Driving away customers

TomBascom

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Aug 20, 2002
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[blockquote]
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On 10/11/2002 3:27:45 PM RealityCheck wrote:
These figures are meaningless while US AIRWAYS chases its customers away on a daily basis. SHORT the stock(if you can go any lower), cuz it ain''t going up anytime soon.
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[/blockquote]
Case in point -- yesterday I tried to buy a ticket.
I had called reservations Tuesday night for to arrange some future travel. I wanted to use up a couple of unused e-tix and travel vouchers. Plus cash to cover the difference. One e-ticket was handled ok. The other couldn''t be used by me because it was in my wife''s name (ok, I pretty much expected that -- it''s still incredibly dumb. I was hoping that maybe I''d missed a sensible rules change at some point though) and I had to spend 30 minutes with consumer affairs Wednesday to get that (hopefully) taken care of (less $100 of course). The other ticket I couldn''t buy over the phone because of the vouchers -- so the agent said that it could be held and I could present the vouchers at the airport since I was going to be in IND on Thursday.
No problem??? Hah!
I got to IND almost 2 hours early yesterday. Instead of using the Kiosk I went to the preferred line (you may recall that the preferred line is one of those benefits that Ben B. touts as being so very, very valuable to frequent fliers...) There were two people ahead of me and 2 at the counter. One agent finished up a person and took another. He quickly took care of that one and then strolled off to the break area. That''s ok I thought, it isn''t real busy -- this is as good a time as any and I''m in no hurry.
Then about 30 people swarmed the regular line. I think there were 3 or 4 agents working that part of things.
Meanwhile the sole agent working the preferred line is still working on the customer that was there when I queued up. 20 minutes have gone by. Finally that one finishes and the guy ahead of me steps up -- nope! You need to step back sir this lady over here is next... There was some lady who had been on her cell phone the whole time hovering by the counter -- apparently working out something with reservations? So he works with her for another 20 minutes or so. Meanwhile the regular line is down to about 4 people. It''s getting tempting to just jump on over... Then the guy ahead of me gets his turn. He was quick and easy. I get waved up and the guy says just a minute and takes off... I''m waiting, and waiting, and waiting and the people in back of me are quite incredulous at this farce. Meanwhile a lady comes out from the back and signs in on the other terminal. Then she pulls the next person in line. I''ve yet to speak to an agent... The guy who went on his break comes back and sees this other lady on his terminal so they trade places. My guy finally comes back. He checks me in. I ask him about an upgrade -- nope, you didn''t make it. Am I on the list? Yes. Could you check? Yes, oh, wait no you aren''t -- I''ll put you on it. There, you''re #7 (hint: don''t fly out of IND on a Thursday afternoon if you''re looking to upgrade -- all of my failed attempts this year have been Thursdays out of IND. Ok, now I''m thinking I''m ready -- I''d like to buy a ticket. There''s a reservation being held for 10/30... and I''d like to use these (show him the vouchers).
Now the fun starts. What are those? I explain. (Note to Ben: Preferred lines ought to be staffed by people with some basic knowledge of your product.) So what does he do? He tells me that I''m going to miss my flight -- it''ll take him at least half an hour to process them! I''m incredulous. He reassures me that it will take that long -- he''s going to have to call the help desk and wait on hold and all sorts of awful things. I mention that the CP desk didn''t tell me that this was going to be such a problem. Oh it''s always a big problem he says. All sorts of ugly forms and things to be filled out. I''m having a very hard time holding my temper (and, yes, it showed. I''m not proud of that.) So I said fine, just use this -- and I hand him my credit card (a DM Visa BTW.)
Now it gets really good... The system won''t take it. So he calls the help desk (the help desk that was going to be putting him on hold before -- it took a bit of dancing around with the other guy to find the phone#) It seems that the fare was a 21 day advance and this is only 20 days. Nope, nothing we can do. Well, there is another fare -- $720 (vs the $348 quote). No thanks I say. Then I rant a bit about driving customers away. I tried to make it clear that my ire was directed at the airline rather than the employee but I likely failed.
Before someone jumps all over me on the 21 day thing -- remember that I was ready to buy this Tuesday night, that (right or wrong) I was told that I could buy it Thursday by simply showing up and presenting my vouchers (and paying the difference) and that it was never disclosed to me that it was a 21 day advance (I knew it was an advance purchase and a non-refundable but to the extent that I thought about it at all I probably thought it was a 14 day advance.) And even at $348 this is more than $0.50/mile -- the airline is making out like a bandit on it.
So I went to the club to cool off -- I still had about 20 minutes and the club @ IND is very close to the gate. The guy checking me in at the club asked how things were going -- so I told him. I was still pretty hot about it too.
This next part is why I love the airline and haven''t been driven off yet.
He asked a couple of more questions, sympathized a bit and calmed me down. Then he said that he''d work on the problem for me. I really didn''t think he''d have any luck but I appreciated the offer. On the way out I thanked him for calming me down and he told me to check again when I got to PHL -- I had a long layover so that wasn''t a problem.
I got to PHL and went down to the ticket counter. Another long wait in the preferred line... (are you listening Ben?) Finally I get my shot. So I explain to the guy what I want to do. He pulls up the reservation, reads the notes, collects my vouchers, takes my credit card and hands back an itinerary and receipt all in about 3 minutes.
Oh, then I went back updstairs to the PHL Club. While I was there I got the address of the person in charge of the IND club -- I''ve got a letter to write. And, just for kicks, I asked where I was in the upgrade queue. Guess what? The ticket counter guy in IND hadn''t put me in the que for the 2nd leg... we fixed that though and I ended up in 4c.
 

