Why not farm out some pilot jobs to save money?

Steiner

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Aug 21, 2002
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The airlines are already farming out mechanic''s work to varying degrees, why not get this concession from the pilots? How many times have the pilots told maintenance that maintenance needs to chip in, be a team player. Let the pilots get a taste of our give-backs.
As an aside, I remember when KLM moved a lot of their administrative functions to India to save costs. Can this happen with a US company?
 

gatemech

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Aug 24, 2002
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Steiner,

As much as I would like to see another group see what is happening to maintenance I think the farm out of flying would cost more than it's worth. Although a good portion of the OSV work needs to be reworked. Oh what the h*ll. Lets try farming out flying. UA likes wasting money.

Personally I think they should farm out the supervisor's jobs. Since all the a**holes in the world are already at UA maybe we could get some decent people.
 
OP
S

Steiner

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On 9/4/2002 6:10:34 PM

Great. Lets farm out the whole airline industry. Will that make you happy? [:devil:]
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Did you make any noise when OUR jobs were farmed out?
The pilots could help us keep work in-house, but they have been quiet also, just ferrying the planes back and forth.

Tell you what, how about a compromise. Just farm out the international flights. That way everyone can get on a Southwest competitive wage scale.
 

Skyhungry

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Aug 20, 2002
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[P]Steiner,[/P]
[P]First, I have a high respect for maintainers. I have an A&P and know the hard work and dedication needed to become a technician. I also recognize that it takes all types of employee groups to run an airline safely. To to your question, the answer is NO. You see my responsibility it to safeguard my profession. I'm busy fighting management who is trying to belittle my profession. I'm busy trying to eduacate the public which does not understand the hard work, dedication and sacrifice it takes to reach this level of expertise. Finally I have to battle our government and try to keep them from destroying the RLA (which affects everyone). I have and will support all of the other groups it takes to operate an airline, however I will not fight your battles for you. That is your job. In fact I can ask you the same question. I will not since it is not your battle. I will ask this - Do you think that by trying to wish another group the same plight you are plagued with that it will help you with your problems. I think that is selfish I think a better solution would be to try to educate others to understand your problems. I know the latter would garnish you some sympathy and maybe support. Good luck. [/P]
 

BeenThere

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Aug 26, 2002
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What seperates the pilots from the rest of us union workers is their UNION. plain and simple. Their union continually fights for their profession. We at AA have the TWU representing us in maintenance. Does the pilot have a responsible position? Yes. Does the Aircraft Mechanic have a responsibile postion? Yes. The big difference is the pilots only have pilots in their union! PLAIN AND SIMPLE. They all have the same interests to preserve and protect. We, on the other hand, have a multitude of crafts to protect and preserve. Trouble is, the mechanics are somewhat of a minority when it comes to their own issues.
 

Buck

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Aug 20, 2002
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[blockquote]
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On 9/9/2002 10:31:57 AM BeenThere wrote:

What seperates the pilots from the rest of us union workers is their UNION. plain and simple. Their union continually fights for their profession. We at AA have the TWU representing us in maintenance. Does the pilot have a responsible position? Yes. Does the Aircraft Mechanic have a responsibile postion? Yes. The big difference is the pilots only have pilots in their union! PLAIN AND SIMPLE. They all have the same interests to preserve and protect. We, on the other hand, have a multitude of crafts to protect and preserve. Trouble is, the mechanics are somewhat of a minority when it comes to their own issues.
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[/blockquote]

You are correct to a point. Where I disagree, is that as a mechanic and an AMFA associate member, I am not here to preserve TWU anything. I advocate the concept of a mechanics union, yes similar to the pilots. If fleet service etc... would care to have the TWU/AFL-CIO represent them fine.
 

