Never Too Late

[USA320Pilot]

700UW:

I agree that new aircraft are covered by existing union contract until a CBA is obtained for the combined business enterprise. Thus, I have a few questions.

How many new jets is US Airways receiving before the operational integration? Then when seniority lists are merged will US Airways or America West terms be part of the new agreement?

Regards,

USA320Pilot

 

[700UW]

Look at the PSA and PI Mergers, there were not new contracts negotiated, PSA and PI employees fell under the exsisting M&R contracts, a merger agreement was negotiated on seniority intergration and when the employees would fall under the CBA that remained in effect.

There is not going to be a new CBA negotiated and the NMB will determine if there will be an election or not and if there is not an election the NMB normally gives the certification to the union with the larger membership ie PSA M&R were teamsters, no election determined by the NMB and they all fell under the IAM M&R CBA.

 

[delldude]

Look at the PSA and PI Mergers, there were not new contracts negotiated, PSA and PI employees fell under the exsisting M&R contracts, a merger agreement was negotiated on seniority intergration and when the employees would fall under the CBA that remained in effect.

There is not going to be a new CBA negotiated and the NMB will determine if there will be an election or not and if there is not an election the NMB normally gives the certification to the union with the larger membership ie PSA M&R were teamsters, no election determined by the NMB and they all fell under the IAM M&R CBA.

[post="272414"][/post]​

these are abnormal times dictated by immoral people......stay tooned..... :blink:

 

[justaumechanic]

You are assuming that the Current IAM contract will be the surviving CBA.. Correct? There is no guarantee that will be the case.

Currently the IBT is in negotiations with AmericaWest. It is highly likely that the IBT contract could be the surviving CBA which would put all of the current US Airways employee's under it.

Keep in mind there is no scope protection in the AmericaWest CBA. They have free will to farm out anything they want.

Don't be so confident that the surviving CBA will be the IAM's contract with US Airways.. Piedmont and PSA were bought by US Airways and operationally merged into its exisiting CBA's. This is not the case with AmericaWest. They are the stalking horse not US Airways.

Be rest assured that Doug Parker has no interest in increasing the costs of opertions especially in the Mtc Side.. He is going to cut and slash because he has no other options.. Neither side is flush with cash..

ACE aviation is not putting money in for fun. They have every intention of going after the Airbus Maintenance along with the A330, 757/767.. You can count on it.

And Dell brings up a good point.. There is nothing stopping them from dumping any of the leases at the last min in PIT or CLT. All that takes is a piece of paper in front of the judge. They can exercise their option to farm out anything do to facility constraints which then puts the whole scope thing back in the grievence process. And that is if the US Airways CBA is the surviving contract.. Don't plan on it.

Look at the PSA and PI Mergers, there were not new contracts negotiated, PSA and PI employees fell under the exsisting M&R contracts, a merger agreement was negotiated on seniority intergration and when the employees would fall under the CBA that remained in effect.

There is not going to be a new CBA negotiated and the NMB will determine if there will be an election or not and if there is not an election the NMB normally gives the certification to the union with the larger membership ie PSA M&R were teamsters, no election determined by the NMB and they all fell under the IAM M&R CBA.

[post="272414"][/post]​

 

[apofurlough]

As a condition of its equity investment, ACE has obtained commitments
which will result in five-year commercial agreements with the newly-merged
entity regarding maintenance services, ground handling, regional jet flying,
network, training, and other areas of cooperation. It is expected that ACTS
and airport ground handling/facilities synergies will result in an estimated
annual cash contributions of CAD $65 million.


They also mention other possibilities - like ground handling. Could this mean we might benefit also by doing their ground handling in some airports? I know in my former airport AC is handled by UA. What are thoughts that US or HP might pick up the ground handling of their aircraft in the states?

 

[hharotz]

What is preventing US from spinning off its technical services into a separate, profitable venture like Air Canada? We have the experience, the facilities and the 'home-field' advantage to keep work in the USA....especially with the renegotiated contracts, labor costs shouldn't even be that big an issue?

[post="272412"][/post]​

As a follow up to this though, even AA is trying to make money from keeping MTC in house:

American Air wants to turn cost center into cash cow

 

[UAL_TECH]

these are abnormal times dictated by immoral people......stay tooned..... :blink:

[post="272457"][/post]​

delldude,

Why are you so negative?

View attachment 2951

UT

 

[delldude]

delldude,

Why are you so negative?

View attachment 2951

UT

[post="272846"][/post]​

an honest man.....make a good CEO.

 

[eolesen]

You are assuming that the Current IAM contract will be the surviving CBA.. Correct? There is no guarantee that will be the case.

[post="272459"][/post]​

Actually, it's 98% certain. Unless the percentage of HP employees represented by a CBA exceeds 35% of the combined population, the IAM contract becomes the surviving entity.

Sure, there's always the potential for another outcome, but I wouldn't bet on it.

 

[BoeingBoy]

Air Canada's monies had strings tied to them doing maintenance. What the details are I do not know.

[post="272259"][/post]​

To flesh out the maintenance contract that ACE will get....

The ACE agreement states that US/HP anticipate at least $228 million per year in maintenance work going to ACTS. Their last quarterly report showed a profit margin of over 11%, making that worth at least $23 million per year in profits to ACTS. They'll get their $75 million investment back in three years even if no other benefits are realized.

Jim

 

[justaumechanic]

Correct me if I am wrong. The 35% means that the IAM would represent right? That does not mean that the US Airways CBA is the surviving document.

My understanding is that the 35% means which union will represent however the CBA is another story. What agreement would survive? I would imagine that AmericaWest leadership would intend their current contract with their people be the surviving document considering it is much more liberal that the US Airways CBA.

Don't put it past the company to apply for another section 1113 to void the contract in favor of the AmericaWest contract. The judge would be faced with the decision to decide which contract to go with. Hmmmmm.. What do you think he would do?

Actually, it's 98% certain. Unless the percentage of HP employees represented by a CBA exceeds 35% of the combined population, the IAM contract becomes the surviving entity.

Sure, there's always the potential for another outcome, but I wouldn't bet on it.

[post="272970"][/post]​

 

[DesertRat]

HP has outsourced heavy maintenance for years. It's been going to S America (El Salvadore or Panama, I think). Now it sounds like the plan is it will go north of border to Canada.

Sooner or later post-merger all the heavy maint at HP/US will be outsourced, sorry to say.

Stay cool,

DesertRat

 

[pitguy]

Most operators outsource. There is little one can do about it. I know for fact the quality is not as good by a wide margin, but it may be cheaper. It is difficult for me to put hard numbers to see if is truly cheaper. You have to factor more and longer delays, more parts swapping, crews running out of time due to delays, upset customers, and if you have an event that makes the news, etc…. Still I have to guess some bean counter has it figured out as to where it saves money, but there is no way the quality compares of most in house maintenance versus outsource maintenance.

 

[700UW]

HP's heavy mtc is outsourced to TIMCO in Lake City, FL, they do not outsource to foriegn repair stations.

And if US tries another 1113 filing, negotiations have to take place all over again and a hearing, it just does not file a motion and put in place whatever they want.

 

[cltbay1homie]

HP's heavy mtc is outsourced to TIMCO in Lake City, FL, they do not outsource to foriegn repair stations.

And if US tries another 1113 filing, negotiations have to take place all over again and a hearing, it just does not file a motion and put in place whatever they want.

[post="273128"][/post]​

They also do them in Goodyear, AZ (Timco)