RealityCheck

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Aug 20, 2002
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Well here is my take on the situation in the order it occured:
NUMBER 1-The rez agt you spoke to Tues night shld have quoted you that the rez would be valid til WED night, not Thurs night, assuming its a non ref 24 hr hold.If they were going to hold it an extra 24 hrs because of the voucher situation, there is a waiver they could have used as a courtesy at their discretion(pax lives far from ATO waiver), so perhaps agent forgot to either put in waiver if you had a lot to discuss or put in waiver but neglected to change Sabres automatic time limit to an extra 24 hrs.BUT this waiver wouldn't legally work because if it is a 21 day adv fare, than Thursday is too late to ticket this for 10-30 travel ..which is what INDY said, i.e only 20 days, and there is no secondary rez waiver to break 24 hr rule and break the 21 day adv..thats asking way too much..LOL........yet ..if it was documented in error as a waiver for extra time and no mention of fare expiring, than INDY shd have honred the fare per rez agt error..and perhaps that is what PHILLY ended up doing but Indy was too afraid or too lazy or too inexperienced to go that route.And likely, with all the conflict, forgot to list you F class on seg 2.I can guarantee you all this is likely what happened, I have seen this before too many times(not sure on the f class mishap)

Number 2- re:The line thing, no one employed in AMERICA at a cust svc facility knows how to coordinate fairly a customer line. Think how irate you get while waiting in line with your cart or your bankbook 10 minutes and one or 2 people behind you who just showed up get to go to the new line when employee X just coming on duty shouts NEXT or I CAN HELP YOU OVER HERE MA'M! How fair is that??
The whole line thingy in INDY sounded pathetic and needs some work. And understaffing is becoming ridiculous.But does anyone care at this point? Certainly no one in UM.

Number3-The fact that Consumer Affairs allowed a transfer of ticket value from wife to you is shocking, to say the least, even with the 100 fee. Though I may not agree 100pct with policy, I have to quote it, and enforce it, and so does cust svc, and we are told CA is supposed to back us up on this and not allow any further pre-travel waivers WHEN AGENT ERROR IS NOT INVOLVED.. Well thats a big A$$ lie it appears. So now one person does it, it will domino and more and more will start going to CA for these type waivers. And the whole system will unravel again because either no one stix to their guns like they're supposed to or no one reforms the system to modify procedures on such issues.

