Fractional ownership systems

[cx400]

Anyone here using the Ourplane fractional ownership system or have heard about it?

Is it a better low cost alternative than renting planes from flight schools in places like Toronto, if most trips require extended rentals? How popular is fractional ownership these days?

What do you guys think?

 

[Laser]

If I recall correctly, there were some articles in "Flying" magazine that fully evaluates the pros and cons; I think that they appeared within the past 24 months, so you should have no difficulty obtaining the back issues.

This website [http://www3.gremlin.ca/scott/flying/] is hosted by a fellow who participates in the OurPlane scheme; he seems happy enough with it. You might try contacting him to obtain details of his firsthand experience: logan@gremlin.ca

 

[flythenumbers]

Hmmm, I have spent a significant time looking into extended rentals, and trying to find one that suites my needs... I have yet to find one.

I have looking into Ourplane as well. They have open houses too, great to talk and see the guys, seem like nice folks, but still more expensive than what I wanted to pay.

Basically it works as follows:

1. You invest in the Plane, basically, you buy a fraction of the plane, based on a membership level. There are bronze, silver and gold I believe it is. Each one cost more, but you get ''more'' for the fee. As I recall, bronze is around 12K. and that gets you a share in a Warrior.

2. You have a month fee to pay, it was around $350 a month. This payed for hanger fees and insurance, stuff like that. (like condo fees)

3. You pay a per hour fee of around $100, for a wet plane, when you fly. NO MINIMUM TIME.

4. You book the plane in advance. The higher your membership, the more in advance you can book. The higher the membership, the more exposure you get to other planes. (I think the Silver gets you access to the Cirrus and the Gold the 182, but not positive on this.)

The good thing is that the planes are new, I think they claim less that 2 years old at all times. No minimums. But still, not that good if you just want to ''fly to the US once/twice a year) They claim little schedule contention, and its like 10 to 1 people on a plane. The initial investment is refundable/saleable if you leave as I understand it, cause you name is on the ownership of the aircraft.

Honestly, it seems the best way to go for things like weekend and overnight trips. And at the same time, the hourly costs are more than I''d pay if I owned my own plane, and I can hanger one cheaper than that.

I have also looking into buying my own. It looks appealing to buy, but expensive. Knowing the way I am, I will likely jump in and just buy a plane some day, and spend 100-120K. (Want an Archer or Dakoda, IFR certified) If my wife were into it, I would be more about finding a way to do that. Also the maintainence regs. may/are changing, making it more appealing to me, as I could then do more of the work myself. Still, only 31 here, and there are alot of other things that will take my money and demand priority.

 

[cx400]

Thank you for all your great inputs.

I can't find anymore fractional ownership systems in Toronto, besides Ourplane. Is Ourplane the only fractional ownership system available there?

Is it true that daily minimums won't be charged like in flight schools, if you take the plane out for the weekend, but only fly it for two hours? Also, does all the planes at Ourplane have a customs decal that allows you to fly to the U.S.?

Looking forward to your replies...

 

[flythenumbers]

So far, Ourplane is the only organization that I know that does fractional ownership. You can likely find other individuals looking for a person to buy a share. I have heard more stories where individual ownership is a problem. Inevitably, there is one moron in the group that never fuels, never puts oil in, never reports snags, breaks the plane, hogs the plane, never pays his share..... And then there is the guy who usually does all that. Creates tension. Experience has shown me that I''d be the guy doing all the work if I did group ownership, thats why private fractional ownership would not work for me, unless the other people where those who flew very little.

As far as I know, the Ourplane planes are able to go to the US. They also tend to have some sweet @ss GPS''s that make it easier. The Cirrus is awesome.

About Schools and minimums. My experience has been that you have to argue and push em a bit to get the minimums waived. No school I know will waive the minimums without good reason. I mean, I can see their point. If the plane were at the airport, it might fly all weekend and earn revenue. You take it for the weekend, and it flies for 2-4 hours. Thats a loss of revenue for them, especially if they could have used it to train. (They make the bulk of the money off the instructors, on the plane, I am told that the 172''s make maybe $15 an hour.)

The general ''unwritten'' policy of some schools is: We will/may waive the minimums, iff, the plane would not have flown. So, pick a plane that doesn''t fly as much, and pick a day when students/others don''t want to fly. I have done this, but you have to get agreement PRIOR to rental. I basically was told I needed to pay 6-8 hrs for a 3 hr flight. (wanted it overnight) I told em that is had to be 3-4 hrs max, otherwise no deal. In the end, they decided that a bird in the hand was better several in the bush, and gave me the 3-4 hr cost. (Flight got cancelled due to weather in the end.)

Also, know the flight school / rental places head dispatch guy/gal who can make these decisions. If they like you, and know you are a good guy/competant they are more flexable. Also, if you rent more, they are more likely to give you a better deal. I fly alot, used to fly more with my school, so they know me, and know that I am hooked. Thats good, cause when this industry gets better, I may want to instruct for em.

 

[Laser]

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I can''t find anymore fractional ownership systems in Toronto, besides Ourplane. Is Ourplane the only fractional ownership system available there?
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There are similar operations in the USA such as "Flight Share" [http://www.flight-share.com/], but I believe that Our Plane is currently the only game in Toronto.

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Do all the planes at Ourplane have a customs decal that allows you to fly to the U.S.?
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I don''t know, but frankly this isn''t worth worrying about. I''m sure you won''t base your decision on whether or not you can save US$25 pa; when you are talking airplane ownership, it''s peanuts in the grand scheme of things.


You may be interested in this article on AvWeb, which is a reprint from Aviation Consumer: http://avweb.com/news/newacft/181604-1.html It seems to do a pretty good jobs of highlighting some of the pros and cons of fractional ownership programs.

I hope this helps.