Early Out?

[LukeAisleWalker]

Did you take one of the special retirement packages? Are you questioning what a contract at Delta do for you? Plenty.

Don't take our word for it, listen to Delta retirees who left WITHOUT a contract. Log on to www.DALRC.org and read the letter posted yesterday. In it, the DALRC Board says:

"Delta has the worst, by far, health care for both retired and active employees in the industry of any legacy carrier.
"It is past time that Delta retirees had their earned benefits clearly defined in writing."
"We have all learned an important lesson the hard way. Guarantees and promises kept come in writing"
"Delta provides nothing in writing to require them to provide fair and equitable benefits like the other carriers that have guarantees through their contracts for both active and retired workers.
Two members of DALRC's Board are former flight attendants, Duff O'dell and Cathy Cone. Duff has served in In-flight executive positions and Cathy was a Board Council Member.

If you leave Delta AFTER May 28 and we have VOTED YES for a contract, YOU will receive the benefits of that future contract.

VOTE YES.
You will have a union, AFA, when you leave.
Our contract will be negotiated
Our contract can cover such things as:
Keeping the Delta Retirement Plan from being altered by future amendments that could reduce accrued benefits retroactively. Correcting present changes that altered the plan illegally. Keeping that plan from being terminated -- an unfortunate possibility in our industry, NWA's contracts cover their plans, we don't have a contract to protect ours. If the merged Delta can't fund all of them, who's plan goes to the PBGC?
Health Care.
You will have the protection of that contract--all in writing.

The benefits to you are immeasurable. Take the advice of those who have retired before you: "Delta continues to spin the facts and promise much while guaranteeing nothing. We have learned an important lesson the hard
way."

Luke's take: Are you going to bet your future on the musings of a new, 6- month, anti-union FA (Mr. Jeffers) or will you heed Duff O'Dell's points and warnings (of getting it in writing)? Duff was in major Inflite Mgt. positions at Delta for years. She knows what this company WAS and WHAT IT HAS TURNED INTO...same with Cathy Cone who was Inflite Board Council member.
Complete Link:

http://dalrc.org/index.php?option=com_cont...52&Itemid=1

 

[aislehopper]

Anyone know what happened to the retirements and healthcare of the pilots that retired before Chapter 11?

 

[metopower]

Anyone know what happened to the retirements and healthcare of the pilots that retired before Chapter 11?

YES....THE EXACT SAME AS THE NON CONTRACT RETIRES... IF YOU ARE REFERING TO MEDICAL BENIFITS. AS FAR AS THE PENSIONS ....I CAN ONLY SPEAK FOR THE PILOT GROUP . FOR THAT GROUP MANY LOST ALL RETIREMENT MONEY GOING FORWARD. MAINLY BECAUSE THEY HAD ELECTED TO RECIEVE HALF UP FRONT . IN BK THE PBGC HAS DETERMINED THAT THEY HAVE ALREADY RECIEVE FULL BENIFITS (PBGC BENIFITS) SO THERFORE THEY NOW RECIEVE NOTHING....ALSO BECAUSE THEY WERE RETIRED THE UNION DETERMINED THAT THEY WERE NO LONGER UNDER THEIR REPRESENTATION SO THEY WERE BASICALLY ON THEIR OWN. I READ THESE POSTS BUT TEND NOT TO POST. YOU ARE ASKING A QUESTION THAT I THINK YOU KNEW THE ANSWER TO BUT OTHERS MAY NOT.

 

[Wings]

YES....THE EXACT SAME AS THE NON CONTRACT RETIRES... IF YOU ARE REFERING TO MEDICAL BENIFITS. AS FAR AS THE PENSIONS ....I CAN ONLY SPEAK FOR THE PILOT GROUP . FOR THAT GROUP MANY LOST ALL RETIREMENT MONEY GOING FORWARD. MAINLY BECAUSE THEY HAD ELECTED TO RECIEVE HALF UP FRONT . IN BK THE PBGC HAS DETERMINED THAT THEY HAVE ALREADY RECIEVE FULL BENIFITS (PBGC BENIFITS) SO THERFORE THEY NOW RECIEVE NOTHING....ALSO BECAUSE THEY WERE RETIRED THE UNION DETERMINED THAT THEY WERE NO LONGER UNDER THEIR REPRESENTATION SO THEY WERE BASICALLY ON THEIR OWN. I READ THESE POSTS BUT TEND NOT TO POST. YOU ARE ASKING A QUESTION THAT I THINK YOU KNEW THE ANSWER TO BUT OTHERS MAY NOT.

