AFA labor discussion (Work related)

[OP Taylor]

Flores has been drinking the koolaid.

Well that is certainly a change. Beverage du jour.

 

[Zarah]

Time and time again throughout these negociations Flores has told the reserves that their votes do not matter as they are the minority. Granted he did not use those exact words he would say things like, Block Holders will not vote for that, Reserves are a small percentage of the votes, and so on.

We need the block holders to stand with us over this reserve system and make sure that the company and Flores know that one of the reasons you are voting NO is because of the reserve system. Please, do not let the comany address your issues and leave the reserve system like this TA.

We need to stand together and send this back to the company.

We need to make a clear statement that we are one workforce and not a workforce divided.

Vote NO

 

[flybynite]

One of the things I will say about this reserve section is.....the Union is putting this information out first.

In the past....it's always been about the lineholders first. Not this time. Which really leads me to believe the JNC is really trying to make the reserves believe they are not "last" on their list of things to do.

They are being really up front about it. I think they have thought long and hard about it too. That's not to say, in my opinion, it's perfect but I can see where they have fought for a lot of things that are near and dear to us.

One of the things I do like is they have cleaned up the split trip language. That has been a huge problem. Now you can at least expect a minimum day pay of 5:i5.

After looking at how they will be processing trips, I kind of like the idea that they will be processing daily trips in inverse order. That way you're not getting hammered by scheduling right after getting in from a trip. It's supposed to give you some breathing space between trips.....We'll see how that goes.

Anyway....that's my opinion for now.

 

[beachboy]

:blink: Um, that's all great but read between the lines. This gives them more control than ever! "With scheduling consent" , "Under certain unique circumstances" ect. Heck, just hand they keys over- it's insane! I am sorry but it's bull crap! How about the Q&A? The old East system was an "uphill battle"? No sh** Sherlock! That is your job! Pussy wussy 🙄 Go down the Yellow Brick Road to find the Wizard AFA, maybe he will grant you some BALLS!

 

[KARL ROVER]

:blink: Um, that's all great but read between the lines. This gives them more control than ever! "With scheduling consent" , "Under certain unique circumstances" ect. Heck, just hand they keys over- it's insane! I am sorry but it's bull crap! How about the Q&A? The old East system was an "uphill battle"? No sh** Sherlock! That is your job! Pussy wussy 🙄 Go down the Yellow Brick Road to find the Wizard AFA, maybe he will grant you some BALLS!

That is right on beachboy. They are handing the company more and more control on a silver platter. What a novel idea, taking on an uphill battle. Did this negotiating committee think this management was going to lay down during this merger? Parker stated right from the beginning this was going to be cost neutral. But we were promised an industry leading contract. That must be at the end of the yellow brick road. I bet if these proposals were circulated throughout the industry we would be the laughing stock. Should be fun to watch the SPINMASTER try to sell this garbage to the PHL flight attendants at the meeting. I would bet it will be a whole different ballgame than the CLT meeting. Should be fun to watch them squirm under the pressure of the PHL crew. The latest MEC Eline states the negotiating committee believes they have met the needs of the Reserves in this proposal. What reserves expectations have they met? Don't be fooled by the fast talking SPINMASTER or you will walk out of the meeting feeling like this is all good. It will be like attending a meeting with the company negotiators. Should be interesting. need to have a good turn out for the meeting on Thursday.

 

[Zarah]

One of the things I will say about this reserve section is.....the Union is putting this information out first.


One of the things I do like is they have cleaned up the split trip language. That has been a huge problem. Now you can at least expect a minimum day pay of 5:i5.

Where did you see the minimum day would be 5:15? I don't recall seeing a time value for a minimum day.

Being assigned a trip in inverse order from daily, but not giving the same people daily trips over and over again. So, this will creep up the seniority list fairly fast. The reason I think this is because overall there will be less reserves on duty within your RAP on your days of availability then we have today.

What I don't like about the inverse order is that in order to get a daily trip, to try and make my time, I will have to be an aggressive reserve and therefore not able to call out of time. (Or not able to count my aggressive trips towards calling out of time, not sure how to interpret that part.)

Today, we have a screen where we can see where we stand for future and daily calls. Would we still have this ability or will we be flying blind?

One part that need clarification is under OPR and it states (not an exact quote) That a Reserve will be notified of their OPR assignment at the start of their RAP. Does this mean we will be assigned trips while on our rest period and/or days off?

As this stands, I am not groovin on the reserve section and not interested in being a piece of meat for scheduling and/or leaving the future reserves to be a pieces of meat.

 

[Onestep2flt]

One of the things I will say about this reserve section is.....the Union is putting this information out first.

In the past....it's always been about the lineholders first. Not this time. Which really leads me to believe the JNC is really trying to make the reserves believe they are not "last" on their list of things to do.

They are being really up front about it. I think they have thought long and hard about it too. That's not to say, in my opinion, it's perfect but I can see where they have fought for a lot of things that are near and dear to us.

One of the things I do like is they have cleaned up the split trip language. That has been a huge problem. Now you can at least expect a minimum day pay of 5:i5.

After looking at how they will be processing trips, I kind of like the idea that they will be processing daily trips in inverse order. That way you're not getting hammered by scheduling right after getting in from a trip. It's supposed to give you some breathing space between trips.....We'll see how that goes.

Anyway....that's my opinion for now.

The reason the reserve section is even being put out is that Mr. Flores is trying to put out some of the flames from the fire that your reserves have backed him into. Remember just two weeks ago he said he could not put this info out because it was top secret.

