Delta is starting service from JFK To Sao Paulo on June 1. Is this really a good roye for them. From Atlanta they are flying to lots of Latin America but from New York they have been uncompetitive. AA flies a 777 daily, Varig flies daily also & TAM (flies double daily Sao Paulo-Miami) is daily or almost daily. Whose market share is Delta trying to squeeze? The Brazilian airlines would be uncompetitive to Atlanta but to JFK they are long entrenched. A 767-300ER with Biz Elite sounds nice but I think this is just another route to get an airplane off the domestic side.
Delta is flying from JFK to Sao Paulo
- Thread starter JFK777
- Start date
JFK777,
I'd expect DL would get their most loyal DL customers, who to this point are using another carrier.
Now whether "It's" enough to be $$$ successful remains to be seen.
Mabey they(DL) could put 1 of their half dozen 777's on that route ?
NH/BB's
I'd expect DL would get their most loyal DL customers, who to this point are using another carrier.
Now whether "It's" enough to be $$$ successful remains to be seen.
Mabey they(DL) could put 1 of their half dozen 777's on that route ?
NH/BB's
The GorillAA will crush them out of JFK! Flying a 767 versus a 777 that far...Hmmm, I take the 777!
- Thread Starter
- #4
I doubt DL would use 777 on this route because they would 2 airplanes. The plane leaving Jfk for Sao Paulo tonight arrives there tomorrow morning, spends all day on the ground and the return flight to JFK departs SAO Paulo 24 hours after leavng JFK arriving back in New York 36 hours after leaving. All flights from the USA to Brazil, Argentina and Chile do this, overnight both ways.
All major north - south intercontinental routes do this. Ever seen all the Qantas 747's spending most of the day at LAX, they arrive from Aussie late morning or early afternoon but return in the late evening, same for Air New Zealand. South Africa's airports are the same during the day, all these European airplanes resting for the overnights back to LHR, FRA etc.
All major north - south intercontinental routes do this. Ever seen all the Qantas 747's spending most of the day at LAX, they arrive from Aussie late morning or early afternoon but return in the late evening, same for Air New Zealand. South Africa's airports are the same during the day, all these European airplanes resting for the overnights back to LHR, FRA etc.
Delta has been trying to build JFK-latin america for a long time, but every time the route applications come up they seem to lose to Continental.
- Thread Starter
- #6
Continental already does EWR-Sao Paulo, so the route is already full of competition, UA tried when they won Pan Am's Latin Division but they gave up for Chicago - Sao Paulo instead. DL is going to be in for a fight. I'll take the AA 777 flight.
WorldTraveler
Corn Field
- Dec 5, 2003
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The vast majority of passengers are completely indifferent to the aircraft they fly; yes, I would rather fly a 777 but in reality, I'd really want a 777 and then not let anyone else on it besides me. Back to reality, though. DL has a pretty strong frequent flyer base in NYC and the NE and they clearly are hearing from their frequent flyers that they have to diversify beyond their traditional north-south domestic and continental Europe base. CO and AA both serve Asia and London; DL can't serve the latter at this time but is apparently not willing to try again for the former just yet.
Despite everyone's predictions to the contrary, DL has taken a respectable position at the transcontinental US table. DL notes that they serve more cities from LGA than any other airline and still serve more of Europe from JFK than AA, which is heavily concentrated at LHR. GRU is just one more route in a pretty good sized NYC arsenal that DL will use to be a major player in NYC. It is interesting to note that AA, CO, and DL all intend to be strong players in NYC - one of the few cities in the world w/ so much comparable service from so many airlines. Lucky NYC - doesn't hurt to be the biggest air travel market in the world.
DL also can connect alot of passengers over JFK that currently fly through ATL to Brazil so I don't think they'll have any problems making money there. DL also does a pretty good cargo business at JFK and S. America is exactly the market to make it work.
Despite everyone's predictions to the contrary, DL has taken a respectable position at the transcontinental US table. DL notes that they serve more cities from LGA than any other airline and still serve more of Europe from JFK than AA, which is heavily concentrated at LHR. GRU is just one more route in a pretty good sized NYC arsenal that DL will use to be a major player in NYC. It is interesting to note that AA, CO, and DL all intend to be strong players in NYC - one of the few cities in the world w/ so much comparable service from so many airlines. Lucky NYC - doesn't hurt to be the biggest air travel market in the world.
DL also can connect alot of passengers over JFK that currently fly through ATL to Brazil so I don't think they'll have any problems making money there. DL also does a pretty good cargo business at JFK and S. America is exactly the market to make it work.
- Thread Starter
- #8
DL's market from NYC is very proce sensitive and goes to Florida. To California AA has the Screen Actors Guild traffic and fills the premuim cabins with them. Song is neat and its colors are special but how many First or Business Class Passengers are flying Delta to California from JFK?
WorldTraveler
Corn Field
- Dec 5, 2003
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in case you missed it... Song is going bye bye and you can bet DL will be back w/ first class cabins on the transcons. I don't think it was smart dumping the FC cabins to begin w/ but they will be back. Remember that DL has flown the transcon markets for 14 years (since Pan Am) so there is a base of customers who will fly Delta up front. There is a smarter group managing DL now and they recognize that transcons are premium, not leisure markets.
luv2fly
Veteran
WorldTraveler
Corn Field
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luv,
how about Grinstein, Whitehurst, and Hauenstein for starters. check delta.com.
I'm sure the SAG is good business but there are 20 million other people who live in NYC and LAX who aren't actors and they fly too. even up front!
how about Grinstein, Whitehurst, and Hauenstein for starters. check delta.com.
I'm sure the SAG is good business but there are 20 million other people who live in NYC and LAX who aren't actors and they fly too. even up front!
luv2fly
Veteran
I was thinking you would say that. Now please excuse me while I laugh myself to death.
DL is a rudderless ship. Our customer service is in the trash. Morale is at an all time low.
But hey, Good goes around. Did I mention our marketing bites as well?
I'll agree, but it's kind of funny that pilots are just now complaining about DL's poor customer service. DL's service was not much better four years ago, but I didn't hear the pilots complaining then. As long as they were the best paid, they didn't seem to care that the service was garbage.
Same as the pilots didn't care that DL was taking on billions of debt just to fund operations after 9/11. As long as they were the highest paid, they didn't mind DL burying itself alive in debt.
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