There is no excuse for inconsistency, no excuse for apathy,no excuse for not being allowed to see outside the box and work out issues/mistakes/service without fear of the guillotine.
But that, I am sorry to say, is the USAIRWAYS of the 21st century, and why, along with world economy issues and reduced productivity in a newly slashed compensation environment of an overworked understaffed employee group, the company will never survive.

Speaking of productivity, how productive shld one be, for the rest of the year, who will have 20 hours of vacation pay (400.00)deducted for retro payback to JULY 1(3/4 rate for 2 weeks), while those who took all their vacation before the new contract got all their weeks vac and holidays at full pay?

No one ever addressed this issue.
 

resconcerns

Member
Sep 11, 2002
26
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These things happen to me every day when I go to the grocery store, WMT, bank, video store, restaurant, hotel, drug store and on and on. I spend lots of monies at these locations. I have learned when I set my foot out the front door, that I will be met with long lines, rude employees, unreasonable work policies . Unfortunately I know in todays economic climate not to be treated special and I know that if I feel I want special treatment I must make every effort to follow whats expected of me. Case in point the 21 day advance fare. Knowing that I have a voucher that I must turn in (just like a store coupon, because I know I'm not going to get this credit until I present it) and it has an expiration date and I show up after the expiration date, then how can I blame the store
for not wanting to honor it? I could of course go the the manager and say I tried to come in yesterday. Should I be treated special, when I knew I should have used this coupon yesterday?
The 21 day fare WOULD have canceled automatically on the 22nd day, I'm surprised there was still a reservation. As far as using someone elses voucher, I know when I go to the bank with my spouses check, they're not gonna cash it without my spouse being there with ID.
When I leave to go to work in a bit, I know my day will consist of working with folks that want to be treated special.......
 

KCFlyer

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Aug 20, 2002
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[BR][BR]
[BLOCKQUOTE][BR]----------------[BR]On 10/12/2002 6:49:06 AM resconcerns wrote:[BR][BR]As far as using someone elses voucher, I know when I go to the bank with my spouses check, they're not gonna cash it without my spouse being there with ID. [BR]When I leave to go to work in a bit, I know my day will consist of working with folks that want to be treated special.......[BR]----------------[/BLOCKQUOTE][BR][BR]Bad example there resconcerns...see, all your spouse has to do is endorse the check over to you, that is , write the words Pay To the Order of Resconcerns on the back of the check, then endorse it. All the bank does is check the signature on file, sees it's your spouse, and happily cashes the check. Can't do that on a voucher or an airline ticket. That's some service. To quote a gal in a Southwest video (20 years of LUV) - Service - that's the word that my grandaddy used when I asked him what that bull was doing with that cow. Airlines need to relearn how to Serve their customers. We've pretty much been serviced enough.
 
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TomBascom

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Just to clear up a few things:

1) CA did not allow me to apply my wife's ticket to my travel needs. They did, however, refund it. (U canceled the flight due to 9/11 -- I didn't take the refund back then because I had hopes of still taking the trip.) They nailed me for $100 because, according to them, there is a $100 fee for it being more than a year old. Odd that that was never previously disclosed. Strange too that I've been told 13 months any number of times.

(But I'm far from shocked to have a $100 fee sprung on me out of nowhere. I've come to expect those whenever I deal with the airline. I think of it as a speaking fee. I'm sure that $100 boarding fees are on the horizon any moment now.)

1a) As it is the refund is being credited to a CC that no longer exists. I'm hoping that amex rejects it because then U will send me a check (at least that's what the lady in CA said). If amex accepts it I will then have to figure out how to get a check from them. Which promises to be almost as much fun as dealing with U. And I have no way to know what the status of this whole mess is other than making random calls to call center hell.