lstwhknight

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Oct 25, 2002
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I work for continental.They tried farming out engines,c checks etc.The result was in the begining lower prices and fast turn around times.TILL they shut down the company engine shop,THEN the costs soared and turn times soared also.Causing many aircraft to be grounded.
When our old management figured they had made a huge mistake it was to late.Our mechanics did better work and the turn time was one of the fastest around,also after all those years of doing it in house our engines where the best around.All that was lost for the promise of lower costs with a vendor.High pressure reg valves for CF6 used to be removed almost daily and returned to the vendor for failure.The vendor would put in another oring and charge 1 thousand for the repair again.Being an overhaul cost much more.The bean counters thought 1 thousand was a great deal over 5 thousand.The kicker being in house at 5 k for a complete overhaul stayed on the wing for 4 years trouble free,and the vendor repair lasted a week.Bean counters missed that part.This kind of thinking drove continental into the ground.To many different kinds of aircraft,with various cabin schemes,various type engines for the same aircraft,Huge part storehouses,taxes on all thoses different parts.It was a fast downward dive year after year.Paycuts etc.Management changed weekly it seemd,most taking thier golden Parachute and all the money they could and hauling a**.(end of page 1)(start of page 2 ).......Page 2
Finally someone got smart,dumped all the old aircraft.Bought new aircraft and all the same types.Quit farming out what we could do in house.
Farming out has it place,but they dont have the loyality of the mechanics who wear the logo of the airline.Therefore the quality is far less then what you get from the airline mechanic who will be there long after the vendor is gone.
I have been with continental for 19 years.my dad was with them for 32,who do you think will give continental 150% the vendor or the person who lives breathes airline and has skydrol in thier veins?My bet is with the airline mechainic,he/she will always give you thier best day after day year after year.
On another note....I would like to say Thanks to the captins and frist officers who joined us in our picket lines in LAX.That means alot to all of us.
My 2 cents worth,
Terry A&P LAX
 

aapitbull

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Oct 4, 2002
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lstwhknight

You are so right at AA they took receiveing and dispatch away from the mechanics years ago and turned it over to fleet service to save money. Now about a year ago they started what they call gate maning this is where a mechanic meets every flight on the jet bridge, because they finally discovered having a mechanic there when ship arrives means alot less delays imagine that.

Now we got both the mechanic and the fleet service guy who replaced him doing the job that was once the mechanics job.

When the idiot light comes on call a mechanic cause you d@m sure can't fix it!!!
9.gif']
 
OP
S

Steiner

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Aug 21, 2002
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[blockquote]
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On 10/26/2002 10:51:47 PM aapitbull wrote:

lstwhknight

You are so right at AA they took receiveing and dispatch away from the mechanics years ago and turned it over to fleet service to save money. Now about a year ago they started what they call gate maning this is where a mechanic meets every flight on the jet bridge, because they finally discovered having a mechanic there when ship arrives means alot less delays imagine that.

Now we got both the mechanic and the fleet service guy who replaced him doing the job that was once the mechanics job.

"When the idiot light comes on call a mechanic cause you d@m sure can't fix it"!!! [img src='http://www.usaviation.com/idealbb/images/smilies/2.gif'] [img src='http://www.usaviation.com/idealbb/images/smilies/9.gif']
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[/blockquote]

That's too rich! The irony of it.
 

lstwhknight

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Oct 25, 2002
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[blockquote]
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On 10/27/2002 9:56:11 AM Steiner wrote:

[blockquote]
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On 10/26/2002 10:51:47 PM aapitbull wrote:

lstwhknight

You are so right at AA they took receiveing and dispatch away from the mechanics years ago and turned it over to fleet service to save money. Now about a year ago they started what they call gate maning this is where a mechanic meets every flight on the jet bridge, because they finally discovered having a mechanic there when ship arrives means alot less delays imagine that.

Now we got both the mechanic and the fleet service guy who replaced him doing the job that was once the mechanics job.

"When the idiot light comes on call a mechanic cause you d@m sure can't fix it"!!! [img src='http://www.usaviation.com/idealbb/images/smilies/2.gif'] [img src='http://www.usaviation.com/idealbb/images/smilies/9.gif']
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[/blockquote]

That's too rich! The irony of it.
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kind of like when they went to a two man cabin in the new aircraft to eliminate the flight engineer,end result being....carrying an extra captain and frist officer.makes ya wander ???lol.[img src='http://www.usaviation.com/idealbb/images/smilies/14.gif']
 

Winglet

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Aug 20, 2002
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The mechanic contracts should prohibit outsourcing of their jobs, just like the pilots. If your jobs can be outsourced at will, you might as well not have a union.