loop holes in security

[the cave]

http://www.nbcdfw.com/news/local-beat/Airl...e-63527002.html

what loophole. how would he like it if some stranger dug through his lunch and took out his fork

 

[DallasConehead]

http://www.nbcdfw.com/news/local-beat/Airl...e-63527002.html

what loophole. how would he like it if some stranger dug through his lunch and took out his fork

You now how it works, you get some bozo's out there doing stupid things and the next thing you know, all the rest of us are subject to even more scrutiny from whichever bureaucracy is the flavor of the month. Meanwhile, our all powerful Union stands back and says it can do nothing and "they can do that brother".

 

[skipfly]

Meanwhile, our all powerful Union stands back and says it can do nothing and "they can do that brother".

Really?!?!?

What right would a Union or a company have to tell TSA anything? The FAA can't even tell TSA what to do, like I said....Really!?!?

 

[DallasConehead]

Really?!?!?

What right would a Union or a company have to tell TSA anything? The FAA can't even tell TSA what to do, like I said....Really!?!?

With a bank account in the multi- miilions, surely some legal course action by our unions to seek relief is available. Especially when when peoples jobs are involved. Afterall, we are a nation of laws and courts and I think the TSA may not be above the courts, or, am I wrong?

 

[skipfly]

With a bank account in the multi- miilions, surely some legal course action by our unions to seek relief is available. Especially when when peoples jobs are involved. Afterall, we are a nation of laws and courts and I think the TSA may not be above the courts, or, am I wrong?

I am sure they are not above the law, call your congressman. How you can hang the actions of a gov. agency on the Union or Company is out there for me.

 

[Ralph]

This is more about the TSA and airport security than it is about American Airlines. Moving to alphabet soup.

 

[Ttailfan]

http://www.nbcdfw.com/news/local-beat/Airl...e-63527002.html

what loophole. how would he like it if some stranger dug through his lunch and took out his fork

That's how the TSA and other "security" functions operate...in most cases, as a reflex action to something.

The TSA's single largest problem it has is that its a government buracracy run by politicians and not law enforcement/security experts for the most part.

When I have to go up to the gate to assist a disabled passenger, etc., I have to either stand in line with all the outbound passengers to be screened (as a SIDA badged airline employee) or go out the back door, walk across the ramp and come up into the concourse from an outside door. So what does this really accomplished on the part of the TSA? Have they really made the concourse "sterile" by their actions? No. But as a SIDA authorized employee, I'm not the threat to my airplanes/passengers or any of any other airline for that matter.

But someone, somewhere, did something stupid and now everyone has to play by the total knee jerk reaction by the TSA for all of eternity.

Don't get me wrong, I have a buddy who works in the TSA, not as a screener, but in the actual law enforcement end of it. I know that the TSA is quite effective in its overall objectives. Its just the politically correct, knee jerk reactions that the blue shirted concourse screeners have to present to the public that is a joke in many ways. I don't take issue with the people doing the job, they are doing the best they can...its the "system" that is the joke.

 

[jimntx]

But as a SIDA authorized employee, I'm not the threat to my airplanes/passengers or any of any other airline for that matter.

So you say. However, the SIDA authorization doesn't mean that. What it means is that at the time you were investigated, you had no disqualifying actions or connections in your past. Let's not forget that the rampers arrested in SJU for drug smuggling also had SIDA badges.

As someone who flies on the a/c every day I am at work, I can NOT believe that any of you would try to excuse the actions of those rampers if they are in fact guilty, or blame the TSA for unwarranted intrusion.
The fact that they were smuggling drugs (which is wildly illegal and probably more damaging to this country than most of the terrorist acts) simply indicates that most people have a price. Name the price and they will break the law for the money.

If a ramper is caught smuggling contraband onto an a/c--especially if that contraband happens to be a bomb--I don't care whether it was the TSA, FBI, or a nosy little old gray-haired lady that caught him/her. I want them caught.

 

[Ttailfan]

So you say. However, the SIDA authorization doesn't mean that. What it means is that at the time you were investigated, you had no disqualifying actions or connections in your past. Let's not forget that the rampers arrested in SJU for drug smuggling also had SIDA badges.

As someone who flies on the a/c every day I am at work, I can NOT believe that any of you would try to excuse the actions of those rampers if they are in fact guilty, or blame the TSA for unwarranted intrusion.
The fact that they were smuggling drugs (which is wildly illegal and probably more damaging to this country than most of the terrorist acts) simply indicates that most people have a price. Name the price and they will break the law for the money.

If a ramper is caught smuggling contraband onto an a/c--especially if that contraband happens to be a bomb--I don't care whether it was the TSA, FBI, or a nosy little old gray-haired lady that caught him/her. I want them caught.

I'm not making any excuses for criminal activity. In fact, part of what I do as service to my community is work as a reserve sheriff's deputy. So, I'm about arresting criminals...not excusing them.

My comments were in with repsect to how the TSA tends to react to things. And how rediculous it is at times. Like you said, at the time of my SIDA badging, I was clean and the fact that I have been wearing the badge of a law enforcement officer for 13 years, shows that not only am I clean, but I keep my self clean of criminal activity.