2) There was no expiration date anywhere that I could find or that anyone could show me on the vouchers. There is an issue date but that's it.

Just a few opinions:

1) I paid for the tickets. This stuff about not being able to transfer them to another person is crap. It may be in the rules but it's still crap.

2) Undisclosed expiration dates and junk fees are crap too. It's no wonder that people would rather go to the dentist than deal with an airline. These sorts of rules are a big part of the reason that people despise the major airlines and love SWA. It's not all about price.

3) All of this stuff did nothing useful for the airline. It got in the way of me spending my money with you in your time of need (remember -- I put cash into this transaction as well as the vouchers and unused ticket.) It also caused at least 4 employees to spend an aggregate of at least three hours dealing with the issues when they could have been doing far more productive things. It shouldn't have been that hard. If the ridiculous rules hadn't been in the way the whole transaction could have been completed in about 10 minutes during the first call and U would have had a happy customer.

If a fraction of the effort that goes into creating these rules (to say nothing of the effort that goes into enforcing them) had instead been spent automating the process of claiming vouchers and unused tickets nobody except me would have needed to lift a finger.

4) Yes, service stinks all over. That's not a reason to embrace bad service as a standard.
 

Tango-Bravo

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Aug 29, 2002
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[blockquote]
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On 10/12/2002 8:46:03 AM TomBascom wrote:

2) Undisclosed expiration dates and junk fees are crap too. It's no wonder that people would rather go to the dentist than deal with an airline. These sorts of rules are a big part of the reason that people despise the major airlines and love SWA. It's not all about price.


3) All of this stuff did nothing useful for the airline. It got in the way of me spending my money with you in your time of need (remember -- I put cash into this transaction as well as the vouchers and unused ticket.) It also caused at least 4 employees to spend an aggregate of at least three hours dealing with the issues when they could have been doing far more productive things. It shouldn't have been that hard. If the ridiculous rules hadn't been in the way the whole transaction could have been completed in about 10 minutes during the first call and U would have had a happy customer.


If a fraction of the effort that goes into creating these rules (to say nothing of the effort that goes into enforcing them) had instead been spent automating the process of claiming vouchers and unused tickets nobody except me would have needed to lift a finger.


4) Yes, service stinks all over. That's not a reason to embrace bad service as a standard.
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Tom: you are very much on to something with these points though you probably don't even know the half of what you speak; i.e. the inordinate amount of time, energy and re$ource$ $quandered by the full-service majors in dealing with convoluted fares, rules and frequent flier programs is at least twice as preposterous as you probably imagine it to be.

Instead of being free to focus on real customer service (like the Employees of Southwest) most of the time and energy of any frontline customer service employee at a full-service major is wa$ted in trying to keep up with the plethora of nonsense and games perpetrated upon customers and frontline employees alike by totally out-of-touch sales/marketing, pricing, and ff program staff who can isolate themselves from all the umbrage created by their shenanigans. Upper management is even more to blame for their complicity in allowing the tail to wag the dog unabated.

And yes, the inestimable co$$$t of all the foolishness is probably far beyond what I imagine it to be, even from my front row seat at a full-service major who seems to get off on copying all the stupid things the Big Six have done to themselves, their customers and their employees while totally ignoring the sensible, customer/employee friendly -- and highly profitable -- keep-it-simple, -understandable and -consistent models of Southwest and jetBlue.

Much of the reason for service stinking all over, including the airlines, is because of the bewildering array of totally convoluted, bait-and-switch (i.e. misleading), indefensible products and terms that are dumped on frontline employees to deliver on behalf of businesses that have taken total leave of their senses.
 

