Well last night was great. Half of my crew were on the list for the next layoff round. Trained, hard working guys with lots of experience. And replacing or "bumping" them....idiots from god knows where. We lost an outbound last night to a group of these "professional aircraft mechanics", who I wouldn't let change my oil. Yes, 'ol senority (and I have some), it's killing us daily. The only way anyone will stop and listen to what is happening is when one of these pigs drops out of the sky. I'm so P.O. I could spit nails...and not one single management type is going...in fact, we are ADDING a new "group" to help monitor our work! I swear, there is no God.
More Mechanics Out The Door
- Thread starter The Ronin
- Start date
Dilligas
Veteran
It is beyond a shame what is happening in this industry. The beancounters are destroying careers in a frenzy. I sympathize with your frustration and anger. Sad to say, this trend will continue unabated until a tragedy occurs, and then there will be a clamor about the cost cutting and lack of foresight. Aviation is unforgiving and most folks have no idea of the dedication, safety awareness, and professionalism of the folks who keep 'em flying, and the often unpleasant working conditions they are forced to work in, both physically and psychologically. Factor in the nomadic lifestyle of being bumped, away from those you love, trying to commute just to keep a job, its a lot to deal with.
Hang in there. Good luck to the UAL employees from a friend at U.
Hang in there. Good luck to the UAL employees from a friend at U.
bankernclt
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As a passenger, I agree that the work should stay in house. I would like to here some pilots' perspective regarding the outsourcing of maintenance.
BTW, United is the best on the ground and in the air. Good luck and keep turning this company around. Make is the biggest success story in the industry.
BTW, United is the best on the ground and in the air. Good luck and keep turning this company around. Make is the biggest success story in the industry.
Hmmm, let me think, a highly trained responsible individual who is an intergral part of my company, and who has a vested interest in MY safety, or a $8 dollar an hour beer guzzling temp fender pounder who bounces from unskilled job to another, who is supervised, along with about 10 of his buddies, by one "real" mechanic who maybe gets checked out by the FAA once in a blue moon... Man that's a tough call 🙄 😉 I know who I'd want working on the jet MY family flies on. Unfortunately, the average travelor is either too uninformed or too stupid to care. It will take a few hull loses due to contract MX (we have one already), then joe public will blame the government for his choice to forgo safety to save $5 on a transcon ticketbankernclt said:
Dea Certe
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The airline industry spent years convincing the public that flying was safe. We employees at all airlines invested our blood, sweat and tears making sure it was indeed the safest way to travel. Are we going to allow this effort to be thrown away by a bunch of greedy, grasping MBA's who probably weren't even out of diapers when we started our careers?
This has got to stop. We may have already degraded ourselves out of fear but let's not lose lives over it. Corporate America is playing chicken. They will eat each other alive and then point to the first one who blinks as the "loser".
Who's going to be the biggest loser in the toughest game of chicken ever played?
Myself, I've had enough. I hope all airline employees out there who care about the safety of the traveling public will stand up and say so. We must support each other. Enough of this brinksmanship.
It's time for informational picketing. All the airlines, all the professionals. And let's pray that's all it has to be.
Dea
Another supporter of the fine people at UAL
This has got to stop. We may have already degraded ourselves out of fear but let's not lose lives over it. Corporate America is playing chicken. They will eat each other alive and then point to the first one who blinks as the "loser".
Who's going to be the biggest loser in the toughest game of chicken ever played?
Myself, I've had enough. I hope all airline employees out there who care about the safety of the traveling public will stand up and say so. We must support each other. Enough of this brinksmanship.
It's time for informational picketing. All the airlines, all the professionals. And let's pray that's all it has to be.
Dea
Another supporter of the fine people at UAL
ONTHESTREET
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Unfortunatly we are victims of our own success.
Never in the history of aviation has our safety record been so good. Part of this is due to technology, i.e. better equipment, but mostly it is due to increased quality of training and high caliber people.
The flying public however sees this incredible safety record as proof that anybody can fly and work on an aircraft, after all they fly themselves, right!!! So we end up with the overpaid bus driver type comments and feelings.
As was pointed out above, the flying public will not care about such things until there are multible smoking holes in the ground.
There has already been one (CLT) and several close calls (Read the NTSB incident files) but do not expect anyone to care until the body count goes up a bit.
