Good Job US...At Least In One Facet

vantheman63

Senior
Aug 30, 2007
447
3
PVD
Visit site
So, today was a travel day...on US....$829.30 paid for an F-Class ticket from LAS-PVD via PHL.

And, as we were discussing in the Gautbaum thread where Elise addressed the media, the EXACT thing happened...potentially to me.

Here's what happened:

- I show up to LAS on a Sunday morning...in complete FEAR I won't make it through security as the lines are the longest lines I've ever personally witnessed on any place on earth.

- I skip the US ticket counter to get a boarding pass, remembering the US Club is actually outside security at LAS.

- As I walk by the security line, I notice the F-Class line has exactly ZERO people in it...while the other lines are as long as any on earth.

- I enter the club at 7:45 (9:00 am departure, 8:30 am boarding time), show my credentials and the Club Angel says, "no worries Mr. VanTheMan63, 10 mintues is all you will need for security with an F-Class BP."

- I take a quick e-mail download and make a phone call, leave the club at 8:15 am....10 minutes has me at the gate at 8:25, give or take 5 mintues...

- I leave the club....having been in there less than 30 minutes....and there are suddenly, 150 people PLUS in line....for the First Class security line.

- I get in line, PAST the elevators....and IMMEDIATELY start to wonder...."can I make this line BEFORE they close the flight?"

Now....the lovely and talented EMBFA suggests I need a traveling companion to help me through the airport....the all knowing, all seeing BOB LOBLAW, calls me "Mr. Stupid" and then suggests I'm actually a complete idiot...only to....well, never mind....then PHLfa88 suggests (a.) I'm a pig because I eat "slop" and that (b.) I'm cheap, theorizing, I only travel in F for free with upgrades, having ZERO idea I actually pay for it. ITESTWELL suggests that all us "high yield, VFFers" want is "arrive on time with out luggage." I of course say, "Doug Parker doesn't get it, I understand since you have a kool-aid IV going, you don't either."

So....here's what happened...

I watch COUNTLESS crew members (not US as they get dropped RIGHT at the aircraft in LAS), no less then 7 crews of 5 to 7 people, cut the line....then I watch Lord knows how many wheel chairs cut the line. EVERYONE around me is not happy...I finally go to TSA and cry foul..."look, I'm doing this the way you want, standing in line, I have a 9:00 am flight, it's 8:40...and your "line" lets anyone and everyone in." He then looks at me, says "not my problem." I call BS....get a supervisor...and they move me into another line....with 2 people...now 8:45...and the 2 people yield to me to get through.

I get through and RUN like a crazy man to A-17....I show at the gate at 8:52....and guess what?

My seat, 3D was there....the flight was not closed...to EMBFA's point...they were waiting for me....not bad, I was impressed.

To the "Gautbaum" thread point....US would TOTALLY have been within it's right to close the flight and give my seat to another traveler. As with that person...this flight was full...there were people waiting at the gate, and I'd bet my house there were other elites (oops, someone here hates that....errr..."loyal") travelers who would love to have 3D.

Instead, the G/A in LAS did the right thing....she waited until she could wait no more....NO DOUBT knowing I was checked in, s**t happens and the bus doesn't need to leave for 7 or 8 more minutes.

I get on the airplane, the F/A gets me some water as he could see I was a wreck...they close the doors and we go. Now, to top it all off....we landed in PHL 20 minutes EARLY!!!

So.....now I ask....

WHY DOES AN AIRPLANE NEED TO CLOSE OUT AND LEAVE 8 MINUTES EARLY???? When SOMEONE SHOULD KNOW THE CUSTOMER IS IN THE AIRPORT????

I understand the rules...I would have been there in PLENTY of time had flight crews in multiples and wheel chair folk not cut the line...

At the end of the day, the flight pushed EXACTLY at departure...maybe a minute or 2 late....and we got to our destination 20 mintues early.