RealityCheck

Senior
Aug 20, 2002
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[blockquote]
----------------
On 10/12/2002 8:46:03 AM TomBascom wrote:

Just to clear up a few things:

1) CA did not allow me to apply my wife's ticket to my travel needs. They did, however, refund it. (U canceled the flight due to 9/11 -- I didn't take the refund back then because I had hopes of still taking the trip.) They nailed me for $100 because, according to them, there is a $100 fee for it being more than a year old. Odd that that was never previously disclosed. Strange too that I've been told 13 months any number of times.

(But I'm far from shocked to have a $100 fee sprung on me out of nowhere. I've come to expect those whenever I deal with the airline. I think of it as a speaking fee. I'm sure that $100 boarding fees are on the horizon any moment now.)

1a) As it is the refund is being credited to a CC that no longer exists. I'm hoping that amex rejects it because then U will send me a check (at least that's what the lady in CA said). If amex accepts it I will then have to figure out how to get a check from them. Which promises to be almost as much fun as dealing with U. And I have no way to know what the status of this whole mess is other than making random calls to call center hell.

2) There was no expiration date anywhere that I could find or that anyone could show me on the vouchers. There is an issue date but that's it.

Just a few opinions:

1) I paid for the tickets. This stuff about not being able to transfer them to another person is crap. It may be in the rules but it's still crap.

2) Undisclosed expiration dates and junk fees are crap too. It's no wonder that people would rather go to the dentist than deal with an airline. These sorts of rules are a big part of the reason that people despise the major airlines and love SWA. It's not all about price.

3) All of this stuff did nothing useful for the airline. It got in the way of me spending my money with you in your time of need (remember -- I put cash into this transaction as well as the vouchers and unused ticket.) It also caused at least 4 employees to spend an aggregate of at least three hours dealing with the issues when they could have been doing far more productive things. It shouldn't have been that hard. If the ridiculous rules hadn't been in the way the whole transaction could have been completed in about 10 minutes during the first call and U would have had a happy customer.

If a fraction of the effort that goes into creating these rules (to say nothing of the effort that goes into enforcing them) had instead been spent automating the process of claiming vouchers and unused tickets nobody except me would have needed to lift a finger.

4) Yes, service stinks all over. That's not a reason to embrace bad service as a standard.
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With the brand new info you have provided AFTER your original post,your discussion falls under the header of NOT GIVING OUT ENOUGH INFORMATION to form an opinion and engage in a fair discussion.
There was no mention of 9-11 tkts. This situation was handled quite diferently than normal day to day cancelled tickets. If it was a non ref fare between 9-11 and 9-25 US allowed no penalty rebooking for one year, just any add collects or if a partial refund due it would go to a voucher. Certainly Nothing unfair about that...OR.. a total refund to original form of payment. Again I assume after one year of unuse,we assess a 100 penalty as we do on unrestricted tickets that are refunded after one year.I assume scenario 2 is what occured by your follow up info.With 9-11 being an unusual situation,I would have thought no 1 yr expiration fee would have applied but thats not my call to make.The 13 months figure you cite is how long a rez agt can view in SABRE an unused/partially used etkt, not related to validity or svc fees.
If a credit card balance is transferred, that refund follows to that new card and is refunded there. If acct. is closed there is no reason AMEX would hold onto this credit unless their system is flawed, they should reject it and a check by US would be cut. Sounds simple to me.
The implementation of service charges in todays day and age is a fact of life and a big money maker for businesses. And I won't/can't defend or oppose it. How many misc.trumped up service charges appear on utility, phone, and cable? Line fees, energy surchg fees,customer usage fees, etc etc.It's insane but you gotta pay it or go without.

