Will we ever have job security...and at what price?

UAL777flyer

Veteran
Aug 20, 2002
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In case you haven't figured it out yet, there is no job security in this industry, with the exception of maybe Southwest. It's sad, but it's a fact. I can't think of a more volatile industry than the airline business. Maybe with fewer carriers there would be more stability. That's why it's nearly impossible to find a 30-year veteran of this industry who hasn't gone through bankruptcies, furloughs, paycuts, etc., at one or more times in their careers.
 

Res

Senior
Aug 20, 2002
361
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www.usaviation.com
Can't help but wonder even after CWA TA, if voted in...they're still gonna close a res center or centers...no bumping, no matter how many years, and ato employees the Mid-Atlantic Airlines is coming unless in a hub city...$13.01 an hr TOS the options are slim....find all this info depressing...where's my prozac...and our options are few..I will vote yes..only because I think a no vote would have even more devasting consequences..for those who remain.
 

Res

Senior
Aug 20, 2002
361
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We were told if res center closes..there will have to be an opening to permit a transfer ...even res to res...Openings will be slim to none ...so were SOL if res location is closed...the company might offer to be tech support for USairways.com at 13.01 tos hr...
 

usresman

Member
Aug 19, 2002
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www.usaviation.com
[blockquote]
----------------
On 9/10/2002 2:21:55 PM Res wrote:

Can't help but wonder even after CWA TA, if voted in...they're still gonna close a res center or centers...no bumping, no matter how many years, and ato employees the Mid-Atlantic Airlines is coming unless in a hub city...$13.01 an hr TOS the options are slim....find all this info depressing...where's my prozac...and our options are few..I will vote yes..only because I think a no vote would have even more devasting consequences..for those who remain.
----------------
[/blockquote]
The rules for system displacement have not changed, you could bump res to res only.
 

Seatacus

Veteran
Aug 19, 2002
3,030
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Puget Sound
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[blockquote]
----------------
On 9/10/2002 3:36:06 PM UAL777flyer wrote:

In case you haven't figured it out yet, there is no job security in this industry, with the exception of maybe Southwest. ----------------
[/blockquote]

In case you haven't noticed but Southwest is the Pacif Southwest Airlines of twenty years ago. Their turn is coming.
 

mga707

Veteran
Aug 19, 2002
1,330
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[blockquote]
----------------
On 9/10/2002 11:20:46 PM Seatacus wrote:

In case you haven't noticed but Southwest is the Pacif Southwest Airlines of twenty years ago. Their turn is coming.
----------------
[/blockquote]

Hmmm...not really a good analogy. In the early '80s PSA was struggling financially, had just gone through a long pilot strike, had just introduced a second major fleet type (MD-80), and had a third on order (BAe-146), and was (unsuccessfully) trying to swallow the remnants of a much larger, failed carrier (Braniff).
Not to mention the still-painful aftereffects of a highly-publicized crash.
Not the best of times for PSA...
 

MCORORES

Senior
Aug 19, 2002
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usresman...if U closes one office...it would not be a system displacement. A system displacement is what we went thru after 9/11. BTW IMO the office that closes would not be actually closed...it would become the dot com office.
 
OP
U

UAL777flyer

Veteran
Aug 20, 2002
730
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It's amazing, but people have been saying that about Southwest since, oh, about 1971! Funny how it hasn't happened yet. I will never underestimate their ability to prove everyone wrong. They're just an island unto themselves.
 

