Well This Isn't Good

[ITRADE]

Delta retreat hits airline stocks

 

[FWAAA]

Well, the good news is that when DL hits $1.50 or so late this year, there will be an opportunity to make serious $$$ on the stock if DL can pull an "AMR" by exacting large concessions without Ch 11. B)

 

[luv2fly]

Well, the good news is that when DL hits $1.50 or so late this year, there will be an opportunity to make serious $$$ on the stock if DL can pull an "AMR" by exacting large concessions without Ch 11. B)

Who other than the pilots will Delta "exact large concessions" from?

 

[Fly]

Without a union??? Whomever they choose!

 

[flyhigh]

...nobody, as that's the only group we need to do as the rest of us already have and give a little back.

Unfortunately, right now, high fuel prices are really hurting the industry. Delta, is taking a double whammy with costs that are simply out of line. Not only do pilot costs have to change, but the company has got to become more frugal. Hopefully Jerry asks some of the remaining VP's to pick up the slack of some of those who have departed...

 

[Fly]

No disrespect FlyHigh. But without a union, Delta can (and probably WILL) impose more paycuts on everyone's backs.

 

[luv2fly]

...nobody, as that's the only group we need to do as the rest of us already have and give a little back.

Unfortunately, right now, high fuel prices are really hurting the industry. Delta, is taking a double whammy with costs that are simply out of line. Not only do pilot costs have to change, but the company has got to become more frugal. Hopefully Jerry asks some of the remaining VP's to pick up the slack of some of those who have departed...

You are kidding yourself. The moment the pilots take the cut, every other employee group will be hit as well. What position are you in Flyhigh? Just curious what kind of pay cut you took. I know the flight attendants have had some work rule changes, but am unfamiliar with other work groups. Most employee groups have suffered numerous layoffs. The pilots have experienced an approximate 25% reduction in head count. If we are going to scrutinize pilot pay, lets examine others as well.
Speaking of VP's, that SERP program sure is working well isn't it???
Worked really well for Mullin and Reid. By Jerry's own admission it shouldn't have happened, and yet he is largely responsible for it's implementation.

 

[DalMD88]

Did I take a paycut? I think so. My medical cost went through the roof, my sick time was gutted and I have about half the pension to look forward to. I expect the changes are not over yet. Go AMFA.

 

[luv2fly]

Did I take a paycut? I think so. My medical cost went through the roof, my sick time was gutted and I have about half the pension to look forward to. I expect the changes are not over yet. Go AMFA.

Hey Dal,

How exactly was the pension benefit reduced?

 

[DalMD88]

Pension used to be a defined benefit plan. Employees received 60% of their Final Average Earnings based on three best years of I beleive the last five. Based on current top out for a mechanic that is about $ 3600 a month. Deduct your Medical and half of Social Security and it is still a good deal. New plan is cash balance. Due to my age I get 6% put in this "account" yearly. The money isn't really there it's just a promise. Delta gives me a return on this account based on a Gov't rate, can't remember which one, but right now it's a whopping 5%. If I retire in 25 years I would have 32 years and be old enough to get the full amount under the old plan. I'll have about $900,000 in the plan using todays top out rate and keeping the rate of return the same. Sounds like a good chunk of change. Now let's start taking money out of that chunk to live on. I'm going on memory here but i think I run out of money after about seven years if I take it out at the same rate of $3600 per month.

I do also have a 401k, so the company response is just put more money in the 401k every month to make up for the loss. That money has to come out of my take home pay. Sounds like and feels like a pay cut to me.

Want the numbers on the medical? Was 96.50 a month now it's 103.40 a month. Bear in mind my wife is no longer covered at Delta. I think the cost for both of us was about $250 a month. Her plan at her job costs $80. I didn't pay attention to the family plans so I don't know how much theirs went up.

My 401 isn't doing as good as I like either. Seems the money Delta has been matching is evaporating every time I look at the account. It is in Delta stock.

 

[flyhigh]

I also took the same cuts DAL took. As for comparing pay...please do. That's the whole problem. Delta's pay to employees is comparable to the rest of the industry in all areas except one. Again, that's the problem. Do I expect to take a pay cut...not att this time. But, should the pilots take this further, I do expect to see the company need to hit my paycheck more than they already have.

 

[luv2fly]

I also took the same cuts DAL took. As for comparing pay...please do. That's the whole problem. Delta's pay to employees is comparable to the rest of the industry in all areas except one. Again, that's the problem. Do I expect to take a pay cut...not att this time. But, should the pilots take this further, I do expect to see the company need to hit my paycheck more than they already have.

flyhigh,

I'll be the first to amit that the pilots should take a pay cut, but I believe the 30% plus benefit reductions are excessive. Healthcare increases in the UHC medical program have already been passed along to the pilots. Pilots pay the same premiums as other employee groups. The pilots do have a medical plan with no premium payments and it is a standard 70%-30% plan with increased deductibles. ALPA has agreed to discuss pilot premiums for this plan.
We now fly roughly the same number of RPM's that we were flying prior to 9-11, and we are doing it with 2500 less pilots.

 

[LiveInAHotel]

No disrespect FlyHigh. But without a union, Delta can (and probably WILL) impose more paycuts on everyone's backs.

Fly,

They will never learn. The brainwashing has done to much damage! 😉

 

[flyhigh]

luv-

why is it excessive. Delta is going to loose $400MM in the 1st quarter alone. There is one cost that is out of line with the rest of the entire industry, and it alone can bring this company to at least break even. What makes the 30% excesive besides not liking it personally. From a true business perspective, what is excessive about it?

 

[luv2fly]

luv-

why is it excessive. Delta is going to loose $400MM in the 1st quarter alone. There is one cost that is out of line with the rest of the entire industry, and it alone can bring this company to at least break even. What makes the 30% excesive besides not liking it personally. From a true business perspective, what is excessive about it?

Because fly,

I believe that the economic and finacial analysis done by DALPA has demonstrated that these requests are excessive. As much as Wall St. analysts would like you to believe it, pilot costs will not make Delta profitable again. I don't know who told you that those reductions could make Delta break even. That is a misnomer. By Delta' own admission, the last quarterly loss would still have been around 200 million, and that was based on cost mirroring AA's pilot contract which are now among the major industry's lowest paid pilots.
"There is one cost that is out of line with the rest of the entire industry"
Really?? What about our SERP program? Is it typical now for industry executives to remain at an airline for say five years, and then leave with a 16 million dollar compensation package with 20+ years seniority? Even if you think it is typical, is it excessive and warranted? I think that qualifies as excessive, but I am being asked to "foot the bill" by the very person that approved these ridiculous incentive programs. Not going to happen.