There is no reason to put any info out to line holders. If you give them some more pay and a few vacation days it should be enough to get any tentative agreement to pass. Will they all be happy? Maybe not, but there should still be the votes to get it to pass. This is in no way meant to be a slap at line holders. I am just saying that for the most part I think the contract you have works for you with far fewer issues in regards to your day to day scheduling. I am very aware that there are line holders that are aware of the plight of the reserve. On that note, I hope those that want a fair contract for ALL flight attendants will show support for one another.

My friends say that most of this reserve language is stuff you can gather up from the west agreement with a little of the east pilot agreement thrown in with some word variations thrown in for good measure. No thinking outside the box there.

I find it very interesting that he has to explain away why fresh ideas that flight attendants have given him wont work such as a rotating reserve. Although a lot of my business is on US I do fly other carriers. I love to chat with the flight crews which is why I come to this board. I can tell you that MOST of the flight attendants I have talked to on the subject love the system they are under. They all differ slightly but the one thing that is constant is that there are all quite fewer reserves than US. For the most part, it appears that airlines that do this only have like three days a month that you are even on reserve in this system. Most have some sort of cut off as well. Like the top 35% would never have reserve days. By the way these are reserve days not years. The idea is that MORE blocks are created so more people move off reserve for good. If you look at your contract, you have primary, secondary, and then reserve. Looks great until you are that 19 year person that bounces between straight reserve day in an day out and having a block one month. If you had a rotating system you would have fewer people bouncing and at least you would know exactly what to expect. I also do not believe that I have met a flight attendant that has more than 12 years that has to rotate. Most of these systems also have straight reserves of some kind. However, It is far, far, fewer than US has. Reserves of some kind will always be needed but you guys are way beyond the norm percentage wise.

Not saying that this is good for you guys or not. I just think the reason you will not be seeing it at your company at this point is Mr. Flores would have to make changes to all flight attendants to make it happen. He would be rocking the boat then. Well, he is rocking the boat now but the reserves are and will continue to be the minority at your company.

By the way. Do give all the juicy details from anybody that is able to attend your union meeting on the 7th (tomorrow). Should be quite lively if any reserve is actually able to attend! Hope lots of you guys are able to show up.

 

[PHLfa88]

Most of us are beyond disgruntled at this point and we have quite a few sigs on the recall petitions. All we need is 51%. I'm confident we will vote NO on this one.

You no longer need 50+1% with the new voting change..A simple Majority is needed!

 

[NYGiantsFan90]

That is for workers wanting to unionize, not a recall petition.

 

[flybynite]

Where did you see the minimum day would be 5:15? I don't recall seeing a time value for a minimum day.

Being assigned a trip in inverse order from daily, but not giving the same people daily trips over and over again. So, this will creep up the seniority list fairly fast. The reason I think this is because overall there will be less reserves on duty within your RAP on your days of availability then we have today.

What I don't like about the inverse order is that in order to get a daily trip, to try and make my time, I will have to be an aggressive reserve and therefore not able to call out of time. (Or not able to count my aggressive trips towards calling out of time, not sure how to interpret that part.)

Today, we have a screen where we can see where we stand for future and daily calls. Would we still have this ability or will we be flying blind?

One part that need clarification is under OPR and it states (not an exact quote) That a Reserve will be notified of their OPR assignment at the start of their RAP. Does this mean we will be assigned trips while on our rest period and/or days off?

As this stands, I am not groovin on the reserve section and not interested in being a piece of meat for scheduling and/or leaving the future reserves to be a pieces of meat.

There is new language in the Scheduling section that provides for a minimum pay day for split trips for reserves and blockholders. The new minimum is 5:15. I think that was in a prior E-Line. Correct me if I'm wrong.

As for being an "Aggressive Reserve" you can call out of time once you have completed a trip that puts you at or above the monthly cap. Now, I want to know what the monthly cap is going to be......85 hrs? 90 hrs? 110 hrs? At someone's whim?

I want some clarity there.

 

[VAflyGal]

If you make yourself available for "Aggresive Reserve" status (like the current quick call status), you may NOT use the hours earned from a call resulting from putting yourself on AGG towards calling out of time.

READ: CONCESSION.

See you guys tomorrow at the Marriott PHL, front and center.

 

[flybynite]

If you make yourself available for "Aggresive Reserve" status (like the current quick call status), you may NOT use the hours earned from a call resulting from putting yourself on AGG towards calling out of time.

READ: CONCESSION.

See you guys tomorrow at the Marriott PHL, front and center.

Unless I'm reading this wrong....you can't get the credited hours (for timing out) at time of assignment. It's only after completing the trip are you able to time out.

But, if it's not clearly stated in the contract, it needs to be corrected.

 

[flybynite]

If you make yourself available for "Aggresive Reserve" status (like the current quick call status), you may NOT use the hours earned from a call resulting from putting yourself on AGG towards calling out of time.

READ: CONCESSION.

See you guys tomorrow at the Marriott PHL, front and center.

What time is the meeting?

 

[I Was... Now US]

So any details on the PHL meeting today?

 

[AlleghenyVista]

If you make yourself available for "Aggresive Reserve" status (like the current quick call status), you may NOT use the hours earned from a call resulting from putting yourself on AGG towards calling out of time.

READ: CONCESSION.

See you guys tomorrow at the Marriott PHL, front and center.

Agressive Reserve has nothing to do with being on quick call. So many people are saying its the new quick call. Being an Agressive Reserve takes you to the top of the list for reserve processing with daily scheduling instead of the proposed inverse order of processing daily trips. Example:Your RAP starts at 6am. Ends at 6pm. You notice a nice trip going out at 3pm....you can call sched and make youself Agressive and get the trip if nobody senior to you has gone Agressive as well.