North by Northwest
Veteran
"Tokyo, HKG, KIX, PVG, TPE SIN, PEK, ICN, BKK," JFK, you mean the Asian business cities NORTHWEST pioneered air service to?
United Eyeing Nwa Stronghold
- Thread starter C54Capt
- Start date
North by Northwest
Have you ever seen the reenactment the NWA guys did in the sim of the UA 747-400 SFO near miss? Kind of a 'here's what not to do' video they at one time showed in SVT. Thank goodness they saved that one. Of course every airline, except Quantas, has had some unfortunate mishap. Hoping we all have safe flights throughout our careers and no more landings at Air Force bases.
I will give UAL credit, they are aggressively going after the China markets. I sometimes wonder if NWA has the aircraft to fly non stop to China. The -400 seems to be being utilized big time in the NRT to US/Hawaii markets and since we've scrapped most of the 747-200s, we're a little short on widebodys that would have the range to fly those routes. As JFK777 has mentioned, the A330-200 isn't the plane for the job as it's range falls short. An option would be to fly the -400 on the China routes but I doubt the capacity has returned to levels that would handle it. Hopefully, we'll see the B7E7 on the property soon to fill a big gap in our Pacific fleet. They already have the A350 and B7E7 pay rates figured out in the TA so hopefully this will happen soon. There was no mention of a 777 in the TA so that leads me to believe that aircraft isn't being considered.
cheers
bigsky
Have you ever seen the reenactment the NWA guys did in the sim of the UA 747-400 SFO near miss? Kind of a 'here's what not to do' video they at one time showed in SVT. Thank goodness they saved that one. Of course every airline, except Quantas, has had some unfortunate mishap. Hoping we all have safe flights throughout our careers and no more landings at Air Force bases.
I will give UAL credit, they are aggressively going after the China markets. I sometimes wonder if NWA has the aircraft to fly non stop to China. The -400 seems to be being utilized big time in the NRT to US/Hawaii markets and since we've scrapped most of the 747-200s, we're a little short on widebodys that would have the range to fly those routes. As JFK777 has mentioned, the A330-200 isn't the plane for the job as it's range falls short. An option would be to fly the -400 on the China routes but I doubt the capacity has returned to levels that would handle it. Hopefully, we'll see the B7E7 on the property soon to fill a big gap in our Pacific fleet. They already have the A350 and B7E7 pay rates figured out in the TA so hopefully this will happen soon. There was no mention of a 777 in the TA so that leads me to believe that aircraft isn't being considered.
cheers
bigsky
N by NW,
Your sense of humor and reason are Cuban. IT WAS PAN AM who got their first. I'm sure in NW's version of the Pacific this was a conveniently forgotten fact. THE CHINA CLIPPER in 1936, that was 11 years before NW flew its DC-4 from MSP to Japan.
While NW has an illustriuous history in Japan and Asia I'm sorry to be the one to remind you, PAN AM did it before you guys. By the way flying to Guam and using a valuable slot at NRT when it could be used for another transpacific service is the wrong business decision. UA isn't of drinking age yet in Asia but they purchased the franchise that is your father.
Your sense of humor and reason are Cuban. IT WAS PAN AM who got their first. I'm sure in NW's version of the Pacific this was a conveniently forgotten fact. THE CHINA CLIPPER in 1936, that was 11 years before NW flew its DC-4 from MSP to Japan.
While NW has an illustriuous history in Japan and Asia I'm sorry to be the one to remind you, PAN AM did it before you guys. By the way flying to Guam and using a valuable slot at NRT when it could be used for another transpacific service is the wrong business decision. UA isn't of drinking age yet in Asia but they purchased the franchise that is your father.
North by Northwest
Veteran
IT WAS PAN AM who got their first, that's right...NOT United.JFK777 said:
And WHO pray tell....SURVIVED them ALL? Your claim mentioned United NOT Pan Am. I am VERY familiar with Pan Am's history. Don't tell us how to use a NRT slot when we have been using them since 1947, including one for China. Your point is taken in regards to non-stops. But remember....we are still here, where others have faltered. That, my dear friend is a fact. On another note. Having launched the 747-400, it is still working well for us from NYC-NRT and LAX-NRT. Having 16 of them is a good fit for long-hauls...till the 7e7's arrive.
NWA's recent domestic growth has had two goals; increasing the pressure on already-hurting carriers (e.g. Midwest Express in MKE and ATA in IND), or preventing LCCs from entering its "bread and butter" markets (e.g. FNT and GRR to Florida).
The big difference between NWA and UAL is that Northwest has taken proactive steps to thwart LCC incursions. If UAL had taken the threat Frontier posed seriously 10 years ago (instead of thumbing their noses and saying “we’re UNITED, we don’t have to worry about some cracker-a**ed outfit flying beat-up 737s"), the situation in DEN might be far different right now.
