Psa And Piedmont Fa's Ready For War

[skyguy25]

An "Emergency Information and Action Alert Bulletin" was delieved to PSA Airline's FA's.
It seems as though the Presidents of both airlines are proposing, and i quote, an integration of PSA & Piedmont FA seniority lists "when", not if, Piedmont no longer exists.
A meeting is scheduled in DC within the week to discuss this with Express Executives.
This could mean a loss of seniority for PSA FA's affecting bid awards, Promos, Vacations, ect.
PSA FA's were never notified by their own LEC President, who met with Piedmont's, that this proposition was even a consideration.

Needless to say, I don't think that PSA's LEC president will be acting for much longer.

Does anyone offer any information? And why was the other WO not mentioned. PSA is ready to fight a long battle and make sure that their seniority is protected.

 

[skyguy25]

Clarification: this is being proposed by the LEC PRESIDENT'S NOT and i repeat NOT the actual CEO's of the respected airlines. This is all being done on the FA level.

 

[flyin2low]

A 'Staple Job' would work fine.

 

[Doc]

If it were united you would want your senority.

We are all brothers and sisiters don't forget

 

[Light Years]

Date of hire seniority, merged, is the only fair way. Especially in this instance where its two subsidiaries of the same company merging, not reallt a takeover or anything. Plus with the jet order I'm sure there is room for everyone.

Best of luck to our wholly owned brothers and sisters from the mainline FAs. Senior people may not know the difference, but most furloughees know which airlines are part of the company (as we are about to be "wholly owned express"ed ourselves). Management wants a bunch of different, non WO carriers to whipsaw and pit WO vs affiliates and WOs vs each other. A single list and unified, owned carrier can help bring the US flying and US employees back on the property. Its time for US Airways, MidAtlantic-to-be, Piedmont, PSA, and Allegheny flight attendants to get on the same page and protect US Airways Group jobs, especially with this management and "business plan".


With all that said, are they just doing a preliminary, see-what-it-looks-like kind of thing or what? Where is Allegeny (also AFA) in all of this? I haven't seen anything about the two carriers merging and can't see how just the FAs could... is this if PDT goes under, they can slide into PSA at seniority? If so, this is still fair- a FA with seniority shouldnt lose thier job while new hires at another division/sub of the company remain. Which brings us back to the bigger picture....

 

[airlineorphan]

Ummmm, it's not up to the LEC presidents. It's in the AFA constitution. Mergers of AFA represented carriers mean seniority integration by Date Of Hire.

It's there for a reason: To protect seniority rights from management games. To make it harder for management to pit us against each other.

We are all in this together. If you are only in it for yourself, then I'm not sure I'd want to entrust my safety to you on an a/c.

Solidarity is the only way,
-Airlineorphan

 

[skyguy25]

Why all of a sudden should PDT feel that they should have the "rights", if you will
to go to PSA, I do believe that things are bountiful in the jet area at PSA because they were the ones to step up to the plate taking consessions
and gave Airways what they wanted when they needed it most. PDT did nothing
to support mainline- now they see the jets and want part of the pie.
Doesn't seem fair to me, W/O or not. They should have thought about that a long time ago.
Why then, didn't they take as many furloughed FA's from mainline as they could, give them jobs at the W/o rather then hire of the street as PSA has done. PSA and their crews deserve what they worked hard for, not PDT.
I highly doubt that Airways or anyone at CCY will be fond of, or support a
true merger of the W/o. Mainline feels that PSA is doing something right to give them operation of the CRJ-200 -and rumor has it -the CRJ-700 as well.
The best thing that can happen to USAirways is the phasing out of PDT and Allegheny all together.

 

[Light Years]

:down: The best thing that can happen to US Airways is the phasing out of YOU all together. :down:

How dare you wish for fellow US Airways Group employees to lose thier jobs. As airlineorphan said, its in the AFA merger policy. It would have been that way with United-US Airways as well. Why? Because its fair.

And I dont recall, a WO employee may know better, but wasnt PSA just the cheapest to begin with? That and the Dornier phase out were probably why the jets were placed there. I thought one of the other two "stepped up" first.


And, FYI, none of the wholly owneds including PSA "took" mainline furloughees before people off the street. They have hired some, I know a few at each, but I know MANY that were turned away, which is a disgrace.

ALL of the employees have "worked hard" and sacrificed much for this airline, and deserve much more than what they have.

Enjoy your barbie jet, and try not to think about the thousands of mainline flight attendants that have already lost the career they so worked hard to achieve.

 

[skyguy25]

My intent was not at all to suggest that they should be out of a job. Place them at the bottom of PSA's list and let them have their travel date. As for your comment on mainline FA's I was suggesting that maybe they should have been given
first rights on the new jobs at PSA. Just like the jets for jobs program
And you thought wrong about the "others" stepping up first and yes i do believe that PSA was the cheapest to begin with. PDT's Dash are out of lease and not being replaced with anything. So your comment about the phasing out of the Dornier makes no sense.
Get your facts correct before making brash comments- and talking down about the so-called "barbie jets" that PSA and MDA are utilizing.....the aircraft (s) that will hopefully help USAirways live a few years longer.

 

[airlineorphan]

The best thing that can happen to USAirways is the phasing out of PDT and Allegheny all together.

Let us be absolutely clear about what you are saying here:

1) PSA employees are better than other employees because they gave concessions.

2) The best thing to do is throw all the employees at PDT and Allegheny out on the street.

It doesn't sound as noble when you have to face the cold harsh reality of what you are suggesting. I encourage you to reconsider your position on this.

