A letrer from USAPA's Law Firm (EAST THREAD 8/17-24)

[AAA73Pilot]

I get a good laugh from the Usapa guys.

Let me know how that works out for you. Pretty much like Usapa will.

Cheers

Send in your card and let the show begin. Why wait? The campaign will be an awesome show for us all.


Later Prater

 

[nostradamus]

So the MDA pilots were scabs to the extent that they knowingly flew aircraft that should have been crewed in seniority order? Isn't that grounds for expulsion from ALPA?

Not quite sir, scabbing in the ALPA organization is encouraged by monetary gains by those who have done this in the past. The MDA pilots are innocent victims of poor ALPA leadership.

 

[767jetz]

I believe the only way to resolve the seniority list integration/obtain a joint contract is for the two MEC's to meet per the EC's two resolutions and negotiate a "realistic solution" per the Rice Committee. If either party does not try to find a solution then this bitter war will continue, it will only get worse, and USAPA will replace ALPA.

This will never get resolved if there is not a negotiation and compromise.

Regards,

USA320pilot

Lots of double talk here. USA320pilot's spin is in overdrive today. One minute he claims the only solution is to negotiate, then the next minute somewhere else he posts that the only solution is for ALPA to vacate the award, then that he and his fellow ALPA members (very funny actually) will start picketing in order to achieve pay parity, then he posts that decertification and imposing their will on the West is the only true path to righteousness.


Mr. **, MOD NOTE: Do not identify members real names.


You and your like are desperately playing every angle you can, and it only serves to demonstrate your desperate situation and divert attention to the fact that you are the ones violating the process all along. You are deceiving no one.

And by the way... "realistic solutions" do not include reordering the list or capitulating to your extortion. Realistic solutions include accepting the arbitrated award that YOU agreed to, no... INSISTED on, and then negotiating all the pay and benefit increases you deserve as well as other protections. As with any negotiation, that would involve compromise with and respect for your peers on the other side of the table instead of trying to run them over like a freight train. This is a concept seemingly lost on you and your MEC. Because of that, you lose in the end. Just look at the failure of that tactic to date.

 

[Callsign_Cactus]

Ah yes, the truth does lie between the lines. You see, the very sticky points you mention (your retirement, CIC, etc.) had to be addressed by Parker. This was a business deal that Parker et al would have no part of if the "transaction" triggered a Change-In-Control (CIC), or your "retirement" stayed intact. It was a structured deal that AWA controlled to their desire. Think about it, what did Doug say about the Delta hostile bid...retirement had to go or no deal. Same deal with US, which is the reason why you will not find "proof" of any acquisition. This had to be considered a "merger" for many reasons, two of which I already mentioned.

This is the one area that stands out as bizarre with you guys. Everyone in the entire industry knew the fate of US except apparently the pilots. Or, maybe you did back in 2005, but you just won’t admit it today since you know that is part of the rationale Nicolau used for constructing the list.

Like I believe Doug and everything he says. I do believe this though. He told you guys in a PHX crew news on tape to a pointed question: Who bought who? His reply in so many words was Usairways bought us. Lakefield wasn't interested in running a company period. Doug was. So the investers infused USAirways with cash and the deal was done. Wonder why? Lots of questions to that but one envolves the PBGC. If you bought us then I would be collecting a pension albeit reduced right now.

As for my job? We will never know will we? Because you never know what the last chance giveaway by employees would have done to get us into the current economic up cycle we are in. It would have been ugly for sure and probably would have brought us below what TWA was making prior to the AA deal. But that is just my opinion and conjecture. So your claim of saving anything is moot.

Please, please, provide us with the written proof or fillings of your acquiring us so I can go back to the PBGC and file an appeal. I would really like to start collecting my reduced pension now. If not then please step down from your high horse and get over it. Actually it would have been easier if you did buy us.

And yes, I will ask if I see them.

Later Prater

 

[AAA73Pilot]

Mr. 767jetz,

I think your observations are correct.

I wonder myself why he would post such conflicting views. However, I think some of those posts were pieces of information coming from all sides. For informational purposes only. Selective posts that promote absolutely no unity whatsoever.

You wonder why the East has been divided for all these years? Reread your letter. Each item mentioned has some support and basis in fact. But not one piece individually to promote a cohesive unified group of pilots.

I know your opinion about USAPA. I am of the opposite opinion. My belief under the framework of a new union (Not an Association) has the best chance to promote unity when all pilots see the benefits of block representation. No more roll calls such as the disunifying RC4. I can see it now in the future. Another fragmented group represented by the new RC4 i.e. PHL CLT. What a great situation to look forward to. To me the benefits of participative oversight by all pilots is worth a chance. I know what I have had under ALPA for 20+ years.

And managements (past, present and future) will know the deep divide that we have and will take advantage of us once again. Unity under ALPA? IMO. IMPOSSIBLE!! Unity under USAPA.....A CHANCE. I had a chance to review the proposed voting mechanism that would be put in place under USAPA. The only reason to not participate is total apathy. HHmmm wonder what we have now? Each block representative will have fewer pilots to contact, hence personal contact could be initiated by the Rep. Not the other way around as we have now. You want your voice heard under ALPA? Yell louder!!

It's a great chance for a deeply divided pilot group to start over actively envolved in building something great. Instead of focussing on the past, why not focus on the future and a new beginning for all of us?



Addendum: Fixing an association that is broken, one that has many masters, will be impossible. But hey, if we're gone you can start the ALPA Trilateral Commission of UAL, DAL and NWA. Then your block can run the Association.

 

[luvn737s]

There are enough pilots who would be disenfranchised by USAPA, that USAPA would be constantly fighting against decertification (or worse) itself. It would be unable to muster the momentum to be effective. ALPA's got plenty of $$$ to spend on trinkets to hand out to get US back in the fold if USAPA were to be successful.

 

[BoeingBoy]

why not focus on the future and a new beginning for all of us?

A laudable goal, but with a primary stated purpose being eliminating the award, one of the first actions of USAPA will be disenfranchising about 1/3 of the US pilots. Talk about a "deeply divided pilot group"......

Jim

 

[Richard]

This one is closed. There is a new thread for the week beginning today.