US Pilots Labor Discussion 6/2- STAY ON TOPIC AND OBSERVE THE RULES

[Freebird]

Don't really need a new contract if the arbitrator rules in our favor over the LOA 93 pay freeze expiration. We...I mean the east....will be comfortably at industry standard.

Domino one down.

How's that damages trial looking today?

Another day under under LOA is nothing to celebrate. Enjoy your Industry Low Wages.

 

[Barrister]

I need to spend a few hours reading. The Addington plaintiffs, IMO, will likely file for an en banc reconsideration by the 9th. Needless to say I did not think this would happen, but I need to read all of it slowly to say anything more.

Oh, please ...take as much time as you need!!!

VNIIMN
NPJB

 

[ChuckBewFarley]

So now what ?

NOTHING!!!!!

Usapa gets to delay, delay, delay. No contract, case never ripe.

If, IF, they ever get a contract Seham will argue that the west waited to long to file!!!

My guess there will never be a joint contract, I hope I get to eat my words but I think that meal will never come to be.

My advice, learn to love LOA93...

 

[Crzipilot]

Since most of you wont read the decision, here's is a small excerpt to ponder.

Judge Bybee, Dissenting:

Here,
the absence of a CBA is itself powerful evidence of a DFR
violation. As set forth quite fairly in the majority opinion and
in a lengthy and careful opinion by the district court, the Air
Line Pilots Association (“ALPA”) was decertified and a new
union, the U.S. Airline Pilots Association (“USAPA”), certified
precisely to frustrate implementation of the Nicolau
Agreement and to negotiate a CBA with U.S. Airways that
favors the East Pilots. As the district court found, “USAPA’s
sole objective in adopting and presenting its seniority proposal
to the Airline was to benefit East Pilots at the expense
of West Pilots, rather than to benefit the bargaining union as
a whole.”

Thus, “the terms of USAPA’s seniority proposal are
substantially less favorable to West Pilots than the Nicolau
Award” made through binding arbitration, an award that
“USAPA concedes that it will never bargain for.” It has been
nearly five years since the two airlines merged, and the pilots
are further from, not closer to, a CBA that reflects the interests
of both pilot groups.

Although a CBA would supply tangible
evidence of a violation of the DFR, in this case, there
is sufficient evidence to consider the West Pilots’ complaint
without the CBA. The issues are concrete and were well
ADDINGTON v. US AIRLINE PILOTS ASSOC. 8015
Case: 09-16564 06/04/2010 Page: 18 of 26 ID: 7359802 DktEntry: 46-1
developed in district court proceedings that included a jury
trial (for damages) and a bench trial (for equitable relief). I
would hold the case is ripe for decision and decide the appeal
on the merits.

Sure that's interesting....but Uhmmm...he was the sole dissenter of the majority ruling??? Kinda like our Sole dissenter in NIC which you all gleefully acknowledge was on the losing side?

So I guess this is the losing sides decision, but none the less, he is on the losing side of the argument.

 

[Freebird]

Real Answer: The company is now LEGALLY able to negotiate with USAPA any list USAPA chooses
to use in accordance with their CONSTITUTION and by-laws. Guess what....it ain't the NIC.
What are you not getting??. As long as Parker and U are not on the hook legally to anyone "harmed"
by not using NIC, then he will accept whatever list USAPA gives him. In fact he already has the USAPA list.
Section 22 is closed. Know what I mean. You still have your DFR suit 2-3 years from now when a bid
comes out that doesn't use NIC and another 1-2 years to get it heard and another 6-8 months to get a ruling.
And guess what....the next trial will not be held in PHX....bet you didn't know that did you!!.
In the mean time 600 east F/Os have moved up and 40 West guys have moved up.
This is the perfect out for Parker to move this train along.........
NOW will he put enough money on the table that the pilots will vote for.

DON'T HOLD YOUR BREATH.

VNIIMN
NPJB

Dont count on Parker accepting a DOH list.

 

[Crzipilot]

Another day under under LOA is nothing to celebrate. Enjoy your Industry Low Wages.

LOA 93 while isn't good at all, we've all found a way to live comfortably with it. I mean really, our lowest point contract in the history of this airline, and it's only a few % of your best contract????

