Comic Relief

[UAL_TECH]

If AMFA accepts this POS we'll be making as much as the TWU.
Then you know whose turn it is 'again'.........
(Of course we don't have your 'Iron-Clad' layoff language :blink: )

http://www.the-mechanic.com/pdf/ual-proposal-nov2004-.pdf

From The-Mechanic.com:

Greetings All,
I received a copy of what appears to be the concessionary proposal submitted by UAL to the AMFA today. Read this document carefully. Personally, I believe the pact should be presented to the membership IMMEDIATELY for a ratification vote 'as is', and a strike vote should occur simultaneously. The proposal should be decisively rejected; the strike vote should pass overwhelmingly; and without hesitation the AMFA should take the legal steps necessary to strike the carrier.

Click here, PDF format, 289K. - TM

Thanks TM, I agree 100% !!!

Take Care,
UAL_TECH

 

[Nightwatch]

Associated Press
United Details New Contract Proposals
Thursday November 4, 10:28 pm ET
By Anna Johnson, Associated Press Writer


Medina said United hopes to reach consensual agreements with the unions on the contracts. If not, the carrier can ask the bankruptcy judge to impose cuts, Medina said.

Hold on to your ***, this is another "catch 22" proposition tendered by UAL. Our industry is being transformed through the BK courts. I read the proposal UAL_Tech, they are asking for the moon, every item seems to be raped, up to and including unlimited overseas outsourcing.

I wish you all the best of luck and wish our unions could pull together during this time of our careers.

 

[Nightwatch]

NWA to overhaul its debts

November 3, 2004






BY HARRIS RUBINROIT
BLOOMBERG



JPMorgan Chase & Co., Deutsche Bank AG and Citigroup Inc. are restructuring a $975-million loan for Northwest Airlines Corp., the fourth-largest U.S. carrier, said Mary Stanik, a Northwest spokeswoman.


Lenders will hold a meeting in New York City to market the loan today, Stanik said.


Lenders to Northwest agreed to waive some rights to demand early repayment on the existing credit as long as the airline's unrestricted cash remains above $1.7 billion, the company said in a U.S. Securities and Exchange Commission filing on Oct. 28. Northwest had unrestricted cash totaling $2.54 billion as of Sept. 30, according to the filing.


The company, the largest carrier at Detroit Metro Airport, said on Oct. 20 it was seeking to restructure its $975 million-revolving credit, which matures in October 2005, and $962 million was outstanding. A revolving credit can be borrowed from again once it's repaid.


The airline, based in Eagan, Minn., has been seeking $950 million in annual concessions from workers and reached a tentative contract with the pilots union Oct. 14 that would cut pay and benefits to save the company $265 million each year.

 

[TIME FOR CHANGE]

:down:

Look at the bright side you still get one more holiday than we do and better vacation language. It is a shame you lost that 4 thousand dollar death and dismemberment clause.

Shut em down boys Its not worth it :down:

 

[Bob Owens]

Hold on to your ***, this is another "catch 22" proposition tendered by UAL. Our industry is being transformed through the BK courts. I read the proposal UAL_Tech, they are asking for the moon, every item seems to be raped, up to and including unlimited overseas outsourcing.

I wish you all the best of luck and wish our unions could pull together during this time of our careers.

[post="198173"][/post]​

No kidding, and the union leaders are letting it happen.

Back in early 2003, before the company/TWU perpetrated their "shock and awe" campain on the membership , when UAL was threatening to seek to have a judge abrogate UALs contract I sent out an E-mail calling on all our unions (AFL-CIO) to send a clear message to all parties concerned that if any labor agreement is abrogated that we should all walk out.

Jim Little demanded that I retract the statement. He claimed that my statement was putting the membership in danger. I replied that his inaction was what was putting us in danger, that once one agreement was abrogated-(or the threat of it used to get concessions) that the same thing would happen to the rest of us.

A year later what I said has come to pass, we are making 25% less, seen thousands of jobs eliminated and Jim Little, well he never took a paycut, in fact the TWU promoted him.

Do you still trust these guys?

Do you still believe that these unions have any fight whatsoever?

At what point would you agree that its time we try something new?

The fact is that these unions have no reason to pull together, they are just businesses competing with each other for dues, but since they are AFL-CIO affiliated the only way they can compete is by helping the companies get the lowest labor rates. The AFL-CIO's No Raid clause means that they can't go through the members and elections for each others members, so instead they go through the companies and try to put the other unions company out of business.

 

[Bob Owens]

:down:

Look at the bright side you still get one more holiday than we do and better vacation language. It is a shame you lost that 4 thousand dollar death and dismemberment clause.

Shut em down boys Its not worth it :down:

[post="198192"][/post]​

Its something where these other carriers that are on their second or third round of concessions, in bankruptcy, still have not cought up to the TWUs first round of concessions that were given outside of BK!

 

[local 12 proud]

Its something where these other carriers that are on their second or third round of concessions, in bankruptcy, still have not cought up to the TWUs first round of concessions that were given outside of BK!