Just one pilots opinion.
Never in the history of aviation has our safety record been so good. Part of this is due to technology, i.e. better equipment, but mostly it is due to increased quality of training and high caliber people.
The flying public however sees this incredible safety record as proof that anybody can fly and work on an aircraft, after all they fly themselves, right!!! So we end up with the overpaid bus driver type comments and feelings.
As was pointed out above, the flying public will not care about such things until there are multible smoking holes in the ground.
There has already been one (CLT) and several close calls (Read the NTSB incident files) but do not expect anyone to care until the body count goes up a bit.
Just one pilots opinion.
U
UAL_TECH
Guest
Unfortunately,
I do not believe that a singular incident will change the course of events that have been set in motion.
As we outsource our maintenance, we willingly sell/donate our tooling as part of the package.
Once our tooling is gone, bringing work back will be cost prohibitive.
(Uh sorry, we don't have the tooling!)
I've posted previously on the hazards of outsourcing before with minimal public support.
What can I say at this point?
Take Care,
<_< UT
I do not believe that a singular incident will change the course of events that have been set in motion.
As we outsource our maintenance, we willingly sell/donate our tooling as part of the package.
Once our tooling is gone, bringing work back will be cost prohibitive.
(Uh sorry, we don't have the tooling!)
I've posted previously on the hazards of outsourcing before with minimal public support.
What can I say at this point?
Take Care,
<_< UT
United's maintenance is the best that I've seen. I've been flying for 20+ years both military and other civilian carriers. It is unfortunate that many passengers feel that mechanics (like pilots) are overpaid.bankernclt said:
I've switched avatars to go for a new comedic theme, but I'd like to remind the readers out there that there are many airline workers that will have their finances pushed to the limits with the current downdraft in the industry. I was fortunate enough to not have any bills prior to being furloughed; there are many who weren't as fortunate.
I think my point was only partially understood. (1) These cutbacks are thinning us to the bone, everyone got that. (2) This "cut" based only on senority IS killing us.
They're getting rid of backshops, we understand that. And some guys due to the last layoffs are very qualified mechanics who got stuck back there. But many don't have any idea what we do with operational aircraft. I'm sitting there in the flight deck with a guy who has to go and tell his wife and 4 kids, that after +10yrs he doesn't have a job. Not because he doesn't work, he's great. Not because he not technically proficient, he's one of the best. And the guy bumping him out is a walking moron who belongs tinkering in some shop because he is a menace on an airplane. I've got another friend I have known for over 10yrs who is one of the best composite guys in the business. Folks, I mean the best. Adios amigo. And I don't know anyone including myself that can do what he can. Who's going to replace him? Some guy who's been cutting carpet for 15yrs because it was easy and he didn't have to be responsible for signing off repair work!
We're trying to release a guppy and we got a ram air door problem. I've got 2 mechanics who've got no idea what they are doing running around with their heads cutoff. I'm troubleshooting this thing, split the system, jump power to the controller and everything works. We need to go back up the system. I turn around and these two are tearing apart what we just made work! I snatch them by the neck and ask them what the f**k are you doing? They just look at me with a very confused expression. I check one more thing and then point to what they really need to change. Plane is fixed but we lose the release....WE LOSE FOLKS. We are hanging by a thread and our company doesn't give a rats ass. Sure, we are "operating" so freak'n great, our management can't pat themselves on the back hard enough. But I think everyone knows from operations to maintenance we are doing it with one hell of a magic act.
They're getting rid of backshops, we understand that. And some guys due to the last layoffs are very qualified mechanics who got stuck back there. But many don't have any idea what we do with operational aircraft. I'm sitting there in the flight deck with a guy who has to go and tell his wife and 4 kids, that after +10yrs he doesn't have a job. Not because he doesn't work, he's great. Not because he not technically proficient, he's one of the best. And the guy bumping him out is a walking moron who belongs tinkering in some shop because he is a menace on an airplane. I've got another friend I have known for over 10yrs who is one of the best composite guys in the business. Folks, I mean the best. Adios amigo. And I don't know anyone including myself that can do what he can. Who's going to replace him? Some guy who's been cutting carpet for 15yrs because it was easy and he didn't have to be responsible for signing off repair work!