N by NW,
Just because NW has been flying there longer then most doesn't neccssarily make it better. If you want a great young airline with 744, A340's and soon A380 that flies to Japan, HKG, Shanghai as well as LAX, SFO, IAD, MIA, BOS, EWR & JFK its VIRGIN ATLANTIC. I FORGOT LHR, an airport NW can't even get a flight to, UA can by the way, it like their NRT in Europe.
What made PAN AM great, was all the hubs Tokyo, LHR & FRA( I Know it gone but that's another topic). UA had the forsight to buy LHR as did AA. As a fact NRT has only been around for 25 years, when NW & PA used Tokyo as a hub until NRT it was Haneda. NW is great in Asia, Pan Am was all over the world. I know your going to say" NW is still here" that's true.
There is no question that NW managements, over the decades, have been better then Pan AM's. Juan Trippe didn't watch the buttom line so much, may be its that mid western atitude. If I were you I would be less worried about UA then Cathay, Singapore and other natives of the Pacific.
Just because NW has been flying there longer then most doesn't neccssarily make it better. If you want a great young airline with 744, A340's and soon A380 that flies to Japan, HKG, Shanghai as well as LAX, SFO, IAD, MIA, BOS, EWR & JFK its VIRGIN ATLANTIC. I FORGOT LHR, an airport NW can't even get a flight to, UA can by the way, it like their NRT in Europe.
What made PAN AM great, was all the hubs Tokyo, LHR & FRA( I Know it gone but that's another topic). UA had the forsight to buy LHR as did AA. As a fact NRT has only been around for 25 years, when NW & PA used Tokyo as a hub until NRT it was Haneda. NW is great in Asia, Pan Am was all over the world. I know your going to say" NW is still here" that's true.
There is no question that NW managements, over the decades, have been better then Pan AM's. Juan Trippe didn't watch the buttom line so much, may be its that mid western atitude. If I were you I would be less worried about UA then Cathay, Singapore and other natives of the Pacific.
North by Northwest
Veteran
JFK...leave PAA OUT of this. It's nothing but a diversion from the topic. UAL will NEVER fill those great shoes...PERIOD! "I FORGOT LHR, an airport NW can't even get a flight to, UA can by the way, it like their NRT in Europe. " Yeah, you're right. They can fly to LHR....[/b]AND they are STILL BANKRUPT!( AMR is kicking there A%$ there too) Who the hell needs LHR when you have AMS and soon to be CDG/ FCO for European transit Hubs. "If you want a great young airline with 744, A340's and soon A380 that flies to Japan, HKG, Shanghai as well as LAX, SFO, IAD, MIA, BOS, EWR & JFK" .Places served well by NWA-----------
DTW-NRT 744
DTW-KIX 744
DTW-NGO 744
MSP-NRT 744
JFK-NRT 744
HNL-NRT 744
NRT-BKK 744
NRT-MNL 744
NRT-PVG 744
NRT-HKG 744
KIX-TPE 744
NGO-MNL 744
LAX-NRT 742
NRT-GUM 742
NRT-SPN 742
HNL-NRT D10
HNL-KIX D10
SEA-NRT 332
PDX-NRT 332
SFO-NRT 332
NRT-ICN 332
NRT-BKK 332
NRT-PEK 332
NRT-SIN 332
NRT-CAN 757
NRT-NGO 757
NRT-PUS 757
NGO-SPN 757
Basically, if you don't like NWA's operation ( as you clearly don't) don't fly us. We'll STILL be here.
DTW-NRT 744
DTW-KIX 744
DTW-NGO 744
MSP-NRT 744
JFK-NRT 744
HNL-NRT 744
NRT-BKK 744
NRT-MNL 744
NRT-PVG 744
NRT-HKG 744
KIX-TPE 744
NGO-MNL 744
LAX-NRT 742
NRT-GUM 742
NRT-SPN 742
HNL-NRT D10
HNL-KIX D10
SEA-NRT 332
PDX-NRT 332
SFO-NRT 332
NRT-ICN 332
NRT-BKK 332
NRT-PEK 332
NRT-SIN 332
NRT-CAN 757
NRT-NGO 757
NRT-PUS 757
NGO-SPN 757
Basically, if you don't like NWA's operation ( as you clearly don't) don't fly us. We'll STILL be here.
N by NW,
There are reasons LHR is the biggest airport in "International Traffic", not to be confused with Atlanta or O'Hare as the "World's Bussiet". Any US aiirline can fly to AMS tommorrow, there is Open Skies, no slot restriction, and the Dutch, frankly, welcome it( these are people who's business is business). LHR is the highest yielding airport in Europe and maybe even the world, remember the Concorde. British Airways has such HUGE profits because of all the Club & First Class traffic from LAX & SFO to South Africa to Tokyo, HKG and Australia (it doesn't hurt your home country had a recently great empire). UA may be " a bankrupt second rate airline", like it or not LHR represents something other airlines like Continental & Delta would love to fly to. Ignorance is not "bliss" here.