[post="198242"][/post]​

[/quotenot to worry we will soon lower the bar for them even further! the TWU wil not be outdone

 

[Nightwatch]

Its something where these other carriers that are on their second or third round of concessions, in bankruptcy, still have not cought up to the TWUs first round of concessions that were given outside of BK!

Bob, O thought I read that UAL was requesting the ability to have 100% outsourcing overseas. AA is not quite there, at least not yet. The thing is Bob, they either approve it or the BK judge gives it to AMFA doggystyle.

 

[Ken MacTiernan]

Bob, O thought I read that UAL was requesting the ability to have 100% outsourcing overseas. AA is not quite there, at least not yet. The thing is Bob, they either approve it or the BK judge gives it to AMFA doggystyle.

[post="198336"][/post]​

nw, once again you show your twu inspired ability to fight for our profession... "they either approve it or the BK judge gives it to AMFA doggystyle." AMFA is NOT the twu. AMFA will not give into such laughable demands from UAL. AMFA will fight just like the twu did when the twu picketed the White House and faced a PBE. Oops, wait that was AMFA that did those things. The twu threatened a full revote and then lied about it and accepted concessions AFTER the company was caught cheating on their shared sacrifice. You truely are pathetic.

The twu... where we have never met a concession we didn't like. h34r:

 

[Nightwatch]

Ken, I actually do wish the best for the AMFA members at UAL, but their vote has not yet occurred. Let's try this, let's try worrying about the future of our profession instead of whose damn union is better than the others.

It's time to coordinate and pool our resources.

 

[UAL_TECH]

Ken, I actually do wish the best for the AMFA members at UAL, but their vote has not yet occurred. Let's try this, let's try worrying about the future of our profession instead of whose damn union is better than the others.

It's time to coordinate and pool our resources.

[post="198526"][/post]​

Nightwatch,

FYI, I was one of the IAM members in SFO working the picket line for EAL as well.

I have always been an active member of the IAM until they negated their duties and responsibilities by not allowing us a strike vote at our (UAL) last concessionary contract. What choices did we have?

If the IAM had stood firm in their viewpoint and stood strong, then I doubt any of us would be here pointing fingers as to who is the better union.

All of us have reaped the benefits of our EAL Brother and Sisters and have not given a tinkers damn in respect to those that have sacrificed so much in regards to their personal lives, families, and economic future as have these honorable people.

UNION is not just a ‘word’, it’s a way of life!!!

AMFA is more of a ‘union’ than the unions that exist today.

When we shut down UAL and your job is secure, be comfortable that honorable men and women have sacrificed their livelihood to keep yours.

Hopefully, you will have the intestinal fortitude to do the same when your number is called (but I #### doubt it!!!)

And when you cross our picket line, you will always blame it on our non-affiliation to the AFL/CIO.

So, Nightwatch, you can continue your hopeless attack on AMFA in your misguided allegiance to the IAM but the fact of the matter is that the IAM is not in allegiance to you and/or I. In regards to your support of the TWU, you will be as disappointed in them as you were with the IAM.

I’d rather have AMFA than any of the AFL/CIO suck asses that we have today.

JMHO,
UT

 

[Bob Owens]

Bob, O thought I read that UAL was requesting the ability to have 100% outsourcing overseas. AA is not quite there, at least not yet. The thing is Bob, they either approve it or the BK judge gives it to AMFA doggystyle.

[post="198336"][/post]​

So they are going to outsource their gate calls at LAX, ORD, NYC or even MCI to overseas? The fact is once a Judge allows the company to change the contract the RLA no longer prevents the workers from striking.

Everything in the RLA centers around the maintenence of status quo, that both parties continue to abide by the terms they agreed to prior to the dispute.

The sad fact is that so far the unions have allowed themselves to be strongarmed into agreeing to every concession granted by the court. They may have voiced displeasure but they have not acted against anythingand in the end agreed to the changes. Not once has any union stood their ground.

Under what pretense could a judge force workers to continue to work for a company? Sure he can issue an injuction, and the unions should cite the RLA and ignore it. How many times did the Reverend King simply disobey Judges orders and assert his rights as an American?

The RLA is a law, made by the representatives of the people, it is explicit in this regard, a Judge does not have the right to make laws to suit himself, or his wealthy friends. It is our duty to assert our rights, rights given to us by law, especially in the face of some corrupt judges orders.There is nothing in the RLA about allowing the company to change rates of pay or other work rules through a Judge. It is clear however that once the company unilaterally puts changes into effect they have the right to strike, the judge can go to hell, and thats what any union leader with a pair would tell him.

 

[Drippy Quill]

How's that pension coming along at UAL...great fight AMFA!

 

[Bob Owens]

How's that pension coming along at UAL...great fight AMFA!

[post="199479"][/post]​

Why dont you ask the AFL-CIO affiliated ALPA, IAM and CWA the same question?

The fact is that Gless has already told members that when UAL loses the pension so will we.

 

[Drippy Quill]

So are you going to thank AMFA for it's leadership skills? Bet not....HAHAHA!!!