Is SNA going away??

[DLFlyer31]

I saw rumors elsewhere that US will be ending service to SNA this fall. Can anyone confirm if this is true? I went to usairways.com and tried to book flights to SNA in the fall and the only thing that came up were UAL codeshares. I''ve seen some on this board talk about US using RJ''s to free up A319''s to open up new Western markets (like ABQ,PDX,etc), but if US is bailing on SNA what does that mean for Western expansion?

Also noticed that Air Midwest (operating as USAirways Express) filed with the DOT to terminate service at Reading, PA, Williamsport PA, Atlantic City, NJ and Groton/New London, CT. Looks like the small towns are taking some tough hits.

 

[USFlyer]

Expect to see further small towns lose service. My guess is there isn't much demand to warrant the service, so they are effectively consolidating service to/from some of the smaller towns that are within a short radius from slightly bigger feeder cities. This is also the unfortunate side effect of phasing out turboprops. And, all of these feeder cutbacks just reaffirms my belief that PIT will no longer be a hub in six months.

UPDATE - After perusing the dockets, it would seem a lot of these were EAS cities/routes that are no longer covered. Is this really the case?

 

[Art at ISP]

Terminating SNA which is one of US'' most profitable routes would be consistent with their nonexistant marketing strategy of how to lose money AND customers in one shot. Another board has this rumor coming directly from US staff at LAX and SNA.

In checking US schedules, I see that on our about September 6th US 171 is redesignated UA3005, but the times and aircraft type stay the same. If this is to be only operated as a UA flight, but by US, what''s the sense? Interestingly enough, on UA''s web site, the flight is still listed as US 171.
Go figure.

If they pull out and move the service to UA, us US1''s are hosed. I have to say I am making every effort to stay loyal to U, but Dave and B.Ben and their brain trust have honestly been doing everything in their power to make me look elsewhere--it''s a darned shame since you folks are the best in the industry.

If anyone has any additional information it would be greatly appreciated. I see we got one more DH8 buzz bomber flight at ISP (I use the term affectionately so don''t all jump on me), but how long will that last--even though the staff there told me while operating only 4 rt''s a day they were constantly oversold.

Time for another letter to Dave methinks--perhaps this time he''ll answer.

 

[USFlyer]

This is confirmed -- SNA is being dropped due to low yields (yet high loads). The route was NOT profitable.

 

[wings396]

At this rate, I would like to know just what is profitable anymore???? We lose money on a daily basis, so is it safe to assume that the entire system is a big loser???? As I have said many times, when this is a done deal we will fly PHL-CLT 10 times a day..and that will be it. We have all but given up on the Florida markets, can't make money. We can't make a profit in the small stations that were one our bread & butter. Now we can't make a profit on the long hauls either..there ain't much left fellas. Oh Yea, the Shuttle is a loser too.....

 

[wench]

Another Dog and Pony Show from Fort Fumble.

 

[USAirBoyA330]

Does anyone know when the next Pilot Bid is due out? Should be interesting...

 

[Art at ISP]

Personally, I think the low yield excuse is not very believable. I think that they want to gracefully yield this route to UA (See note above regarding US Air showing the flight as UA 3005 in September).

It's getting harder and harder to stay loyal, although I plan to do so

Good luck my friends...

 

[USA320Pilot]

SNA Ops Discontinued

ARLINGTON (theHub.com) - US Airways yesterday announced it will discontinue operations at Orange County, Calif., on Sept. 6. The current schedule includes two daily nonstop flights from Philadelphia, operated with A319 aircraft. “While load factors have been above 80 percent, our yield was low, which translated to unprofitability,â€￾ said Andrew Nocella, vice president Planning and Scheduling. “Although Orange County tends to have a higher mix of business traffic than most California airports, we were unable to capture enough higher yielding passengers.â€￾ The decision affects 24 Customer Service employees at the station. Slot constraints at the Orange County airport also would have restricted US Airways’ significant schedule growth in the market for the future.