WHY WOULDN'T THIS BE THE RULE OF THE DAY??? To take care of the customer??? Doesn't your fearless leader ALWAYS implore you to "take care of customers" on EVERY speech he gives? (I don't believe much of what he says)

With all due respect to BOB LOBLAW who claims I'm dumber then a box of hammers....or to EMBFA who believes I need a companion to keep me from getting lost...or to ITESTWELL for believing all guys like me want is to get there on time, with my luggage (I rarely check so it usually shows up when I show up)...and to PHLfa88 who thinks I don't pay for the seat...

How did the company, looking after a CP, looking after a person that spent $800 for a one-way ticket, how did that hurt a soul???

Take your shots....I'd love to hear how this was bad for anyone...that the company looked after a customer and still got to where the flight needed to go on time.
 
So what you're saying is you don't need a companion, just a watch, or perhaps lessons in telling time?

:) Glad you made your flight.
 
Van,

Glad you made your flight. I'm sure it took some thoughtful effort on the part of the agents. However, I would say that you were probably checked in for the flight when you went to the club room. Therefore everyone knew you were there and with time to spare waited for you. That is how it is supposed to work.

With all the new operating systems we have now I have discovered one thing. When everything works it works great. When it doesn't all h*ll breaks loose!

B
 
Van,
Glad it worked out for you. I am guessing you were on a West Metal Flight ( Yes I know we are now one ). The Acars currently works differently on East and West METAL Aircraft. On the West, the Crew has the Ability to POP the Brake while at the gate and that shows the out time. Local Management only Cares about ON-TIME departures. On the East Metal Aircraft, All Doors MUST BE CLOSED and the Aircraft Must be pushed back Ten Feet or so before an out time kicks in. I am also surprised they waited. In Las often people have to get that last minute money into the Slots before leaving and often lose sight of time.
 
Thanks for the replies...and thanks for having fun with the thread while allowing me to make the point.

Hope777 - The crew and airplane were indeed "East," PHL at that. The A F/A and I had a number of mutual friends....and that was the final leg of their 3 day trip.

EMBA - I bought myself a new Breitling....so I have the watch....maybe I need lessons reading it....thanks for the heads up.

Bob Loblaw - Actually, I checked in at the club. The Club people there are pretty darned good, pretty darned helpful. I did not check in on line at the hotel....nor did I check in at a Kiyosk downstairs.

And I think that's the point....because the Club Angels checked me in, that morning, they HAD to know I was in the airport and trying to get to the airplane and gate.

Bottom line, again, "why does a plane have to close doors and leave before all the people who are "checked in" for it, arrive? The question was answered, "all management cares about is on time departure." And as ITESTWELL stated in a previous thread, that's all that's drilled into your heads.

My position is, "that's not all thats important to a high yield, VFFer." It's important, don't get me wrong...but lemme tell you what would have been a friggen DISASTER was me not getting on that flight....I very likely would have been in LAS one more night...and since I'm flying PVD-LGA today for a meeting, that would have been a disaster.

That was my whole point in the previous thread....I think Elise was right....I think the woman's death was tragic, but in no way the fault of US.

HOWEVER, as I originally stated, and I think a number of people like Boeing Boy proved (as far as I'm concerned) "it the coaching and the systems that are wrong."

Yeah, I'm glad I made the flight....but I think more importantly, if the company is looking out for little things, little details like this, it makes the customer feel wanted and appreciated. And at the end of the day, isn't that what US is supposed to do? As your fearless leader says, "helping customers every day?"
 
By the way....I received a nice PM from someone saying they hoped they hadn't offended me....and I really appreciate that. I hope I'm not offensive to anyone on these boards...

Half of it is fun...the other half is me flipping grief right back when it gets flipped to me.

No harm, no foul....I'm 6'3" with big shoulders...so bring it on! LOL :up:

Have a stellar day.
 
..maybe a minute or 2 late....