As for transferability issue, I used to think it was too harsh but in todays econ world I don't think so.Bumped tkts and DM awrds are transferable, and thats great. Didn't use to be but now they are. But once tickets are issued with a definitive name, it shld stay that way. The compensation is meant for one person, one time only, and money can be made by adding 1, 2, or 3 more friends or family to the mix when and if these people want to travel instead of or in addition to, especially if one or more keeps cancelling and changing their minds about trvling and wants to transfer again. Even happening one time dilutes the value of the potential revenue of having someone buy the second tkt.The airline also counts on a small percentage of people who will not use or maybe even lose the free voucher (their fault/choice, not the airlines), therefore this can add to the value of a travel voucher even to airline's bottom line.
I equate the transferability issue of Revenue Ticks to my health club membership. Why should Bally's allow me to lend my membership card to my friend or spouse because I am not using the spa that day when I can supposedly justify someone else using it since I paid for it and my body won't be there but I shld assign someone else's body to be there? That's insane. They want other people to join and pay dues etc etc and make money on the membership.The airline wants other/substitute people to buy a new ticket if the 1st person cannot travel,..that's 2 tickets, 2 people, more money. Makes sense to me.

There is no one that would not agree that in general, rules and regs need to be simplified for many facets of the business, for both agents and customers to better understand...that doesn't mean give away the store and allow things to go unchecked, it means being consistent with issues like dates of applicability, length of validity, txfrbliltiy issues , how to redeem..and making these things user friendly.I would assume automating items like trvl vchrs is costly and not on the business agenda. FCU vchrs on the other hand will be automated soon, and that will make things more simpler in that regard, especially where misuse as well as agt error is concerned.
 

resconcerns

Member
Sep 11, 2002
26
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EXCUSE me Mr. KCflyer,
Before coming to the airline, I worked for a well known bank for 7 years and I KNOW the procedure. Maybe you should know what you're talking about first.
 

RealityCheck

Senior
Aug 20, 2002
289
0
www.usaviation.com
[blockquote]
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On 10/12/2002 7:32:01 PM resconcerns wrote:

EXCUSE me Mr. KCflyer,
Before coming to the airline, I worked for a well known bank for 7 years and I KNOW the procedure. Maybe you should know what you're talking about first.
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I have never worked for a bank yet I have never heard of or seen any bank accept a check as described above by KC(maybe if both people are standing there it might work?).
I am afraid this poster does not surround himself with REALISTIC info that is pertinent to the discussions at hand(see other topics such as PASSGR HELP) and I have finally conceded to not get involved in any more discussions with someone who doesn't stick to the facts or have some semblance of REALITY(that's my name don't wear it out).
 

resconcerns

Member
Sep 11, 2002
26
0
and another thing Mr. KCflyer....I can't help this one. Suppose you walk into my bank with your spouses check...no problem. I just walk to the file cabinet and check out your signature along the millions of signatures in the file cabinet. I then hold up your signature and in my OPINION it matches. NO PROBLEM. Then the spouse calls the bank to put a stop payment on HER check, because it disappeared. RULES are in place for a reason, we just don't like the rules...
 

resconcerns

Member
Sep 11, 2002
26
0
Mr Tom,
I am in no way EMBRACING bad customer service. In fact I have to hand it to you. I'm sure consumer affairs is familiar with you. As a seasoned flyer, I'm sure you know how to beat the system, no wonder we barely keeping our head above water, No offense, I do appreciate your business.
 
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TomBascom

Veteran
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[blockquote]
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On 10/12/2002 7:38:42 PM resconcerns wrote:

Mr Tom,
I am in no way EMBRACING bad customer service. In fact I have to hand it to you. I'm sure consumer affairs is familiar with you. As a seasoned flyer, I'm sure you know how to beat the system, no wonder we barely keeping our head above water, No offense, I do appreciate your business.
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I hate to break it to you but, no, they aren't at all familiar with me nor I with them. I'd just as soon keep it that way too. Ben and I have had some recent contact though.

I'm not in it to beat the system. I doubt that many of your customers are. Most of us are just trying to get our jobs done.
 
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TomBascom

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[blockquote]
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On 10/12/2002 1:48:48 PM RealityCheck wrote:

With the brand new info you have provided AFTER your original post,your discussion falls under the header of "NOT GIVING OUT ENOUGH INFORMATION" to form an opinion and engage in a fair discussion.
[/blockquote]

Nice head fake RC but none of that information changed anything or is material to the discussion.