Hell, I was blown away that CCY had the gall to go after concessions from the W/O's to begin with. What do folks on C-Scale wages have to give back in the first place? Most who gave concessions at mainline and elsewhere now understand that they were played. Remember that. The players at CCY are still trying to play you.

When you turn your back upon your coworkers at PDT and Allegheny, I remind you that there but for fortune go you. We are all part of a big shell game. I'm not prepared to sacrifice any of my sisters and brothers, no matter which shell they are under. Remember, the ones to watch are the flimflam artists on top who set up the big game and laugh all the way to the bank as we all fall upon each other. Don't fall for it!!!!

Solidarity,
Airlineorphan

 

[skyguy25]

Once again, both points that you so clearly oulined, is not at all what i was saying.
1) PSA employees are better than other employees because they gave concessions

-FALSE they are not better, but does it show something about their personal committment to the organization as a whole. Can you say the same for PDT and ALG? that is for thought I don't have an answer just playing devils advocate

2) The best thing to do is throw all the employees at PDT and Allegheny out on the street.

-FALSE- how would you feel if UAL came over to us and dropped us all on the list? or for that matter what would PDT say if PSA did an integretion if PDT had the jets? Would they say "welcome, take my vacation and my line!" Not sure.

Let me be clear that no one should lose their job, but why should one person reap the benefits created by another? this is not utopia

 

[airlineorphan]

My intent was not at all to suggest that they should be out of a job. Place them at the bottom of PSA's list and let them have their travel date.

Okay, I see that while I was composing my deathless prose you made the above disclaimer.

But consider this: Is this a merger or a phasing out? Is there a difference when it comes to the wholly owned's? Does the difference matter?

If the ALG and PDT equipment is cobbled together under PSA, then it is a merger and the seniority integration must be by date of hire per AFA constitution. If not, you are letting the company get away with a merger that it calls a phase out or some other mumbo-jumbo. Okay, so you staple the PDT and ALG folks at the bottom of your seniority. Some or most or all of them keep their jobs this way, but solidarity is shattered and the management gets to run circles around your workplace for years (witness the level of goodwill at AMR between the so-called "nAAtives" and the former TWA folks).

On the other hand, the phase out involved the unloading of PDT and ALG equipment (as well as PSA equipment) along with a good bit of charry picking of the best a/c PDT and ALG have. In this case, we return to my original assertion: The phase out of ALG and PDT means throwing those employees out on the street.

Either way, people are thrown out on the street. Either way, years of bad blood are fostered. Either way, management laughs all the way to the bank.

The only thing we have is each other. That is what solidarity is about: Recognizing that fact, understanding that if we go it alone or depend upon the paternalism of management, we will sink into a morass of squalor and rancor, and knowing that only together as airline workers can we hope to make things better than they are.

To squander the possibility of solidarity on a self-defeating act of stapling coworkers on the false hope that it will somehow preserve jobs is to court disaster not only for those who would be kicked to the curb, but also for yourself.

Aside from flying kites in thunderstorms, Ben Franklin had a fare bit of wisdom, especially when he said "We must hang together, for if we do not, we will surely hang separately."

Time for us to hang together.

-Airlineorphan

 

[airlineorphan]

Skyguy25, When you said

I do believe that things are bountiful in the jet area at PSA because they were the ones to step up to the plate taking consessions
and gave Airways what they wanted when they needed it most. PDT did nothing
to support mainline

it implied to me that you think that these concessions make PSA employees somehow more deserving than PDT and ALG employees.

Same when you said

PSA and their crews deserve what they worked hard for, not PDT.

If you meant something else, I think you can imagine how it reads like you are saying that you think PSA folks are somehow better than PDT (or ALG by implication).

If UAL came over here and bought us, they'd have to integrate on date of hire because of the AFA constitution. They have a relatively more junior workforce at UAL, so there certainly would be a lot of UAL folks who would want to figure out a way to get around that and staple us. I'd be for date-of-hire seniority integration, whether or not it was part of the AFA constitution though.

If the roles were reversed and someone from PDT were declaring the virtues of stapling PSA and ALG, then I'd be giving them a hard time too. Same principle. You have to defend that which preserves some solidarity. If not, you are screwed.

-Airlineorphan

 

[oldiebutgoody]

I'm confused. Is PDT being merged with PSA, or just going away? If they aren't bringing something to the table, why are they entitled to anything? Who then is out on the street, the PSA junior guys? That doesn't seem fair. If it is a true merger, then some kind of date of hire with some protections for the current PSA guys might be in order. Just my take, not that anybody cares.

 

[NCflyer]

skyguy25,

Before you get your panties in any more of a wad, get your own facts straight.

It is my understanding that this entire proposal is some sort of deal worked out by an AFA rep at PSA to help her secure a job by her boyfriend/fiance from ALG. The entire thing is rumored to have been worked out by them 2 in secret. The last I heard the PDT FA's weren’t even aware of it.

Also before rushing into judgment about PDT & ALG's pilots let's review a little history. It was the PDT pilots and ALL the other work groups that were the first to ratify concessions (not something that I am necessarily proud of). ALG was second. PSA didn't even have all their work groups on board until some time after the announcement that they would be getting RJs. And if you remember Mr. Siegel stated many times that the first WO to be on board would be the first to get RJs. One of the many lies by him and others at Crystal City. But that is another subject altogether.

Also while those at PSA are whining about their losing the D328s we at PDT have already lost about 35% of our fleet and about 30% of our pilots. In fact on a percentage basis we have lost more than the mainline at USAirways.