Know Before You Vote-United FAs Get Better Deal Than AA FAs

tomahawk58

Newbie
Aug 20, 2002
4
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This is a link for the TA agreed to by the AFA for the United FAs

http://www.unitedafa.org/features/bankrupt...ry_20030408.pdf

Simply copy and paste the link in your browser address window to see the info. Even in bankruptcy, they were able to negotiate a much better deal. Please inform yourselves before you cast that vote.
You can do better no matter what the naysayers who are voting yes tell you. It''s your career,
manage it well. Voting No!!

Respectfully,
Tomahawk58
 

ArtTang

Advanced
Feb 14, 2003
221
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I have been advocating all along that F/As wait to vote as the situation is fluid. The war in Iraq is winding down, fuel will soon drop, passengers will begin to fly a bit more and UAL f/as will have an agreement we can study. Well, that agreement has now been posted on the AFA website; I visited it with a friend who works at UAl so I had access to the details. Indeed, they are coming out way ahead of us. This TA we are voting on is unacceptable to me for many reasons, but now that I know the BK court gave the UAL f/as a fraction of the cuts that we are facing, I am more convinced than ever that we would fare better in court. I understand there are no guarantees that we will come out any better, but I will be damned if I allow Carty to ram what amounts to a 28%-30% reduction in pay and benefits down my throat while management at my salary level takes a mere 7% "blended" cut with vacation largely in tact and receives the lion's share of the upsides when the company returns to profitablity. The f/a work group at AA comprises 6% (that is S-I-X percent) of overall labor costs yet our contract is being gutted. No way! In 1993, AA threatened to close down the company and lock us out, but we stood tall against them and we're going to do it again. And for those who believe these TAs will keep us out of bk if ratified, dream on. We're going there regardless.
I'll take my chances with the bk judge before I hand evrything over to Carty and his cronies.
Art Tang
a few high lights of UAL's bk deal:
*9% pay reduction across the board on hourly rates from May 2003 (NOT from interim agreement rates) with 2% pay increases in 2007,2008,2009. The contract will be for 6 years.
* Vacation maxes out at 44 days down from max of 51. Ours goes to 28 days max in this TA!
* all layovers 20 hours or more are downtown or at downtown-like locations.
*preferential bidding will be implemented (not so great, but we could live with it!)
*Equity in restructured UAl and Performance Incentive Plan and profit sharing.
*No pay for trips that "over;ap" vacation and vacation days are credited at 2.8 hours per day.
*Future low cost carrier-within will utilize UAL f/as at same contractual rates of pay and rigs.
*In all truth, there were a few drawbacks, naturally. These were very mild compared to the draconian cuts we are being "invited" to take.
-The UAL f/as will begin paying into insurance (something they have yet to do)
-The scheduled pay increase for 2004 has been eliminated. Also, scheduled lump sums for 2004 and 2005 have been axed.
-Holidays go from 10 a year to 5!!!!
Retirement looks in tact with them too.
OK, if anyone can contribute more to this, please do so. I hope all those who are terrified of Carty and his threats see that we can fare much better in bk than with this TA. We're going there anyway.
Art Tang
in a hurry forgive typos plz.
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RV4

Veteran
Aug 20, 2002
1,885
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www.usaviation.com
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On 4/9/2003 3:09:42 PM AAviator wrote:


The UAL F/A''s are idiots. The NWA Flight attendants didn''t give anything up. They should take their chances with the judge.


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Good point!
 

Fly

Veteran
Mar 7, 2003
2,644
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Visit site
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On 4/9/2003 3:36:04 PM RV4 wrote:




----------------
On 4/9/2003 3:09:42 PM AAviator wrote:


The UAL F/A''s are idiots.  The NWA Flight attendants didn''t give anything up.  They should take their chances with the judge. 


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Good point!

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LOL!!! I think you should step away from the pipe. UAL f/a''s got lucky.....it could have been MUCH worse. Thank goodness for AFA
 

AAviator

Veteran
Nov 12, 2002
1,385
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The UAL F/A''s are idiots. The NWA Flight attendants didn''t give anything up. They should take their chances with the judge.
 

mmahpeel

Member
Oct 20, 2002
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www.usaviation.com
I''m not sure how comparing UAL flight attendants to NWA flight attendants is relevant, considering that NWA is not in Chapter 11 nor likely to do so within the next few weeks.

Further, many things that remain in the UAL -AFA contract are much better than what the folks at NWA have, not to mention the agreement that APFA and AA have brought to the folks at AA.
 

FA Mikey

Veteran
Aug 19, 2002
4,421
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miami
goldwatermiller08.com
I have a copy of the AFA/UAL, TA agreement. What I dont have though is a copy of their pay scales. If anyone does let me know and we can run some numbers, ours Vs theirs. While in some ways they did get a better deal. They also took a smaller cut due to the fact that they make less than us.
 

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