If AA is kicking "UA's a$%" at LHR, what is it doing to NW and UA from LAX & JFK to NRT?
There are reasons LHR is the biggest airport in "International Traffic", not to be confused with Atlanta or O'Hare as the "World's Bussiet". Any US aiirline can fly to AMS tommorrow, there is Open Skies, no slot restriction, and the Dutch, frankly, welcome it( these are people who's business is business). LHR is the highest yielding airport in Europe and maybe even the world, remember the Concorde. British Airways has such HUGE profits because of all the Club & First Class traffic from LAX & SFO to South Africa to Tokyo, HKG and Australia (it doesn't hurt your home country had a recently great empire). UA may be " a bankrupt second rate airline", like it or not LHR represents something other airlines like Continental & Delta would love to fly to. Ignorance is not "bliss" here.
If AA is kicking "UA's a$%" at LHR, what is it doing to NW and UA from LAX & JFK to NRT?
North by Northwest
Veteran
"If AA is kicking "UA's a$%" at LHR, what is it doing to NW and UA from LAX & JFK to NRT? " AA is not even on the radar in NRT. Now here we go...off on another diversion. You'll have to enjoy this one by yourself. KERRY/EDWARDS on TUES.!
North by Northwest
Veteran
N by NW,
Just because AA dosn't have beyond rights to Asia from Japan doesn't mean its not important to Japan. How many passenger does NW fly from Chicago to Japan these days? NW USED to fly from O'Hare to NRT but gave it up to the two hub airlines, UA & AA. NW feed from DFW is probably a decimal point, so N by NW get off your imperialistic high horse.
Just because AA dosn't have beyond rights to Asia from Japan doesn't mean its not important to Japan. How many passenger does NW fly from Chicago to Japan these days? NW USED to fly from O'Hare to NRT but gave it up to the two hub airlines, UA & AA. NW feed from DFW is probably a decimal point, so N by NW get off your imperialistic high horse.
North by Northwest
Veteran
AA's traffic is insignificant across the Pacific compared to NWA/UA and the Asian carriers. I'm sorry if you think I am imperial because I don't buy into your BS that NWA is something of a second rate competitor. You seem to be detached from reality. Northwest is one of the strongest US carriers standing. We are not perfect, but we KICK A$$ in what we do. So if you feel that UA/ AA/VS/ BA serve your needs....fly'em.JFK777 said:
N by NW,
I never said NW was a "second rate" airline, you said that in response to my comments. NW has a great Asia tradition equal to or a great as any other large Pacific opertator from the USA or Asia. I'm gald you fight for "your" position, but that doesn't mean other positions are bad. This is not what's good for NW is good for the USA.
New operators to Tokyo, like AA, fly smaller airplanes and cater to a different market then NW does. NW has beyond rights, new airlines don't, but you know( or should know that). I'm sorry you think AA doesn't register from LAX to NRT, I don't know how the flight is doing but the boys from AA are not shrinking violets, there TEXANS; they might with BIG atitude. Since you are knowledgeable about airplanes may be the best plane for NW is the 747 but for AA that may not be the right answer, so they fly a 777. My point is only there are more then NW's way of crossing the Pacific. NW's works for NW, but other ways aren't anti NW or Bad for NW.
I never said NW was a "second rate" airline, you said that in response to my comments. NW has a great Asia tradition equal to or a great as any other large Pacific opertator from the USA or Asia. I'm gald you fight for "your" position, but that doesn't mean other positions are bad. This is not what's good for NW is good for the USA.
New operators to Tokyo, like AA, fly smaller airplanes and cater to a different market then NW does. NW has beyond rights, new airlines don't, but you know( or should know that). I'm sorry you think AA doesn't register from LAX to NRT, I don't know how the flight is doing but the boys from AA are not shrinking violets, there TEXANS; they might with BIG atitude. Since you are knowledgeable about airplanes may be the best plane for NW is the 747 but for AA that may not be the right answer, so they fly a 777. My point is only there are more then NW's way of crossing the Pacific. NW's works for NW, but other ways aren't anti NW or Bad for NW.
Just for the record, over the years AA has also operated 747SPs and MD11s on the DFW-NRT route as well.
Blackdog
Member
Boy, the discussions in the above replys got so heated, I had to turn on the A/C! ...With the new SkyTeam alliance we'll be seeing new point2point flying for NW. Watch for DTW-ICN in the Spring/Summer, and DTW-PVG will be back also. We may even see an SEA-ICN flight as we could utitilize our new alliance with Korean. In the Atlantic we have 3 new options with CDG, FCO, and PRG. The powerhorse that is NWA will soon be soaring your way!