But applying the mentality of the TSA with respect all people who are at the airport, including SIDA badged individuals to my fellow sheriff's deputies...am I supposed to assume that every single one of them is suspect every single day that they (and I) put the uniform on?

Oh, but this suspicion does NOT apply to the TSA. They can walk up and down gaining access to the concourse at will and no one questions, screens, inspects or checks them in any way. They simply walk up the opposite side of the concourse at will. They have SIDA badges, too. If I can't be trusted, why can they? They are just as capable of committing a crime as any one of us.

 

[jimntx]

No, that is not what you said. You said, "But as a SIDA authorized employee, I'm not the threat to my airplanes/passengers or any of any other airline for that matter." Obviously, the arrests in SJU show that one can have a SIDA badge and still be a threat. You are not a threat because you are an honest, moral person, not because you have been issued a badge of some kind.

As far as the TSA operating under different rules than the rest of us, I see uniformed police officers breaking the law almost daily--while in their private vehicles speeding, parking in no parking zones, not coming to a complete stop before turning right on red. I knew a woman in Houston whoe husband was a police officer. She was stopped for speeding (65 in a 35 zone) and given a ticket. She threw a fit when she got to work because "everybody knows that police spouses aren't supposed to be given tickets." Does that mean that we need to have another layer of law enforcement to keep the guards guarded? At some point, you have to accept and believe that this person(s) is the final authority as far as you are concerned.

And the TSA overreacts? What about the times when I see 4 police cars stopped at a minor fender bender accident that is not blocking traffic? I agree that sometimes the TSA reaction to incidents can be draconian, but which would you rather have? They make the decision that this is an isolated incident that will never happen again and then an a/c is blown up? Or, they tighten security for everyone at least temporarily?

Besides, arguing with a TSA employee will get you about as far as arguing with a police officer. It's not really a recommended course of action. They have the final say whether you get through security or not. End of discussion. My Daddy always told us when we were growing up--particularly as we obtained driver's licenses--"as far as you are concerned, the law is what the cop on the beat says it is. If he is wrong, that is what lawyers and our court system are for."

 

[DallasConehead]

My Daddy always told us when we were growing up--particularly as we obtained driver's licenses--"as far as you are concerned, the law is what the cop on the beat says it is. If he is wrong, that is what lawyers and our court system are for."

I am sure they are not above the law, call your congressman. How you can hang the actions of a gov. agency on the Union or Company is out there for me.

This is exactly my point, as has been previously said, there is no excuse for criminal activity. However, as the original poster of the thread said, what about the errant screener that feels the need to go thru my lunch box? Especially if the supposed "big hole" of employee portals is closed.

When the heavy handed actions of the state are causing problems for the people, why shouldn't our representative organizations conduct some sort of legal actions, do some lobbying, sponsor a petition, at the very least organize the membership in a letter campaign to our US Representatives?

I am not trying to hang the actions of the government on the Union, but, I do charge our unions with being unrepresentative in how they all have handled the government with regard to our rights as citizens and employees, they have done absolutely nothing to help their membership deal with the heavy handed screener that feels the need to touch my fork..

 

[gatemech]

Some interesting post. Like the article stated. The cost to check all employees would be outrageous. What about airlines that have maintenance facilities at large airports? How would you check mechanics towing or taxing A/C to and from the terminal, people running parts all over the airport, cleaners going from terminal to hanger all day and night? Some of the tools mechanics use would never get through security. How do you fix a/c without tools? Operations would come to a halt. The background checks will have to do. I know I had a Customs and FBI background check. The public wants to get from point A to point B at the lowest cost. If every airline employee were to be checked every time they go in and out of the sterile area it's going to cost. That cost will be forwarded to the passengers. I believe the TSA is a joke. Right now it is all we have. As for the employees go let the Government do repeated background checks.

 

[eolesen]

Being "a SIDA authorized employee" doesn't mean you're not a risk or a threat any more than the three steaming piles of dog poo in my back yard this morning meant we lived over a geothermal formation...

There are two well known cases where "SIDA authorized employees" either brought down or almost brought down aircraft (David Burke - PSA 182/Dec 1987; Auborn Calloway - FDX 705/April 1994).

All that passing a SIDA check means is you've never been caught doing anything illegal enough to get you banned from the AOA.

 

[gatemech]

Being "a SIDA authorized employee" doesn't mean you're not a risk or a threat any more than the three steaming piles of dog poo in my back yard this morning meant we lived over a geothermal formation...

There are two well known cases where "SIDA authorized employees" either brought down or almost brought down aircraft (David Burke - PSA 182/Dec 1987; Auborn Calloway - FDX 705/April 1994).

All that passing a SIDA check means is you've never been caught doing anything illegal enough to get you banned from the AOA.

The background checks were not as extensive in 1987. I remember when Burke took down the PSA A/C near Salinas CA. SFO didn't have AOA badges for everyone needing access to the sterile area till after that incident.