawyers?

Maybe because you guys are so concerned about our finances. How many times have I heard words to the effect: "How do easties like living on LOA 93 wages?"

It's nice that we have this mutual concern. Maybe this common interest can be our first step to an eventual group hug.

"Kum ba ya, my lord, kum ba ya....." (Feel free to join in at any time.)