Really?

I was told that prior to emerging from bankruptcy, DAL ALPA negotiated $600 million+ for the pilots who retired (before the bankruptcy) and that money was to make up for their loss of health care benefits ....

If this is true - it certainly appears that the retired pilots have faired better (with the assistance of their union) than those DAL employees who retired with no union to assist in negotiating retirement benefits.

 

[metopower]

Really?

I was told that prior to emerging from bankruptcy, DAL ALPA negotiated $600 million+ for the pilots who retired (before the bankruptcy) and that money was to make up for their loss of health care benefits ....

If this is true - it certainly appears that the retired pilots have faired better (with the assistance of their union) than those DAL employees who retired with no union to assist in negotiating retirement benefits.

NICE TRY... THE UNION HAD NOTHING TO DO WITH THIS AWARD. THEY HAD TO REPRESENT THEMSELVES AT THEIR OWN EXPENSE. IN FACT THE UNION WORKED AGAINST THEM SIGHTING THE FACT THAT THEY WERE NO LONGER EMPLOYEES THEREFORE THEY WOULD NOT REPRESENT THEM. IF DELTA (THE CORP.) HAD WANTED TO THEY COULD HAVE FOUGHT THEM TO THE MAX AND PROBABLY WON. MANY WORKING PILOTS COMPAINED THAT THE MONEY AWARDED TO THE RETIRED PILOTS SHOULD HAVE GONE TO THEM AND THE COMPANY SHOULD HAVE NEVER AWARDED THEM A DIME.

 

[hunter94965]

NICE TRY... THE UNION HAD NOTHING TO DO WITH THIS AWARD. THEY HAD TO REPRESENT THEMSELVES AT THEIR OWN EXPENSE. IN FACT THE UNION WORKED AGAINST THEM SIGHTING THE FACT THAT THEY WERE NO LONGER EMPLOYEES THEREFORE THEY WOULD NOT REPRESENT THEM. IF DELTA (THE CORP.) HAD WANTED TO THEY COULD HAVE FOUGHT THEM TO THE MAX AND PROBABLY WON. MANY WORKING PILOTS COMPAINED THAT THE MONEY AWARDED TO THE RETIRED PILOTS SHOULD HAVE GONE TO THEM AND THE COMPANY SHOULD HAVE NEVER AWARDED THEM A DIME.

So much for that special union brotherhood stuff!

 

[BigBangTheory]

NICE TRY... THE UNION HAD NOTHING TO DO WITH THIS AWARD. THEY HAD TO REPRESENT THEMSELVES AT THEIR OWN EXPENSE. IN FACT THE UNION WORKED AGAINST THEM SIGHTING THE FACT THAT THEY WERE NO LONGER EMPLOYEES THEREFORE THEY WOULD NOT REPRESENT THEM. IF DELTA (THE CORP.) HAD WANTED TO THEY COULD HAVE FOUGHT THEM TO THE MAX AND PROBABLY WON. MANY WORKING PILOTS COMPAINED THAT THE MONEY AWARDED TO THE RETIRED PILOTS SHOULD HAVE GONE TO THEM AND THE COMPANY SHOULD HAVE NEVER AWARDED THEM A DIME.

Just a little FYI...

Typing in CAPS makes it sound like you are yelling!!!

 

[Wings]

NICE TRY... THE UNION HAD NOTHING TO DO WITH THIS AWARD. THEY HAD TO REPRESENT THEMSELVES AT THEIR OWN EXPENSE. IN FACT THE UNION WORKED AGAINST THEM SIGHTING THE FACT THAT THEY WERE NO LONGER EMPLOYEES THEREFORE THEY WOULD NOT REPRESENT THEM. IF DELTA (THE CORP.) HAD WANTED TO THEY COULD HAVE FOUGHT THEM TO THE MAX AND PROBABLY WON. MANY WORKING PILOTS COMPAINED THAT THE MONEY AWARDED TO THE RETIRED PILOTS SHOULD HAVE GONE TO THEM AND THE COMPANY SHOULD HAVE NEVER AWARDED THEM A DIME.

So, you are saying that you did receive a claim for lost benefits, but that DAL ALPA didn't fight for your right to that money (and you had to represent yourselves)?

