Boeing IAM members say NO!

[787nightmare]

Boeing IAM 751 voted 67% NO! to reject the companies long term proposal.(completely gutting our previous extension from 2012)
The company was very aggressive on there demands as they leveraged the 777X build/wing assy against the state of WA, IAM membership, politicians.
Now.....we shall see what takes place next. Whether Boeing drives on with there threat of taking the 777X elsewhere, or come back with a counter proposal for us. The demands Boeing was making generally came from companies that are on the brink of BK(I'm very familiar w the mantra), but Boeing has posted year over year profits, record backlog of orders, stock price the highest I've seen in 5 yrs.
 
But they can't afford us.

http://www.iam751.org/

 

[Mr Red]

Good Job IAM 751 MEMBERS

 

[Flying low]

It is good that they stuck together for the most part. But, what will happen when Boeing builds the 777X somewhere else?

 

[700UW]

They might build the wings in Japan, but it would cost them hundreds of millions of dollars or more to build a factory big enough to assemble/build the 777x.
 
It will be done in SEA, just wait and see, and the CBA was filled with major concessions, 67% rejection is very high.

 

[eolesen]

Japan is just an option -- the other option Boeing is considering is to build a composites plant to do the wing domestically, which I suspect they'll want to do regardless.  
 
Boeing's got the capacity at LGB to do it, and the UAW already has learned the hard way what bluffing at the table can lead to with the Big Three.  Production on the C-17 is at end of life, which also works well on the 777X's timeline.
 
Boeing could also build new in Huntsville, or expand Charleston.  
 
http://seattletimes.com/html/businesstechnology/2022245171_boeingiamxml.html
 
http://www.flightglobal.com/news/articles/boeing-in-talks-with-iam-on-777x-wing-assembly-sites-392561/

 

[Kev3188]

Japan is just an option -- the other option Boeing is considering is to build a composites plant to do the wing domestically, which I suspect they'll want to do regardless.

Labor piece aside, is ICT not an option? I can't remember what's left there, and what's part of Spirit Aero now...

 

[eolesen]

I don't think ICT has the local labor force to support it (~650,000), and neither does HSV (~500,000).

That's why I suspect the assembly will go to to Long Beach. It's a safe move in that they already have assembly infrastructure in place, and there's no shortage of people willing to work in SoCal.

It's also a fair weather environment, which you can't say about HSV or ICT if you wanted to...

 

[700UW]

LGB might be in place but no tooling for the plane, still cost them hundreds of millions.
 
And isnt the LGB facility mostly gone all ready?

 

[Seatacus]

every IAM person I talked to thinks even a yes vote wouldn't keep 777X in the Puget Sound.  it would have been a lose/lose

 

[737823]

From a couple years back:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fnzui59p2-M

Pro-labor slant no doubt.

Josh

 

[Duke787]

I read where this one wing builder said that the tooling is here and the skill is here. (in seattle) This guy is foolish to think that he can't be replaced. Look at TUL and how all but the 737 are being outsourced, "nobody else can give world class service like TULE" until some other MRO is given the chance. 

 

[Kev3188]

An interesting Op-Ed from the NYT about all of this:
 
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/11/15/opinion/egan-under-my-thumb.html?_r=0

 

[Bob Owens]

I don't think ICT has the local labor force to support it (~650,000), and neither does HSV (~500,000).

That's why I suspect the assembly will go to to Long Beach. It's a safe move in that they already have assembly infrastructure in place, and there's no shortage of people willing to work in SoCal.

It's also a fair weather environment, which you can't say about HSV or ICT if you wanted to...

Willing is one thing, able is another. Boeing hires the same skillsets as the airlines. Skillsets that are becoming scarcer by the day. If they move the work then the Union simply needs to set up office wherever they move the work. If they give in in Seattle why would guys in SC want to join?

 

[737823]

An interesting Op-Ed from the NYT about all of this:
 
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/11/15/opinion/egan-under-my-thumb.html?_r=0

Boeing should be able to unilaterally impose whatever terms of employment they would like, subject to the law. The collective bargaining process in anti-free market and results in workers collectively being paid well above market and receiving cushy benefits packages and onerous work rules. You and/or 700 will likely reply with the predictable "people fought and died to form unions and bargain collectively" but Boeing needs to remain competitive and what they are currently offering is above market. If the workers in Seattle area aren't willing to work under the terms Boeing offered (and many would kill for similar benefits), they should and will look elsewhere. The fact that the DL 751 president cancelled his media appearance after the results came out is revealing:
 

The union's local leadership had been under apparent pressure from national leadership. Local President Tom Wroblewski was to address the media after the results were announced, but a spokesman said immediately after the announcement that he wouldn't do so.

Mr. Wroblewski did offer a written statement, saying, "It is my belief that we represent the best aerospace workforce in the world and hope that as a result of this vote Boeing won't discard our skills when looking to place the 777X."

Sounds a lot like the UAW workers that hear news their plant is closing and tout their craft and productivity...

The company has the upper hand here. After several crippling strikes it is no wonder they are looking for a less hostile business climate and a RTW state in the south is the perfect answer. No one is indispensable, they will find talent willing to work under or below these terms no problem. The union has no leverage. As their presence whittles down in Puget Sound will it have any impact on the IAM cronies, GVPs Rob Martinez, Mark Blondin and all the other DL and LL cronies that left their members out to dry?

Josh

 

[KCFlyer]

Boeing should be able to unilaterally impose whatever terms of employment they would like, subject to the law. The collective bargaining process in anti-free market and results in workers collectively being paid well above market and receiving cushy benefits packages and onerous work rules. You and/or 700 will likely reply with the predictable "people fought and died to form unions and bargain collectively" but Boeing needs to remain competitive and what they are currently offering is above market. If the workers in Seattle area aren't willing to work under the terms Boeing offered (and many would kill for similar benefits), they should and will look elsewhere. The fact that the DL 751 president cancelled his media appearance after the results came out is revealing:
 
Sounds a lot like the UAW workers that hear news their plant is closing and tout their craft and productivity...

The company has the upper hand here. After several crippling strikes it is no wonder they are looking for a less hostile business climate and a RTW state in the south is the perfect answer. No one is indispensable, they will find talent willing to work under or below these terms no problem. The union has no leverage. As their presence whittles down in Puget Sound will it have any impact on the IAM cronies, GVPs Rob Martinez, Mark Blondin and all the other DL and LL cronies that left their members out to dry?

Josh

 
They are lining up now in Alabama in anticipation of getting one of those jobs building the metal tubes that hurtle thru the air at almost the speed of sound..
 
[video]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cJe6-afGz0Q[/video]