Educating Buck

[High Speed Steel]

Buck, I have noticed that you seem to have a great concern to the Scope of our agreement. I would like for you to get your TWU contract and look at the front cover but don't open the book. Now turn the book over and look at the back cover. O.K. now turn it back over and prepare to open it. There are definitions to the word scope in the dictionary that refer to range, span and etc. I will be using the word bridge which is refered to as a span in reference to what I am trying to explain. Now open the TWU agreement and the first Article you come to is Article #1 which is Recogniton and Scope. This notifies to the reader that this booklet has a range, or span such as a Bridge over water with many pillar's to support it and it extends from cover to cover. Well Article#1 is the Bridge, and the pillar's I reference are Job Protections that reach accross the span of the booklet and remain intact today. Many of the AMFA Organizers are trying to use specific quotations out of Article#1 to try and discredit it's authority. They only want you to look at the surface, and not look at the whole spectrum of what is required to enforce Article#1. They don't want you to be educated in what it takes to support Article#1. The former IAM represented employee's of NW Airlines had many pillar's to support the Scope of their agreement until AMFA came along. They entered negotiations and stripped the Job Protections or pillar's away from the agreement which weakend their Scope and resulted in many layoffs. I hope this will offer you a better understanding as to what Scope is.

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AMFA: The YUGO of the labor movement
Where barganing means YOU GO....!

 

[TWU informer]

OK I'll bite,

Can you provide us the outsource limit, the current percentage, and how AA reports to the union the outsourec and the TWU audit procedure to insure company doesn't lie or hide things like the Management SERP was hidden? And then what is the penalty if AA exceeds any limit you may provide us?

Thanks in advance, we have been waiting on someone wiht the cold hard facts to educate us in this area for awhile now. Glad you are here!

 

[High Speed Steel]

OK I'll bite,

Can you provide us the outsource limit, the current percentage, and how AA reports to the union the outsourec and the TWU audit procedure to insure company doesn't lie or hide things like the Management SERP was hidden? And then what is the penalty if AA exceeds any limit you may provide us?

Thanks in advance, we have been waiting on someone wiht the cold hard facts to educate us in this area for awhile now. Glad you are here!

Biter, You seem to have jumped off of the subject of this forum! Where the Job Protections that supported the Scope of the former IAM agreement at NW stripped away or not? Stay with the topic or exit the forum....!

---------------------------------
AMFA: The YUGO of the labor movement
Where barganing means YOU GO....!

 

[TWU informer]

Biter, You seem to have jumped off of the subject of this forum! Where the Job Protections that supported the Scope of the former IAM agreement at NW stripped away or not? Stay with the topic or exit the forum....!

I think you better read your contract book again.

Article 1 RECOGNITION AND SCOPE is where outsource protection is listed.

Job Security provisions are not in Article 1. Job Security Provision are in Article 42.

How do intend to "educate" someone is don't even know what you are talking about yourself.

The ANSWER TO YOUR QUESTION IS NO! NWA Mechanics were not stripped of their job protections from the agreement. Read for yourself page 3.12 of the AMFA/NWA Agreement:

 

[High Speed Steel]

Informer, You still have not answered my question. Where the Job Protections with the former IAM agreement at NW Airlines stripped away or not?

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AMFA: The YUGO of the labor movement
Where barganing means YOU GO....!

 

[proAMFA]

At a meeting last year there was correspondence from the company about an outsourcing report. When asked about it Randy said that the company was contractually bound to give quarterly reports and that is was really hard to figure them out and tell just exactly how much work was being outsourced.

I'm ready for AMFA


You TWU officers-wipe off the bitter beer faces and start knocking the dust off your toolboxes (if you still have tools). Unless of course your going to cry to the company for a management job. Actually I bet the company doesn't consider any of you "management qualified".

 

[Buck]

Thanks for the lesson on the structure of a contract book. And yes I am concerned about the Scope of the contract. Are saying that you are not?



Article 1.

(2) It is understood that nothing in this Article requires the maintenance of the present volume of work.

If your work in not guaranteed, what good is job security?

(a) It is the intention of the Company to insure that the
predominant volume of work under Cross Service, Base Maintenance and Line
Maintenance Service Agreements be performed by the Company employees. It
is further understood, in no event, that the volume of work be less than equal
to the work performed by other carriers for American Airlines under Cross
Service, Base Maintenance and Line Maintenance Service Agreements. The
ratio of mechanic work performed in terms of man-hours will be reflected
quarterly, in writing, to the Union.


Why would the union sign a contract that guaranteed that the predominant volume of work be accomplished by company employees instead of TWU represented employees.


And to further "span" the contract.....


ARTICLE 28 – NO DISCRIMINATION, AND RECOGNITION OF RIGHTS AND COMPLIANCE

(B) The Union recognizes that the Company will have sole jurisdiction of the management and operation of its business, the direction of its working force, the right to maintain discipline and efficiency in its hangars, stations, shops, or other places of employment, and the right of the Company to hire, discipline, and is charge employees for just cause, subject to the provisions of this Agreement. It is agreed that the rights enumerated in this Article will not be deemed to exclude other preexisting rights of management not enumerated which do not conflict with other provisions of this Agreement.


