MCI transplant
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<_< ----If this merger go'es through, how will the Senoritys be Merged? ---- Ground crews? F/A's? Pilots?---- Any thoughts?
Question?
- Thread starter MCI transplant
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LGA Fleet Service
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Look around the threads brother, there are already some US people are chanting Staple! Staple!
I guess the logic is stapling a union person is unacceptable, but a non union person should have known better and organized, so it is their own fault they got stapled.
Charlie_Tuna
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You will hear tons of rumors but the cat won't be let out of the bad until it is too late.
rsv4ever
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im a US f/a. i think date of hire is the only fair way to go. any other way will lead to too much "hate" (more so than there already is) between airlines. at work no one is saying to staple delta employees to the bottom... i am only hearing that on the message boards.
Twicebaked
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I agree! Although US Airways WILL be acguiring Delta (not like the MERGER of AWA) US has never in history (union or not) stapled anybody. It has always been done DOH. Even when Trump bought the Eastern shuttle and later US bought it, US gave the Eastern girls their seniority back. Was THAT fair?? NO!...what was done in the past should have be kept in the past.....but!?!?. Delta's list as it is now will be integrated DOH.
No, Western Airlines f/a will not get their Western back, but the way the list is now...is the way it will be adopted and integrated.
Any Delta flight attendants (thinking pos. and rationally about the good this brings) don't let a few scare you. Our union has already stated that they would do DOH.
However, (on a cautionary note) don't run around saying that the US flight attedants are horrible. There would be the possibility to turn like a "Pitbull".
We have no choice in this....embrace the change and the potential it brings for all employees.
longing4piedmont
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If you have no clue about what you are posting, you should just step away from the key board. You could not be more wrong.Delta royally screwed them, but Pan Am was in bankruptcy at the time so...
brokenwrench
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Delta royally screwed them, but Pan Am was in bankruptcy at the time so...
DL took the AMT's that were attached to the parts they bought. I.E. they bought the ETOPS A310's (junk) and there routes, so they hired the ETOPS AMT's. Those that were brought on were all given FULL credit immediately for pay and bennies however they could only exercise there seniority for bidding in 1/3 increments. After three years they had FULL credit.
Note sure about the other groups.
FYI when DL purchased Western, Northeast and C&S full time was given to the AMT'S immediately.
Michael B
Member
Delta royally screwed them, but Pan Am was in bankruptcy at the time so...
It is far better to keep your mouth shut and be thought a fool than to open it and remove all doubt.
********************
Delta - CSA merger:
Delta had the higher seniority, but Delta and CSA seniority lists were dovetailed. The benefit went to CSA. Because of the dovetailing done with the seniority lists, you could have started with Delta 10 years prior, and at bidding time been behind someone with 8 years carrier time who started with CSA.
Delta purchased Northeast Airlines:
DOH was the rule.
Delta Western merger:
DOH was the rule.
There was no Delta - Pan Am merger of any sort. Pan Am's assets were on the auction block and Delta bought some equipment and routes. Delta then offered first priority hiring status to ex Pan Am workers, AND phased in their full Pan Am seniority even though they were hired off the street. For pay and vacation, they got DOH from day 1. For bidding, depending on area, they got DOH after 6 months to 3 years. The 3 year phase in was done 1/3 seniority per year.
Pan Am'ers were handed a pot of gold and all most of them could do was whine.
LGA Fleet Service
Veteran
B)-->QUOTE(Michael B @ Nov 23 2006, 09:50 AM) [post="432462"][/post]
Pan Am'ers were handed a pot of gold and all most of them could do was whine.
[/quote]
Whine? Must be a matter of perspective Mike.Talk to any of the Pan Am people that didn't get that Delta pot of gold and see how they feel.
The Pan Am people I work with still view Delta with scorn and contempt.Most of them were laughing their asses off reading about the hostile takeover bid.
Pan Am'ers were handed a pot of gold and all most of them could do was whine.
[/quote]
Whine? Must be a matter of perspective Mike.Talk to any of the Pan Am people that didn't get that Delta pot of gold and see how they feel.
The Pan Am people I work with still view Delta with scorn and contempt.Most of them were laughing their asses off reading about the hostile takeover bid.
MMB
Senior
Your first statement says you disagree with what I said, but the rest supports my statement.