[blockquote]
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There was no mention of 9-11 tkts. This situation was handled quite diferently than normal day to day cancelled tickets.
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Outside of the first call to res it never came up. Nor was it relevant anywhere else. The proper treatment was given on that first call. I probably could have protested about the $100 fee that CA levied on that basis but I wasn't in the mood. Think of it as a gift.

[blockquote]
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The 13 months figure you cite is how long a rez agt can view in SABRE an unused/partially used etkt, not related to validity or svc fees.
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Ah. Thanks, I understand now.

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If a credit card.... Sounds simple to me.
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Your credentials as a cynic may be revoked for that comment...

[blockquote]
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The implementation of service charges in todays day and age is a fact of life and a big money maker for businesses. And I won't/can't defend or oppose it. How many misc.trumped up service charges appear on utility, phone, and cable? Line fees, energy surchg fees,customer usage fees, etc etc.It's insane but you gotta pay it or go without.
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Everyone else is doing it ??? That's pretty weak. And you really ought to wake up and smell the coffee -- the industry's profitable darling doesn't do it like that. (Yes, they have some. No, they aren't trumped up.)

[blockquote]
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As for transferability issue... But once tickets are issued with a definitive name, it should stay that way.
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Don't fool yourself like almost all of the rules it is done for one, and only one, reason. To keep business travelers paying high fares.

[blockquote]
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...The airline also counts on a small percentage of people who will not use or maybe even lose the free voucher (their fault/choice, not the airlines), therefore this can add to the value of a travel voucher even to airline's bottom line.
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Careful -- this line of reasoning is very similar to the one that justifies oversold flights.

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I equate the transferability issue of Revenue Ticks to my health club membership...
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I thought it was like a concert ticket? In any event the analogy is specious. Do you pay $25,000/yr for your health club membership?

[blockquote]
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There is no one that would not agree that in general, rules and regs need to be simplified for many facets of the business, for both agents and customers to better understand...that doesn't mean give away the store and allow things to go unchecked, it means being consistent with issues like dates of applicability, length of validity, txfrbliltiy issues , how to redeem..and making these things user friendly.
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I agree wholeheartedly!

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I would assume automating items like trvl vchrs is costly
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I doubt it.

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... and not on the business agenda.
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No doubt that's true.

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FCU vchrs on the other hand will be automated soon, and that will make things more simpler in that regard, especially where "misuse" as well as agt error is concerned.
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What's an FCU?






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TomBascom

Veteran
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[blockquote]
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On 10/12/2002 7:57:20 PM RealityCheck wrote:

[blockquote]
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On 10/12/2002 7:32:01 PM resconcerns wrote:

EXCUSE me Mr. KCflyer,
Before coming to the airline, I worked for a well known bank for 7 years and I KNOW the procedure. Maybe you should know what you're talking about first.
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I have never worked for a bank yet I have never heard of or seen any bank accept a check as described above by KC(maybe if both people are standing there it might work?).
I am afraid this poster does not surround himself with REALISTIC info that is pertinent to the discussions at hand(see other topics such as PASSGR HELP) and I have finally conceded to not get involved in any more discussions with someone who doesn't stick to the facts or have some semblance of REALITY(that's my name don't wear it out).
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... spoke too soon on the original -- on review that isn't quite the same as what my wife does with my checks after all.

None the less that's not too far off of what happens when a check comes in made out to the wrong party. It is often easier to sign it over (or have the other party sign it over), just as described, then it is to get another one properly made out. I've been involved in that often enough to know that it does happen like that and that nobody at the bank blinks.

If you'd like a taste of reality try buying tickets like us schmoes do and toodling around the countryside for a year or three. I'll bet you see certain things in a different light after a while.