Besides, in a few months we will hopefully have good news on winning LOA93 and have a much greater % of pay than you guys have ever seen. Parker will have the east group fairly happy, (with a few work rule changes) and be able to get a CBA voted in, and get those other airlines interested again in taking this place off his hands....

 

[Barrister]

Dont count on Parker accepting a DOH list.

Yea, I can see it now......Sorry AMR, DAL, UAL, .......I can't do a deal....gotta take care of my West boys and girls!!!!
NOT.

VNIIMN
NPJB

 

[RSVP767]

what does it take to get this rolling again???

Looks like it's rolling now, but hey, here's one that used to work:

"SUPREMELY CONFIDENT"!!!!!

 

[Crzipilot]

Dont count on Parker accepting a DOH list.

Why wouldn't he????

How much do you owe your lawyers???

How many Law firms will want to take this case a few years from now, if you don't pay your current bill????

How many millions can AWAPPA or whomever it is, raise for a new trial???

What % of your pay check do you pay usapa + legal fund = pay rate lower than current LOA 93 wages?

Time to get real...

 

[Tiger 1050]

Real Answer: The company is now LEGALLY able to negotiate with USAPA any list USAPA chooses
to use in accordance with their CONSTITUTION and by-laws. Guess what....it ain't the NIC.
What are you not getting??. As long as Parker and U are not on the hook legally to anyone "harmed"
by not using NIC, then he will accept whatever list USAPA gives him. In fact he already has the USAPA list.
Section 22 is closed. Know what I mean. You still have your DFR suit 2-3 years from now when a bid
comes out that doesn't use NIC and another 1-2 years to get it heard and another 6-8 months to get a ruling.
And guess what....the next trial will not be held in PHX....bet you didn't know that did you!!.
In the mean time 600 east F/Os have moved up and 40 West guys have moved up.
This is the perfect out for Parker to move this train along.........
NOW will he put enough money on the table that the pilots will vote for.

DON'T HOLD YOUR BREATH.

VNIIMN
NPJB

Sadly I cannot disagree with anything you said here...

 

[Freebird]

Why wouldn't he????

How much do you owe your lawyers???

How many Law firms will want to take this case a few years from now, if you don't pay your current bill????

How many millions can AWAPPA or whomever it is, raise for a new trial???

What % of your pay check do you pay usapa + legal fund = pay rate lower than current LOA 93 wages?

Time to get real...

Time to get real?

It's unfortunate that your group lacks integrity to stand by your decision to enter Binding Arbitration. Your thuggery of the system, using dishorable and dishonest practices to make yourselves whole at the expense of others, is disappointing to say the least.

Your East pilot group is not looked upon favorably by other airline pilot groups. They see you for who you are. Greedy, dishonest, integrity lacking, "bullies" (for lack of a better word) who take pride in dishonor. You have to live with yourselves. It's not over.

As your local 'scholars' would say "Dont cash your lottery ticket" Ball is in USAPAs court to get a contract. Good Luck.

 

[MUTATIS MUTANDIS]

Question, can USAPA sue for it's legal fees in this case since it got tossed? Or should they pass a SPECIAL ASSESMENT to pay off the lawsuit, that flew upwind and had no merit! MM!

 

[luvn737s]

This is the perfect out for Parker to move this train along.........

I agree. Since USAPA was not a party to the Transition Agreement, I see no reason for the company to be held to it. So open a west pilot base in PHL for A330 and 767, and eliminate the restriction on cross-metal flying and I'll bet USAPA will start that train a movin'.

ALL ABOARD!!!

 

[Crzipilot]

I agree. Since USAPA was not a party to the Transition Agreement, I see no reason for the company to be held to it. So open a west pilot base in PHL for A330 and 767, and eliminate the restriction on cross-metal flying and I'll bet USAPA will start that train a movin'.

ALL ABOARD!!!

Now your really pulling at straws, trying to pull on the heart strings of those East ALPA supporters. Come back with something more towards reality..........

 

[Freighterguynow]

NOTHING!!!!!


My guess there will never be a joint contract, I hope I get to eat my words but I think that meal will never come to be.

I agree - the pipe dream of crumbling East resolve went along with the damages.

Times a million if we win this fall.