If so - it sounds like what was negotiated prior to bankruptcy (by DALPA) was upheld by the BK judge. Even though current DALPA leadership wanted to change pilot retiree benefits after emerging from bankruptcy, at least you received the award. That is more than non-union employee groups received ....

Just one more reason why all employee groups at the "new" Delta need to protect themselves with union representation. With oil now hovering around $135/barrel, outsourcing on a massive scale is a very real possibility.

 

[DLtoWN]

If you want a rude wake up call, talk to any of the thousands and thousands of retired ground workers about how Delta treated them with their pensions and benefits.

Even those of us that had our Retirement Benefits IN WRITING (someone screwed up bad when the actually put something down on paper) found that our "lifetime" benefits didn't actually specify WHOSE lifetime. When BK came, just like in nature, the week and the old without anyone to protect them (read contract) were the first to be abandoned by the herd.

It's interesting to note that the CEO has been "too busy" to meet with the DALRC to discuss ANYTHING regarding retiree benefits! What a condescending prima donna!

Am I bitter? H*ll yes I am! I only wish I lived in ATL so I could picket the airport, his house, or every one of the Directors companies on a regular basis!

 

[1Conehead]

Just a little FYI...

Typing in CAPS makes it sound like you are yelling!!!

Typing in CAPS ,And your poor use of the English language,
Makes your intellect, And position suspect.

Not Aimed toward you BBT

 

[metopower]

Typing in CAPS ,And your poor use of the English language,
Makes your intellect, And position suspect.

Not Aimed toward you BBT

sorry about the caps..i used it because it is easy for me to read. The truth is never a position just the facts. not aimed towards you BBT

 

[BigBangTheory]

sorry about the caps..i used it because it is easy for me to read. The truth is never a position just the facts. not aimed towards you BBT

Hey, no problem!

 

[MMB]

So, you are saying that you did receive a claim for lost benefits, but that DAL ALPA didn't fight for your right to that money (and you had to represent yourselves)?

...That is more than non-union employee groups received ....

...Just one more reason why all employee groups at the "new" Delta need to protect themselves with union representation. ...

Now that is a stretch even Gumby couldn't make.
The union dumped them, so they are NON-UNION.
The company, with no contract and no legal requirement, hands over $600 million+.
And you think this demonstrates the need for union protection from a thieving corporation!?
You haven't been drinking the Kool-Aid, you're mainlining it through IVs!

 

[southwind]

YES....THE EXACT SAME AS THE NON CONTRACT RETIRES... IF YOU ARE REFERING TO MEDICAL BENIFITS. AS FAR AS THE PENSIONS ....I CAN ONLY SPEAK FOR THE PILOT GROUP . FOR THAT GROUP MANY LOST ALL RETIREMENT MONEY GOING FORWARD. MAINLY BECAUSE THEY HAD ELECTED TO RECIEVE HALF UP FRONT . IN BK THE PBGC HAS DETERMINED THAT THEY HAVE ALREADY RECIEVE FULL BENIFITS (PBGC BENIFITS) SO THERFORE THEY NOW RECIEVE NOTHING....ALSO BECAUSE THEY WERE RETIRED THE UNION DETERMINED THAT THEY WERE NO LONGER UNDER THEIR REPRESENTATION SO THEY WERE BASICALLY ON THEIR OWN. I READ THESE POSTS BUT TEND NOT TO POST. YOU ARE ASKING A QUESTION THAT I THINK YOU KNEW THE ANSWER TO BUT OTHERS MAY NOT.

From what I've heard, the majority of pilots that decided to leave the company, CASHED OUT their pensions to the tune of $1,000,000 ( thats one million dollars!)

And then your going to complain ?

 

[metopower]

From what I've heard, the majority of pilots that decided to leave the company, CASHED OUT their pensions to the tune of $1,000,000 ( thats one million dollars!)

And then your going to complain ?

You assume that I am one of the 1000. It was actually 2500. I am not complaining about the payout about but I am complaining about how the Union did not represent them. The payout you speak of is about half of the earned benefit which was payed out per contract upon retirement with the other half payed monthly . They lost the monthly because the half that they received upfront is going to be greater then the whole that I will receive because I stayed....Just the facts.....The money that Delta gave them in BK was for the part of the terminated retirement that I will receive nothing for. Thus we were treated differently and they got their money by the grace of Delta not because of BK or the Union ...because the judge could have and would have denied them that award if the company had fought it.They sued as a BK claim and many others were denied because the company fought them .
MMB you are right on...I don't understand why they did it... but it was the right thing to do.