I’m glad all passengers don’t hang out in the clubs bars coffee shops bookstore restroom etc. till very close to departure time that would be a mess. But there are always the select few who play the game of chase and make every excuse in the book


WHY DOES AN AIRPLANE NEED TO CLOSE OUT AND LEAVE 3 MINUTES LATE???? When SOMEONE SHOULD KNOW THE CUSTOMER IS IN THE AIRPORT????
Have you ever been on standby for first class? Or just to get on a flight?
Take your coach seat we will let you know after we reach cruising altitude if you can move up to first class because we are waiting to the very last minute for someone shopping/clubing/oversleep/stuck in traffic/eating/stuck at TSA …so on so forth


Or… maybe you are first on the standby list just to get on a flight but we have to wait till departure time and maybe a minute or 2 after departure because we have someone who is at the airport checked-in who has other things to do before they board


Why play maybe with on time
 
By the way....I received a nice PM from someone saying they hoped they hadn't offended me....and I really appreciate that. I hope I'm not offensive to anyone on these boards...

Half of it is fun...the other half is me flipping grief right back when it gets flipped to me.

No harm, no foul....I'm 6'3" with big shoulders...so bring it on! LOL :up:

Have a stellar day.


I feel the main cabin door should not close any earlier than scheduled departure time. Any minutes early is just plain stupid whether one knows potential pax are in the terminal or not. I mean, how can any organization establish a baseline of late departures when "scheduled departure" is approximate? Is there a category of "approximate late departures"?
 
I decided I'd chime in on this to give you a perspective of a 22 year agent. There are so many variables involved that we arent "going to get it right" every time, its more of a crap shoot. You've also asked so many different questions in the two threads that I might seem to be rambling here, but I'll try to answer as many questions as I can that have been posed in this and the other thread.
First off, you are going to need a different amount of time and energy for each flight you work depending on the agent you are working with, what the flight is booked to, how many standbys you have (upgrades, revenue standbys and nonrevs), how cooperative the flight crew is, what gate you are working, how many families need reseating, how many assists you have and how late the wheelchair customers show up, etc, etc. In the old days many agents could do all of this with ease and within the last 5 or 10 minutes (remember when you could get your boarding pass at the gate 11 minutes before dept?). With the "enhanced" computer system, full flights, limited seats, etc, this is now a long and tedious process and many agents need every minute they can get to close out the flight and leave on time. This is but one reason that its very important to be on the plane 10 minutes before dept time.
In a perfect world everyone would be at the gate 30 mins before dept and board with their row, there would be no noshows and the standbys would only show up IF in fact there were seats available to clear. No kids in the exits, no dupe seats, etc. This doesnt happen and to ensure that the agent at least has a chance of getting a flight out on time, the 10 minute rule of being on board was implemented.
To answer another question you posed, no (most) management doesnt care if you make your flight or not as long as the departure sheet shows 0 delays at the end of the day so they dont have to answer to their boss. If there is even a minute of delay, it must be accounted for (and let the finger pointing begin). Its worse in some cities than others and the agents ARE held accountable some places for delays they take. There is no disciplinary action taken that I'm aware of (nothing in the contract), but they are given heck and an earful for each delay by management. Some stations have managers that may let things slide, but from what I've seen in the current managers we've inherited or recently hired, I'm sure there are many that dont let it slide and after a while you get tired of hearing about it. I'd be willing to bet that the agents would rather send the late customer to special services to be dealt with than to have to listen to their manager again.
Why did they leave early knowing someone was checked in on a connecting flight and not boarded? This occurs quite a bit I'm sure in the hubs. People get lost with bar time, slot time, change of time zones, etc. Also, sometimes its cheaper to buy a ticket to GSO or GSP than CLT so they book it thru and dont board the conx. The customers are halfway home by the time the agent is looking for them to board their flight. How does the agent know if this happened or if the customer is actually in the airport somewhere? It probably happens more than you think, especially on flights that are close to the hub city. The agent has to do what they have to do to get the flight out. If they paged numerous times with no response, do they sit around and wait that just maybe someone will show up or do they continue with the process and hope the customer shows up before the door is closed? I'm sure the other people who are boarded would just like to go. I realize that sometimes flights are held for people (although not as often as used to be), but thats usually a preplanned thing for a bunch of connections and not just for a straggler or lost customer. Again, it appears to be a crap shoot and the company would rather have a flight leave on time or early than take a delay waiting for someone that might or might not show up. I've actually had people show up 30 mins or an hour late without a clue that they are late.
Web checkins are another problem. I've had people check in at home and then have to change plans, but they never bother to cancel their reservation so they are still showing checked in. I had a lady the other day hand me all her boarding passes for coming down that she didnt use because her plans changed and she couldnt figure out why her return wasnt showing up. Because you didnt board and were canx no show. How do we know who is coming and who is stuck in traffic or had their plans changed? Again its a crap shoot. The worst are the FC customers because you want to give them every chance to board, but you also have VFFS who are sitting in the back waiting to get moved up. At what point in time do you say we should say sorry you're late to the webcheckin FC guy and give the seat to the VFF in coach who is here, checked in, on the plane and ready to go? 10 mins, 5 mins, 2 mins? How long is it going to take the VFF to move up, stow his stuff and be ready to go? The agent has to walk a thin line and play it by ear and sometimes we luck out and sometimes you lose.
If the company has set a 10 minute policy for being on board (and I really dont think that it is too outrageous to ask that people be on board and ready 10 mins before dept if you REALLY want the plane to leave on time) then that is what the agent has to use and in the PHX case, that is what was done. I'm sure the customer in question wasnt the only customer on that day that showed up late for a flight, but she is the only one we heard about because of her instability. I'm sure the agents wish that they had done things differently now, but there is no way of knowing in advance when you are going to get the 1 in 100,000 that is going to be a problem and you cant work your flights like everyone needs to be handled with kid gloves and coddled or you will never get a flight out on time. There are too many things that have to be done at a certain time to make it work and an agent who is afraid of leaving someone or having a problem occur will not be able to get it done.
 