 

[Formatman]

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On 6/17/2003 10:22:40 PM Chip Munn wrote:

SNA Ops Discontinued

ARLINGTON (theHub.com) - US Airways yesterday announced it will discontinue operations at Orange County, Calif., on Sept. 6. The current schedule includes two daily nonstop flights from Philadelphia, operated with A319 aircraft. “While load factors have been above 80 percent, our yield was low, which translated to unprofitability,” said Andrew Nocella, vice president Planning and Scheduling. “Although Orange County tends to have a higher mix of business traffic than most California airports, we were unable to capture enough higher yielding passengers.” The decision affects 24 Customer Service employees at the station. Slot constraints at the Orange County airport also would have restricted US Airways’ significant schedule growth in the market for the future.



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Someone help me out here. I must be the dumbest person on the board...but every time I see the reason for discontinuing a flight is "high load factor...but low yields" it appears to me that it is a fixable problem. Raise the fares a few bucks and then you have "high load factors...and...high yields". And don''t tell me that raising a fare a few bucks is going to drive everybody away. If you have the service at the time they need it and to the destination they need...people are gonna'' pay for it! At least try and see if it works...

 

[USFlyer]

I think one issue is that US probably needed a much higher yield at SNA versus LAX due to having only two flights, both of which were on A319s. It''s probably extremely inefficient to operate a mainline city in such a fashion.

As someone else pointed out, though, the whole bloody network is still unprofitable if you piece together all the media reports. We know PIT is apparently unprofitable. Air Midwest is pulling out of cities at an alarming rate. The Shuttle is unprofitable. Seatacus (*many* months ago) said a management type was in town that said transcons were still unprofitable. Siegel said in a speech last week DCA was unprofitable. The old mantra of using RJs to open up long, thin routes apparently hasn''t worked -- Madison, WI, Omaha, NE and Baton Route, LA all pulled; I''m sure the list goes on. *sigh*

 

[W:EXCH:INVOL]

SNA Ops Discontinued

...Slot constraints at the Orange County airport also would have restricted US Airways’ significant schedule growth in the market for the future.



Is someone actually saying that we weren''t making money, but if we were, we would have pulled out anyway because there was no room FOR GROWTH???? Significant RJ growth to where, exactly?

INVOL

 

[wings396]

Someone help me out here. I must be the dumbest person on the board...but every time I see the reason for discontinuing a flight is "high load factor...but low yields" it appears to me that it is a fixable problem. Raise the fares a few bucks and then you have "high load factors...and...high yields". And don''t tell me that raising a fare a few bucks is going to drive everybody away. If you have the service at the time they need it and to the destination they need...people are gonna'' pay for it! At least try and see if it works...

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I know what you mean with this statement. We ran full MCO flights pre 9/11, with the traditional low yeild saga. Granted the fares were low. We had suggested to the so called marketing dept. to raise the fares to the point where we could make a profit, to see what happened. We had people driving in from miles away for the Nonstop flights. If the higher fare scared them away, then pull the plug. But as usual, it was easier to do nothing and pull the plug with no other effort. I am willing to bet most would have paid a few more bucks for the flight. If we raised the fare and the people went elsewhere, you would know it wasn''t the answer. No effort here to keep our marketshare. Please don''t get me wrong, as I am not saying to raise fares is the answer everywhere. I just feel this would have fixed the MCO revenue shortfall.

 

[Art at ISP]

First of all the company announcement was wrong. There were 2 non stops from PIT to SNA, and one of them moved to PHL earlier this month. They didn''t even let the ink dry on that schedule change before cancelling the whole thing.

Either the Orange County Airport wouldn''t make some concessions or they really want to give the nonstop route to UA--either way it makes more sense than to complain about yields (when they haven''t even given PHL a chance).

I think if this continues, they will yield ALL transcons to UA, and if that happens, CO here I come.

Piney Bob----CO anytime--I would NEVER fly DL again after they gutted their program- and hi yield elites are leaving DL in droves.

 

[ClueByFour]

I thought the point of the RJs was to free up more Airbii for longer routes. SNA sure is a nice long route.

Ben and Dave are full of it. I''m wondering, between bailing on the west coast, bailing on small cities on the east coast, bailing out of an entire hub, bailing out of the DCA/LGA/BOS corridor..... where do these fools plan to fly? An RJ network from CLT-PHL?