What does this mean?

What does it mean "sole jurisdiction"?

 

[TWU informer]

Informer, You still have not answered my question. Where the Job Protections with the former IAM agreement at NW Airlines stripped away or not?

NO!

 

[Checking it Out]

Why is it so important for you to have a copy of the current outsorce limits? Contractually it has been 19% to 21% for many years! The report comes out quarterly, currently it's about 20%. Has been reduced over the last 12 months.

The fact still remains, we have not reduced head count based on outsourcing of work! We the members have the ability to grieve when it's been violated. Language within the contract is important, You can set any cap you want, if you gut the rest you have nothing!
Good topic, Thanks

 

[High Speed Steel]

I started this thread late last night. As I sat before my computer I decided to go fishing, I knew I would catch a big one, But I didn't realize it was going to be "OL" TWU Informer himself! The topic I addressed has historically been one of the most controversial articles of our agreement. There has historically been some of the most fiercest battles in negotiations over this Article#1 over the years because of its importance to our agreement. If you will notice with Informer's initial responce that he tried to turn the tables and get off subject. I refer to there being the presence of range, or span within our agreement. And this can be proven with our grievance procedures alone. Our Shop Stewards know that when filling out a grievance that one of there strongest references to a violation is one simple phrase ( This is a violation of the TWU/AA agreement). Because they know there may be other articles within the agreement to best serve their grievant. This also forces the Company to go on a "Witch Hunt"! Which article are they in violation of, and will they have to look from cover to cover to find it? Many of our Arbitration cases have been won with this strategy alone. I truly question Informer's knowledge of the structure of our agreement which he so desperately seeks the authority to enforce. Where there Job Protections stripped from the NW agreement that have contributed to the level of outsourcing and lay off's that have been experienced at that carrier? His responce is 'NO" but guy's something drastic has really impacted their agreement! I think he needs to leave it in the capable hands of our TWU officials who understand the structure of our agreement. I am not prepared to put my destiny in the hands of TWU Informer. I would like to request to as CIO has done that you review what has taken place in the past few weeks. I recommend that you read the responce from Jim Little to Ken MacTiernan on the questions that he had. It is very good read and should answer many questions as to where we are today.

---------------------------
AMFA: The YUGO of the labor movement
Where bargaining means YOU GO....!

 

[TWU informer]

Why is it so important for you to have a copy of the current outsorce limits? Contractually it has been 19% to 21% for many years! The report comes out quarterly, currently it's about 20%. Has been reduced over the last 12 months.

Contractually 19% to 21%? What Article in Our Contract is That?

 

[Superside]

Why is it so important for you to have a copy of the current outsorce limits? Contractually it has been 19% to 21% for many years! The report comes out quarterly, currently it's about 20%. Has been reduced over the last 12 months.

The fact still remains, we have not reduced head count based on outsourcing of work! We the members have the ability to grieve when it's been violated. Language within the contract is important, You can set any cap you want, if you gut the rest you have nothing!
Good topic, Thanks

CIO, POST THE ARTICAL AND PARAGRAPH, IN THE CONTRACT!!!
YOU CAN'T PROVE THE LIMITS YOU CLAIM, BECAUSE IT IS NOT AVAILABLE.
YOU KNOW IT, WE KNOW IT, YOU ARE SUCH A LIAR AND CONMAN!!
YES I'M PISSED, YOU HAVE GOT TO BE THE MOST IGNORANT $#!T I HAVE EVER
COMUNICATED WITH!

YOU NEVER ANSWER WITH THE TRUTH AND THE PROOF!!! YOU NEVER PRODUCE EVIDENCE TO YOUR CLAIMS.

D-DAY FOR THE TWU, 14 DAYS AND COUNTING!!!

 

[TWU informer]

I see High Speed Steel is without a doubt TWU trained.

He cannot answer a single question, and simply claims that we don't know what we are talking.

Is it because your TWU Labor Agreement has the "presence of range and/or span" of grey matter that you really cannot give a specific outsource limit percentage, current audit checks and balances procedures, and the penalty if the non-extisting limit is violated? Just because you saved jobs doesn't mean you have good language.

We are co-workers asking you for specific data, and you are acting as if we are the company and you are filling out a grievance so you pretedn to be a good shop steward and avoid specifics. Is this because you want us to go on a "Witch Hunt", or is it because you cannot answer the question directly? Do you think your own members will be willing to "witch hunt" for answer before they cast their ballots?

Good Luck!

 

[Checking it Out]

The proof is in the news on a daily basis about the continuation of work leaving NWA, Masaba, Alaska, United to name a few! Scope Language and the related articles are important!

NWA=100 position per month lost since Amfa has taken over!

 

[TWU informer]

The proof is in the news on a daily basis about the continuation of work leaving NWA, Masaba, Alaska, United to name a few! Scope Language and the related articles are important!

NWA=100 position per month lost since Amfa has taken over!

So let me get this straight.

The proof of your TWU weak and/or non-existing outsource limit is at another airline.

Ok, whatever you say pal.

Thanks for clearing that up for all the readers.

Keep on blaming others for your own short comings, send out another flyer in the mail, we will take all the votes you want to give us!