I agree, lets add an extra 10 minutes of pad to each flight so we can try to keep on schedule. :ph34r: I'd be more than happy to give the delay to FC. :up:
Just don't tell the passengers or they're going to start showing up ten minutes late and demanding to get on the plane. Any time you have a deadline, people are going to push it and some are going to miss it. On time stats are a big metric in rating airlines so don't be surprised when the airline does everything possible to have good numbers.
 
I’m glad all passengers don’t hang out in the clubs bars coffee shops bookstore restroom etc. till very close to departure time that would be a mess. But there are always the select few who play the game of chase and make every excuse in the book
WHY DOES AN AIRPLANE NEED TO CLOSE OUT AND LEAVE 3 MINUTES LATE???? When SOMEONE SHOULD KNOW THE CUSTOMER IS IN THE AIRPORT????
Have you ever been on standby for first class? Or just to get on a flight?
Take your coach seat we will let you know after we reach cruising altitude if you can move up to first class because we are waiting to the very last minute for someone shopping/clubing/oversleep/stuck in traffic/eating/stuck at TSA …so on so forth
Or… maybe you are first on the standby list just to get on a flight but we have to wait till departure time and maybe a minute or 2 after departure because we have someone who is at the airport checked-in who has other things to do before they board
Why play maybe with on time
Except.....you are implying this is solely my failure....it is not, was not.

Could I have gathered my boarding pass and gone STRAIGHT to the F-Class security line? Possibly avoiding a problem? Sure, I guess I could have done that...but what if the line was already a mess?

And you see, that's the real issue here....the line was being f-ed up by airline crews and handicapped folk, cutting the line. If the line works the way it's supposed to, I have no issues.

At the end of the day, this is a customer service issue. And the customer is not some once a year traveler. For $40K in business personally, plus a bunch for employees and family, I truly don't think its too difficult for an airplane to be held for a moment or two. And yes, to answer your question, an airplane CAN close out 3 minutes late, 5 minutes late...there is enough padding in the schedule.

And I agree with tadjr...there are more issues then one can shake a stick at....but closing out 8 minutes early....when its VERY possible that person is in the airport, probably close by is not right.
 
Just don't tell the passengers or they're going to start showing up ten minutes late and demanding to get on the plane. Any time you have a deadline, people are going to push it and some are going to miss it. On time stats are a big metric in rating airlines so don't be surprised when the airline does everything possible to have good numbers.

I agree, completely....its called a "back stage issue." The customers don't need to know everything....and there is already LOTS we don't know.