A contract for US FAs must be completed prior to any new merger deal.

[missthe727]

Hey, guess what NO voters, your shortsighted thinking may come back to haunt you when your new and improved TA comes back up for a vote.

Wouldn't it be ironic if you lose more than just lost wages in a merger ?

Should have paid more attention when it counted.

This will be your fault and you will own it.

Did you see that coming ggby?

The problem this time was the social media sites contained so much misinformation and people didn't go to roadshows and read anything other than the crap on their sites and that's how they voted. In my opinion, turning down this T/A was a grave mistake and it will bite US F/As in the arse....

 

[DCAJet]

Already bit in the rear. AFA = weak leadership from the top down and members let them get away with it. international = joke.
4 airlines are leaving afa and the continental flight attendants just negotiated another contract that blows away the afa joke of a contract at united. can't wait to join apfa = a real union.

 

[PITbull]

The problem this time was the social media sites contained so much misinformation and people didn't go to roadshows and read anything other than the crap on their sites and that's how they voted. In my opinion, turning down this T/A was a grave mistake and it will bite US F/As in the arse....

Grave mistake??? How is giving up scope and the "me too" with the pilots going to help the f/as in a merged AA scenerio???

Are you guys even thinking of the scenerios here, or do you just have a death wish?

 

[PITbull]

I suggest you update your own comprehension of recent history--AA, APFA, and NMB.

1. Only a small number of the former TW f/as are still on furlough. The rest have been recalled and are assigned and working in every domestic base.
2. Don't bet that you can not be "parked" by the NMB forever. The APFA has requested release from mediation at least 3 times since the NMB got involved with the "negotiations"--though that word suggests something other than the company just presenting their first offer over and over again without modification. The NMB has refused to release us to self-help every time. And, there appears to be no avenue of appeal in Federal law. Evidently, no court can "force" the NMB to do anything.

However, stapled to the bottom of the seniority list by none other than your AAPA brethren. Your focus should be on putting a monkey wrench in that merger. NO corporation in history by passes the acquiree managment and goes diectly to the workforce for support.

Thank GOD you guys voted down the TA. Your scope and "me too" are intact and USAirways can't go back into BK to dump that language to open the door wide open to an AA merger...leaving you guys in the dust. The failure of the TA alone is enough to make an AA merger headache go away. Judge an creditors will look at the huge mess and difficulty of merging these work force and the possibility of long court battles for years and years and years.

Thank God the f/as at USAirways were smart and courageous enough to vote that shitttt down despite the leadership JNC and International promotion of it.

And Good bye Mike Flores....gone from union representation business!

 

[PITbull]

This is a very well spoken response to all the usual FUD that gets spewed here. I don't think passing an inferior contract was going to be any saving grace. Whether it passed or not there is risk. I don't believe the flight attendants are blind to that fact. A 90% vote with a group that can can usually can't even get 40% says quite a bit. It was not like a possible merger was a secret. Your management has made no secret that they have a love afair with consolidation. Flight Attendants spoke very clearly they were willing to take the risk instead of excepting something just because you might be merging with someone.

Don't lose focus people! You may or may not merge with somebody.

Remember when you were merging with United. That was a done deal according to some of the same posters that are now telling you that you are all doomed! Remember you were also merging with Delta as well. They ended up keeping Delta there Northwest! Could this one go through? Yes it could, but you should not just roll over and play dead now. Focus on the here and now! Right now you are trying to complete a merger that is still not complete after more than seven years. Focus on that while keeping in mind the possibility of another merger.

You have a long road ahead but please don't listen to those that say you "srewed" yourself.

Well said and SPOT ON!!!

 

[flybynite]

Grave mistake??? How is giving up scope and the "me too" with the pilots going to help the f/as in a merged AA scenerio???

Are you guys even thinking of the scenerios here, or do you just have a death wish?

Just to be clear...the TA didn't give up Scope but in fact enhanced it. The "me too" was enhanced to go beyond that and there was "me only" as in the change in pilot rest requirments. With the change in the pilots rest requirement as per the FAA...we were able to get better terms. If we stay with them....we will be subject to the new rules....which are not in our favor.

 

[flybynite]

However, stapled to the bottom of the seniority list by none other than your AAPA brethren. Your focus should be on putting a monkey wrench in that merger. NO corporation in history by passes the acquiree managment and goes diectly to the workforce for support.

