UA''s Power Point on starting a Low Cost Carrier

av8orwife

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Aug 20, 2002
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This was posted on the United Board, but I thought it was really interesting.
http://www.the-mechanic.com/pdf/ual_creditors_01.pdf
It''s amazing what you can find on the internet.
There are over 270 screens in this presentation. Most of it is a dog & pony show stuff and is nothing new, BUT some of it is interesting.
United''s main focus in this presentation is how they need to create a Low Cost Carrier. They even point out that no one has really been sucessful with this concept, Metrojet, just to name one.
Yet that is the main focus of this presentation. Do the bean counters really think this will work or are they just happy to get paid to make a pretty presentation??? Only time will tell.
KJB
 

PITbull

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Dec 29, 2002
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U has adopted the LCC philosophy; Mid Atlantic is going to be U "jewel". UA is just mirroring U and all the majors will adopt this, as well. No one will allow the other to have the competing edge.


There were three issues this past summer in negotiations:
U's biggest concern in the summer negotiations was the RJ issue and getting relief from ALPA to start a LCC, Mid Atlantic. The other two issues, and the only issues discussed were the pension relief issue, and the qualifying for the ATSB guarantee. Hurdle for U was the "timeline" that was critical for the ATSB window. Concessions were needed for the ATSB qualifying. It's funny to read that UA thinks that (what) they are ingenious??? Nuts!

The rest is history....
 

Light Years

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Aug 27, 2002
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To clarify, MidAtlantic and United"s "Starfish" (that is the most horrendous name ever, by the way, worse than song-- let your imagination wander)are two different things.
MDA, as it stands now, will be operated as a part of US Airways, in my understanding it wont even be branded Express. Same class of service, same pricing structure, working, along with "mainline", the Shuttle, and the Express carriers to feed and expand the US network. Not going into union or pay issues, a brilliant idea. US Airways is the perfect candidate for 70-90 seat small jets.
Starfish, on the other hand, like Delta's Song, will be branded as a completly different entity. It will be similar to the idea of MetroJet, but not as immediatly identifiable with the mainline. UA will take specific routes (up to 30% of the mainline or perhaps even most of the domestic network) that compete with the Southwests or the world, or are just low-yield and offer a comprable service at a comprable price. This will replace the mainline service. Song will not touch Deltas main hubs, just bypass them with lower fare traffic. MetroJet was supposed to defend one specific hub, but of course ended up cannibilizing our other (down the street) hubs. Starfish on the other hand will be at every United hub. This will be very confusing for passengers, and will probably result in a nightmare travel perception. An example I saw somewhere was MCI-ORD. Starfish is great for Dan and Roseanne Connor going to see Jackie who lives in Chicago. But what about Dr. Goldstatus who is traveling onward first class to Tokyo? He wants FC all the way, or at least recognition for his miles status. He doesnt want to get knocked over by Dan Connor trying to get a window seat on the cramped Starfish plane with unassigned seats. Plus, I think its dangerous for a bunch of big wigs in Chicago to look at one of our nations cities and decide its a "Starfish" (read, white trash) city rather than one deserving of a "regular" service.
I think what PITbull is saying is that both companies are trying to make a secondary airline within an airline and bypass the original contracts we all signed up for. But MidAtlantic will take furloughed mainline employess, keeping their seniority and recall rights. Starfish wants to hire people off the street, or, if furloughed employees do go there, they can later be "hired" by the mainline, starting at the bottom, not as a transfer, but as a new hire. Now that is even scarier than an airline named after a slang word for an orifice. In these crazy times, I know where I'd rather be.
 

mga707

Veteran
Aug 19, 2002
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[blockquote]
----------------
On 2/18/2003 7:25:55 PM Light Years wrote:

To clarify, MidAtlantic and United"s "Starfish" (that is the most horrendous name ever, by the way, worse than song-- let your imagination wander)
[/blockquote]

Thank you, my sentiments exactly: Let's see..."Our new low-cost carrier is named after a lower phylum of animal life that ingests and excretes via the same bodily orifice..."
(Insert obvious joke here)
 

Slam&Click

Member
Aug 24, 2002
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[blockquote]
----------------
On 2/18/2003 9:06:52 PM mga707 wrote:

[blockquote]
----------------
On 2/18/2003 7:25:55 PM Light Years wrote:

To clarify, MidAtlantic and United"s "Starfish" (that is the most horrendous name ever, by the way, worse than song-- let your imagination wander)
[/blockquote]

Thank you, my sentiments exactly: Let's see..."Our new low-cost carrier is named after a lower phylum of animal life that ingests and excretes via the same bodily orifice..."
(Insert obvious joke here)

----------------
[/blockquote]

I believe LightYears might have been hinting at the the Chocolate Starfish reference. (Bohica by any other name?)

Wonder which braintrust decided this one was an appropriate name? One could venture that they've a sly sense of humor or their elevator doesn't go all the way to the top.
 

autofixer

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Aug 20, 2002
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Why not call it Dance. Then there will be Song and Dance out there. That is what it will be as the low fare carriers encroach upon the mainline hubs, i.e. JetBlue's just announced service from ATL - LGB.

The mature airlines which are trying to create LCCs are just whistling "Dixie". The giant kinetic motion machine has been set in motion, the mature carriers will fall one by one over the next 10 years, as revenue is picked off from their profit centers.
 

wwtraveler99

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Jan 31, 2003
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After looking at the presentation I noticed that it said confidental at the bottom of each page. Now how would this document happen to find itself on the internet. I don't think this is really that confidental.

Good luck to all of you at UA and US.


WW
 

767jetz

Veteran
Aug 20, 2002
3,286
2,779
[blockquote]
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On 2/18/2003 11:03:11 PM Slam&Click wrote:

I believe LightYears might have been hinting at the the Chocolate Starfish reference. (Bohica by any other name?)
----------------
[/blockquote]

Now that's disgusting! This is turning into a really $h1tty conversation.
 

diogenes

Veteran
Aug 22, 2002
2,515
0
[blockquote]
----------------
On 2/19/2003 7:19:08 AM autofixer wrote:

Why not call it Dance. Then there will be Song and Dance out there. That is what it will be as the low fare carriers encroach upon the mainline hubs, i.e. JetBlue's just announced service from ATL - LGB.

The mature airlines which are trying to create LCCs are just whistling "Dixie". The giant kinetic motion machine has been set in motion, the mature carriers will fall one by one over the next 10 years, as revenue is picked off from their profit centers.
----------------
[/blockquote]
-------------------------------------------

I have to agree, 'fixer. Ignoring WN isn't going to make them go away.
 

diogenes

Veteran
Aug 22, 2002
2,515
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[blockquote]
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On 2/19/2003 7:52:15 AM DELLDUDE wrote:

stardate 200319...these are the logs of the starfish enterprize.
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[/blockquote]
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Dude,

u crak me up!
 

GEO

Newbie
Jan 31, 2003
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UnitedChicago,

Really????? 'Starfish' isn't the offical name???? wow, thanks. Lightin' up.

GOP in '04!