usresman

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Aug 19, 2002
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[P][blockquote][BR]----------------[BR]On 9/11/2002 12:37:05 AM MCORORES wrote: [/P]
[P]usresman...if U closes one office...it would not be a system displacement. A system displacement is what we went thru after 9/11. BTW IMO the office that closes would not be actually closed...it would become the dot com office. [BR]----------------[BR][/blockquote][BR]1[BR]2[BR]3[BR]4[BR]5[BR]6[BR]7[BR]8[BR]9[BR]10[BR]11[B
]12[BR]13[BR]14[BR]15[BR]16[BR]3. Full-Time Employees[BR]a. When a local reduction requires a realignment of the existing full-time[BR]workforce between duty assignments, affected employees will be[BR]permitted to bid, in seniority order, available full-time vacancies within[BR]the classification and location.[BR]b. If there are insufficient full-time vacancies within the location, affected[BR]employees will be permitted to displace, in seniority order, the most[BR]junior full-time employee(s) in the classification and location.[BR]c. Full-time employees who have completed their probationary period, but[BR]do not have sufficient seniority to hold a full-time position in the[BR]classification and location, will be covered by:[BR](1) the SSystem Displacement Rules, or[BR]21[BR]22[BR]23[BR]24[BR]25[BR]26[BR]27[BR]28[BR]29[BR]30[BR]31[B
]32[BR]33[BR]34[BR]35[BR]36[BR]37[BR]38[BR]39[BR]40[BR]C. SYSTEM DISPLACEMENTS:[BR]1. As part of the System Displacement process, the Company will offer[BR]Voluntary Furlough requests as provided for in the Voluntary Furlough[BR]Article of this agreement.[BR]2. Full-Time Employees: After the Location Workforce Realignment has been[BR]completed as outlined in Paragraph B of this Article, the displaced full-time[BR]employees who have completed their probationary periods will:[BR]a. be permitted to bid, in seniority order, available full-time or part-time[BR]positions within the classification, including required vacancies that[BR]would be made available by employees who are awarded voluntary[BR]furlough, and including positions held by employees who have not[BR]completed their probation periods; or[BR]b. be permitted, if there are insufficient full-time positions within the[BR]classification, to displace, in seniority order, the most junior full-time[BR]employees in the classification on the system; or[BR]c. accept furlough.[/P]
[P]*****[/P]
[P]The new LOA's will not change the part of our CBA. So if your facility shuts down, or is turned into us airways.com you will have rights for system displacement. Its is vrey clear on the language about classification, more information about your classification can be found in your CBA from 1999.[/P]
[P][A href=http://www.cwa.net/CWAnu.pdf]http://www.cwa.net/CWAnu.pdf[/A][/P]
 

nutzo

Newbie
Aug 20, 2002
10
0
[blockquote]
----------------
On 9/10/2002 11:20:46 PM Seatacus wrote:

[blockquote]
----------------
On 9/10/2002 3:36:06 PM UAL777flyer wrote:

In case you haven't figured it out yet, there is no job security in this industry, with the exception of maybe Southwest. ----------------
[/blockquote]

In case you haven't noticed but Southwest is the Pacif Southwest Airlines of twenty years ago. Their turn is coming.
----------------
[/blockquote]
This is a terrible analogy. PSA had their own problems, then the kiss of death...being bought by U. Ask Piedmont about the kiss of death. The possibility is very remote that U could ever buy WN, ha,ha. Not just U either since WNs total value is higher than ALL THE MAJORS COMBINED! Again a terrible analogy. [img src='http://www.usaviation.com/idealbb/images/smilies/10.gif']
 

usresman

Member
Aug 19, 2002
59
0
www.usaviation.com
[P]
[BLOCKQUOTE][BR] [/BLOCKQUOTE]
[DIV][FONT face=System]USAir (aka Allegheny) was not the kiss of death for neither PSA or Piedmont. If anyone benefited from that deal it was the employees being brought from sub-industry pay rates and benefits up to the USAir standards..[/FONT][/DIV]
 

kkcwd

Newbie
Sep 5, 2002
6
0
I was at both PSA and Piedmont during integration and know for a fact that in RES more than half their employees pay doubled overnight.
 

Res

Senior
Aug 20, 2002
361
1
www.usaviation.com
USResman..we were told there is a difference between closing of an office and system displacement...Guess that's the real question are both situations treated the same? Note it states available fulltime vacancies, will be filled...do you honestly think the company will offer openings..other than to the .com res being formed?

Maybe there is something I'm missing...if my location closed...I would would either be offered a dot com position or furlough...Can't bump into another office location unless they have avail openings....would be on the list if something opens although can't forsee that happening unless it's a dot .com postion. If an office closure happens..our options are very grim..this is reality.
 

OldGuyinPA

Veteran
Aug 20, 2002
700
8
www.usaviation.com
Whoa there USRESMAN........

In 1983, almost 20 years ago...

I made $15.25/hr. That's $31,720 per year.

My house payment was $399.00 per month.
My property taxes were $565.00.
I had true Seniority in bumping due to layoffs.
I had unlimited COLA's built into contract. Inflation proof.
Medical was 100%
I loved my job and loved where I was living.

So please in your infinite wisdom tell me how I'm better off now than I was in 1983 ???
 

countrygirl

Newbie
Sep 6, 2002
6
0
I don't know what happened to my sentence, but I was trying to say that future transfer was on an available opening basis only.
 

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