Thank GOD you guys voted down the TA. Your scope and "me too" are intact and USAirways can't go back into BK to dump that language to open the door wide open to an AA merger...leaving you guys in the dust. The failure of the TA alone is enough to make an AA merger headache go away. Judge an creditors will look at the huge mess and difficulty of merging these work force and the possibility of long court battles for years and years and years.

Thank God the f/as at USAirways were smart and courageous enough to vote that shitttt down despite the leadership JNC and International promotion of it.

And Good bye Mike Flores....gone from union representation business!

I have never heard of a company leap-frogging the Union on the property and signing agreements with another union. I question the ethics as well as it's legality.

APFA has a bad history of stapling other f/a's but that can't happen anymore....thank god. The Macaskill-Bond Amendment prevents that.

 

[flybynite]

Now going forward....the union has sent out surveys to find out how and what needs to be tweaked in this TA to make it pass. The survey is done....and fewer than 30% responded. That's not even a mandate.

So for those that raised so much hell over this TA....and yet failed to verbalize your discontent in the survey.....I don't want to hear not one word.....no belly aching....not nothing.

 

[Be Careful What You Wish For.]

Supposedly, on the 19th a revised TA will come out.

 

[PITbull]

Well, whatever is in this upcoming T/A, there better be MAJOR protections for the f/as on the property, specifically scope enhacements and change of control language. Now that the news is out, and a pursuit is in progess, if it is for real. (I still have my doubts).

There is no point in getting increases in wages, and some work rule benefits, if in a merged situation, you are the one who gets chopped.

 

[BungeeJumper]

Supposedly, on the 19th a revised TA will come out.

The NMB has scheduled June 18-22 as the next dates for AFA and US to meet.
(http://ourafa.org/featured-articles/negotiations-dates-confirmed-our-contract-first/).
It would be great if a revised TA came out quickly, but it's highly unlikely that the AFA presentation to the company on the 18th will be accepted without revision.

 

[737823]

APFA has a bad history of stapling other f/a's but that can't happen anymore....thank god. The Macaskill-Bond Amendment prevents that.

You meant to say IAM, not APFA. I've talked to AA FAs, its not the APFA's fault its IAMs. Ex-TWA FAs are the ones who are bitter toward APFA.

Josh

 

[700UW]

Once again you spread misinformation, How may times do I have to post the truth?

AA wouldnt have bought TWA unless every union on the property gave up their LPPs while in bankruptcy.

The IAM spend over $2 million on the seniority issue and arbitration for the FAs at TW when they werent even IAM members anymore.

All the unions went to arbitration, do I have to explain to what that is and how it works?

An INDEPENDENT Arbitrator ruled on the case and set the parameters for the Pilots, Flight Attendants, Mechanic and Related, Fleet and Customer Service.

None of TWs former unions were responsible for what happened.

One of the IAM reps who was influential in my training was William O'Driscoll, the PDGC of District Lodge 142, he explained all to us, and once again you have no idea of what you are talking about.

 

[Onestep2flt]

Just to be clear...the TA didn't give up Scope but in fact enhanced it. The "me too" was enhanced to go beyond that and there was "me only" as in the change in pilot rest requirments. With the change in the pilots rest requirement as per the FAA...we were able to get better terms. If we stay with them....we will be subject to the new rules....which are not in our favor.

Not trying to argue, but can you site specific enhancements and how it is different from what is there now? Also, please discuss one point at a time. For instance the "me too" language is part of hours of service and is another subject from scope. I am not trying to insight argument here but truly trying to understand those that believe there are that many enhancements that would convince those that voted no to do otherwise.

I believe this would be a much better approach than something like those that would resort to name calling and conspiracy theories. I think the only way to convince anyone one way or the other is to look at the actual language and discuss.

 

[Maark767]

Once again you spread misinformation, How may times do I have to post the truth?

AA wouldnt have bought TWA unless every union on the property gave up their LPPs while in bankruptcy.

The IAM spend over $2 million on the seniority issue and arbitration for the FAs at TW when they werent even IAM members anymore.

All the unions went to arbitration, do I have to explain to what that is and how it works?

An INDEPENDENT Arbitrator ruled on the case and set the parameters for the Pilots, Flight Attendants, Mechanic and Related, Fleet and Customer Service.

None of TWs former unions were responsible for what happened.

One of the IAM reps who was influential in my training was William O'Driscoll, the PDGC of District Lodge 142, he explained all to us, and once again you have no idea of what you are talking about.

AA made the IAM waive their seniority clause in the F/A contract. If the IAM refused to sign the waiver, AA was going to walk away from the deal. So the IAM did have a part in the whole mess.