American Airlines, pilots hit snag on contract

[Hatu]

FORT WORTH -- Talks between American Airlines and its pilots union have stalled over issues of pay and "scope," meaning specific work rules.
In a message to pilots late Monday, Allied Pilots Association President Keith Wilson said an agreement has been reached on language for most of a new contract.
"The main obstacle to reaching our goal of an industry standard contract is scope -- specifically as it pertains to the size and seat capacity of the larger regional jet," Wilson said.
Wilson detailed some of the items that the two sides have agreed on:
A six-year contract, with an option to renegotiate in the fourth year.
Pay raises of 4 percent in year one, 2 percent in years two, three, five and six, and a midcontract adjustment in year four.
A 14 percent contribution to a 401(k) plan; the two pilot pensions were frozen Thursday.
A 13.5 percent equity stake in the new carrier after bankruptcy.
A 90-hour average individual monthly work maximum for pilots.
No other pilot bases, aside from St. Louis, will be closed until at least the fourth quarter of 2013.

http://www.star-tele...nk=digger-topic

 

[FWAAA]

The APA continues its desire to micro-manage AA by objecting to more favorable scope provisions than the bankruptcy court approved in September. Based on current mainline fleet size, the term sheet limits would permit AA to fly up to 304 large RJs (51-88 seats) and AA has offered to scale that back (both in the LBFO and currently) to 304 large RJs with 51-79 seats.

The APA argues that it worries that AA will fly large numbers of large RJs to avoid hiring APA pilots. History has demonstrated that AA will not fly mainline planes instead of 79 seat RJs regardless of APA's success in "winning" on this issue and tying management's hands. No legacy airline will fly 120 seat jets on routes where 79 seats is the appropriate capacity. If APA manages to "win" by getting management to agree to a cap of, say, 100 or 150 large RJs, that just accelerates AA's second Ch 11 filing - it won't cause AA to fly mainline planes instead.

 

[amt66]

Had a feeling eventually they wouldn't agree

 

[jimntx]

I loved the press release that said that the company and the union were close to reaching a TA. It stated that only 3 issues were still undecided--furlough protection, pay, and scope. Hell, aren't those the 3 issues that they have been disagreeing about for the past several years? What did they agree on? Potty breaks? Uniform color?

 

[eolesen]

Yet APA would have no problem agreeing to the contract USAPA is working under, right?...

The mind, it boggles...

 

[Hatu]

LOL jimntx, those were my first thoughts too upon reading the article!

 

[WorldTraveler]

I loved the press release that said that the company and the union were close to reaching a TA. It stated that only 3 issues were still undecided--furlough protection, pay, and scope. Hell, aren't those the 3 issues that they have been disagreeing about for the past several years? What did they agree on? Potty breaks? Uniform color?

apparently the same issues are sticking points for UA as well..... w/ an element of dividing signing bonus pay between PMUA and PMCO pilots thrown in....
so AA pilots can be thankful there are no merger issues to consider....

 

[777 / 767 / 757 Love]

If I was AA management I would just walk away.....Jesus, this Scope is ridiculous. APA is living in some alternate reality.

Let them make this deal: Scope can be whatever they want, but the APA has to schedule aircraft and let them answer to the creditors and other employees when they funk up everything. Stop telling management how to do their jobs or maybe management should send a rep into the cockpit and tell you how to fly.

UCC is gonna take thE US offer and then the APA is gonna find out what getting fu***d really feels like.

Cheers,
777 / 767 / 757

 

[WorldTraveler]

AA's pilots are playing on the real need that AA mgmt has to get out of BK - and get a pay raise - alongside the APA's desire to get a decent contract.
They stood up to fight.... whether they are successful or not, you can't help but admire them for not caving.

AA mgmt waited for years to file for BK even when other carriers were doing so - in part because AA mgmt was able to continue to justify bonuses on the fact that all of the other legacies were in BK.

It should have been clear - I have pointed it out for years - that AA would have a much more difficult time restructuring because AA would have to compete and be compared to other legacy carriers that had finished their restructuring in BK and had moved on to other phases in their restructuring.

AA labor is not unreasonable to expect AA mgmt to now have to consider the wages and benefits of AA's peers today even though in SOME cases AA labor enjoyed above average salary AND/OR benefits while other carriers were in the midst of their restructuring.

 

[Bob Owens]

If I was AA management I would just walk away.....Jesus, this Scope is ridiculous. APA is living in some alternate reality.

Let them make this deal: Scope can be whatever they want, but the APA has to schedule aircraft and let them answer to the creditors and other employees when they funk up everything. Stop telling management how to do their jobs or maybe management should send a rep into the cockpit and tell you how to fly.

UCC is gonna take thE US offer and then the APA is gonna find out what getting fu***d really feels like.

Cheers,
777 / 767 / 757

Good walk away, then let the UCC take alternate plans from other bidders.

 

[AAviator]

The APA continues its desire to micro-manage AA by objecting to more favorable scope provisions than the bankruptcy court approved in September. Based on current mainline fleet size, the term sheet limits would permit AA to fly up to 304 large RJs (51-88 seats) and AA has offered to scale that back (both in the LBFO and currently) to 304 large RJs with 51-79 seats.

The APA argues that it worries that AA will fly large numbers of large RJs to avoid hiring APA pilots. History has demonstrated that AA will not fly mainline planes instead of 79 seat RJs regardless of APA's success in "winning" on this issue and tying management's hands. No legacy airline will fly 120 seat jets on routes where 79 seats is the appropriate capacity. If APA manages to "win" by getting management to agree to a cap of, say, 100 or 150 large RJs, that just accelerates AA's second Ch 11 filing - it won't cause AA to fly mainline planes instead.

FWAAA, industry standard is 76 seats. Both UAL new T/A and DAL scope caps the seating at 76 seats. AA's proposal would be the new upper limit in the industry in seating and weight class.

The 1113c was a gun to our head, and the judge granted it... it's in the company pocket if they choose that route.



Your assessment that APA is micromanaging the company is absurd. To think that you thing that the APA leadership wants to force the company to fly 120 seat aircraft from DFW to places like Waco, and Tyler Texas is ludicrous. No farther commentary is necessary.. You are flat - out to lunch on that.

We're taking about overreaching here again.. The industry standard is 76 seats. We'll see how this week plays out. Either we get 76 seats, or we step into the great unknown.

 

[AAviator]

Yet APA would have no problem agreeing to the contract USAPA is working under, right?...

The mind, it boggles...

Where did you come up with that? USAPA represented pilots aren't working under any contract they've negotiated. APA has a CLA with LCC that would be the stepping stone to a new CBA via a post merger transition agreement. BTW the CLA blows away both of the the east and west contracts in place at LCC...

But you already knew that.... B)

Your comments, well, boggle the mind... (no Yoda-isms for me)!

 

[wings396]

Yet APA would have no problem agreeing to the contract USAPA is working under, right?...

The mind, it boggles...

Your mind must be boggled, as they weren't going to work under the USAPA contract, or even the union for that matter.

 

[signals]

Since I don't want to start a topic...

http://www.nbcnews.com/travel/more-flights-arriving-late-american-most-tardy-1C6953094

 

[Bob Owens]

Since I don't want to start a topic...

http://www.nbcnews.c...tardy-1C6953094

Passengers reported a slightly lower [background=transparent]rate[/background] of lost or mishandled baggage — wayward bags were a bigger problem on regional airlines that connect passengers to bigger airlines at large, hub airports.

Think that may have to do with the fact that more and more people jam their bags into the overheads and with the RJs the bins are so small you have to check your bag?