We're trying to release a guppy and we got a ram air door problem. I've got 2 mechanics who've got no idea what they are doing running around with their heads cutoff. I'm troubleshooting this thing, split the system, jump power to the controller and everything works. We need to go back up the system. I turn around and these two are tearing apart what we just made work! I snatch them by the neck and ask them what the f**k are you doing? They just look at me with a very confused expression. I check one more thing and then point to what they really need to change. Plane is fixed but we lose the release....WE LOSE FOLKS. We are hanging by a thread and our company doesn't give a rats ass. Sure, we are "operating" so freak'n great, our management can't pat themselves on the back hard enough. But I think everyone knows from operations to maintenance we are doing it with one hell of a magic act.
johnny gearpin
Member
The Ronin,
Complacency, from my experience UAL and the IMC was a breeding ground for it prosper. Granted over time. It was a slow grind. After knowing only line maintenance and entering overhaul...I thought I would slit my wrists at the pace people kept. I had to find new low gears. I hated what I saw when I got there and I hated what I eventually became. Lazy. I got complacent. And many of the finest wrenches I ever met lost an edge and motivation. A Slow grind.
Many are resistive to changing habits. Even if it's destructive, it's become normal for them. Even acceptable on some level, what they think they deserve. Many have come to feel comfortable with a horribly defined security. Why was the seat shop one of the highest seniority areas? The need for experience? Ha!
The line provided the instant job satisfaction. Plane comes in broke, it's got to go, you fix it, leaves safely, Bingo. I'm fortunate to be back in the line enviroment.
Familiarity pulls us back like a magnet. When our self-esteem has been so assaulted it doesn't matter much how bad our conditions are; they only match how bad we are feeling about ourselves.
Getting out of that cesspool was great for me. I took my lessons learned and moved on. Never to fall for the traps laid out before me. However I'll always miss the hundreds and hundreds of friends. I feel for them. Many know nothing of aviation outside of UAL. Fortunate in one respect.
Complacency, from my experience UAL and the IMC was a breeding ground for it prosper. Granted over time. It was a slow grind. After knowing only line maintenance and entering overhaul...I thought I would slit my wrists at the pace people kept. I had to find new low gears. I hated what I saw when I got there and I hated what I eventually became. Lazy. I got complacent. And many of the finest wrenches I ever met lost an edge and motivation. A Slow grind.
Many are resistive to changing habits. Even if it's destructive, it's become normal for them. Even acceptable on some level, what they think they deserve. Many have come to feel comfortable with a horribly defined security. Why was the seat shop one of the highest seniority areas? The need for experience? Ha!
The line provided the instant job satisfaction. Plane comes in broke, it's got to go, you fix it, leaves safely, Bingo. I'm fortunate to be back in the line enviroment.
Familiarity pulls us back like a magnet. When our self-esteem has been so assaulted it doesn't matter much how bad our conditions are; they only match how bad we are feeling about ourselves.
Getting out of that cesspool was great for me. I took my lessons learned and moved on. Never to fall for the traps laid out before me. However I'll always miss the hundreds and hundreds of friends. I feel for them. Many know nothing of aviation outside of UAL. Fortunate in one respect.
Sorry The Ronin,The Ronin said:
But it does appear to me that a group that was suppose to be working as a "team" ended up going their own individual directions instead of working as a "team". Hey, sure don't need three supervisors watching over three mechanics.
Nice post johnny gearpin.
Seniority only really works for the pilot's group, where they are have to meet performance standards. It's hard to fake being a pilot, but once you have an mechanic's position, you can go ROTC (Retired On The Clock). Some mechanics have gone for several years without ever utilizing their certificates. What's up with that?
Ronin,
It seems like a lot of crying for a group who could go out and make this money anywhere.
I hate to say this but you guys brought everything that has happened on yourselves.
You were completely insane with full pay until the last day, and not working with the company a long time ago.
You have made your bed but don't want to lay in it.
By the way, whatever happened to we are all professionals and deserve more money. Seems like you are all snapping at each other again.
So much for a united union. You really show that you are all out for yourselves and not one team.
Seniority is king and you better accept it. That is the only thing between you and the street.
If you think I feel a little bitter about your stand with Ual, I am. Maybe trying would have still put us where we are but you guys did not see the wall let alone the writing on it.
Quit crying and take it like a man.