PanAm’s assets were on the auction block. United bought some Latin American routes and promised to hire ex-PanAm employees to staff them. I guess UA just forgot to hang out the ‘help wanted’ sign. Other airlines picked off what they wanted with mixed consideration to ex-PanAm personnel.
Delta bought some routes and some planes. Then Delta hung out a ‘Help Wanted’ sign and allowed priority hiring status to ex-PanAm employees, with full consideration to PanAm seniority. Like any other perspective employee being hired off the street; they had to apply, take a physical, and interview. They whined about all three, filing a lawsuit against Delta for having to take the physical AND about questions asked in the application and interview such as; “Do you take illegal drugs?†Somehow they thought these questions were an invasion of privacy and had no bearing on airline safety and NTSB rules.
From day 1 they got full PanAm longevity for pay and benefits and, depending on the area, 1/3 to full PanAm seniority for bidding. The ones who got 1/3 had the rest phased in over the next couple years.
Of the ones that came into my area, half spent more time complaining about the lack of a union and extolling the glories of PanAm and union life than they did working. They signed off work without performing the jobs and disappeared for hours. One made a habit of leaving in the middle of the shift at least once a week, and his was the loudest voice against Delta.
No other group hired by Delta got so much. I don’t know anyone else hired off the street that got any credit for working some place else. I worked with one person who had 23 years experience when he hired on with Delta and left every bit of it at the door. I left 9 years industry experience at the door.
I stand by my statement, with no allowance for perspective.
LGA Fleet Service
Veteran
No allowance for perspective?
Delta sees things one way, Pan Am another.
From the Pan Am side of the fence Delta is viewed as dishonest and a bearer of false promises.What happened to Delta and their investment in the "New Pan Am" that was going to focus on the Caribbean and South America?
Oh right, you got the Shuttle, the FRA Hub,JFK and then amazingly enough decided that "Further investment was unwise" and got the hell out of dodge and let what was left of Pan Am to die.
Preferential Employment Offer? My father had 35 years at Pan Am and his "Preferential Employment Offer" was P/T on the ramp in ATL.
In many Pan Am homes "Delta" is still a four letter word.
MMB
Senior
In an attempt to grow Pan Am’s domestic-route network overnight, Chairman William Seawell paid considerably more for National Airlines than it was worth in a bidding war in 1980. Besides the increased debt of an inflated price, the combined company built considerably more debt due to incompatible fleets.
(hmm… Massive expansion and incompatible fleets. Sounds a lot like what US is trying to do now.)
Seawell’s next bright idea was to attempt to save the airline by selling off the Pan Am Building in 1981 and the company's best money machine, the entire Pacific route network to United Airlines in 1985.
The 1986 hijacking of Pan Am Flight 73 in Pakistan, with over 140 passengers and crew killed or injured, and the 1988 bombing of Pan Am Flight 103 above Scotland, with 270 killed, set the last board in Pan Am’s coffin in place. Bookings fell even further and in October 1990, Pan Am sold its London Heathrow routes to United Airlines.
In a last ditch effort to become profitable thru downsizing, Pan Am filed bankruptcy and put their remaining European routes and the Pan Am Worldport at JFK Airport up for sale January 1991. Delta bought those AND gave the downsized Pan Am additional operating cash in the form of an open ended loan. Pan Am’s self predicted turnaround didn’t happen AND they invested the money contrary to what was agreed. Pan Am lost money even faster than before and demanded Delta come up with more. Delta’s backers agreed with industry annalist, that the loan had been foolish on Delta’s part. They demanded that Delta concern itself more with its own fiscal health and increase its own stake in the company before they would consider further support. Pan Am, obviously, went out of business December 1991.
Pan Am's last remaining hub at Miami International Airport was split between United Airlines, who took most of the routes, and American Airlines, who took most of the terminal space. United agreed to take on ex- Pan Am employees to staff those routes, but forgot about that part of the agreement while the ink was drying on the sales slip.
It looks like there was a lot that went in to Pan Am’s failure, with William Seawell heading the list. In fact, of all the players, Delta was the only one that tried to help. The consequences of that purchase and loan in 1999 brought Delta to the brink of bankruptcy then, and are a major factor in putting the company where it is now.
