United Looking At Home Stretch

[UAL_TECH]

United looking at home stretch

"The rumors of an imminent emergence this fall are just flat hooey," said Bill Brandt, president of Chicago-based restructuring firm Development Specialists Inc. "They don't have their house in order, they aren't making money, and it's becoming clear that the business model they've chosen is the wrong one."

Duh!!!

Important upcoming dates for United Airlines:

• April 30: Expiration of United's exclusive right to file a reorganization plan with the bankruptcy court. As it stands now, after April 30 other parties will be able to file their own reorganization plans, although United is seeking to extend the exclusivity period. It has requested an April 22 hearing on the matter.

• May 11: Trial date for United and its unions on pensions issues. United says it needs to eliminate its worker pension plans to emerge from bankruptcy, while the airline's unions strongly oppose such moves. If United can't come to an agreement with the unions, it will go to trial May 11.

• May 31: Temporary concessions imposed on two of United's largest unions - the Aircraft Mechanics Fraternal Association and the International Association of Machinists - expire.

• Sometime this fall: United plans to emerge from bankruptcy.

May/June will be interesting.....

Stay Tuned......

B) UT

 

[767jetz]

Just a few positive excerpts from the article to balance out the picture...

While acknowledging that it won't be easy, United and its primary creditors are confident the airline can exit bankruptcy this fall as planned.

"We're enthusiastic about the prog- ress they've made," said Bill Repko, managing director at J.P. Morgan Chase & Co., United's lead provider of bankruptcy financing. "I think the challenges are not to be underestimated, but within reasonable expectations, they are likely to be met."

This week, United further reduced expenses by announcing the closure of a 400-employee call center in Washington. The airline also decided to stop contracting with Air Wisconsin Airlines Corp. for United Express commuter flights, which also will lower costs.

What United doesn't have is a morale problem or a service problem," said Mike Boyd, an Evergreen-based aviation consultant. "They excel in those areas, and even people at other airlines would probably tell you that.

Personally I'll believe the people with the money (JP Morgan), over the analyists who are notoriously skeptical and often wrong.

 

[aafsc]

Just a few positive excerpts from the article to balance out the picture...
Personally I'll believe the people with the money (JP Morgan), over the analyists who are notoriously skeptical and often wrong.

[post="261580"][/post]​

It will be interesting to see the "morale" at UA after the temporary paycuts expire with the IAM and AMFA. More paycuts, unlimited outsourcing, and loss of pensions will, in my opinion will lead to a situation like they have at USAir. The job won't be worth having anymore.People over there are quitting, happy to get laid off, or just waiting for the buyout. Their long time experienced people are leaving in droves and their operation is having a lot of problems (just like CO after Lorenzo decimated their compensation). I think the same will happen at UA.

 

[Fly]

Don't you mean that is what you HOPE?

I think/hope that there will be many very disappointed rival carrier employees when United comes out!

 

[Bear96]

The job won't be worth having anymore.

[post="261594"][/post]​

I agree with this. Frankly, who cares if UA emerges? It is clear that they aren't done pillaging the employees. They aren't going to emerge until the carnage with pay, work rules, and benefits is finished. Once that happens, these jobs will not be worth having.

So either UA survives, but we won't want to work here because it will be so miserable. Or UA doesn't survive. Either way, the jobs we signed up for are gone. So what's the diff.

Take a cue from management: Grab what you can, and get out!

 

[aafsc]

Don't you mean that is what you HOPE?

I think/hope that there will be many very disappointed rival carrier employees when United comes out!

[post="261596"][/post]​

I don't hope for anything bad for the people at UA. I have 2 relatives that retired from there as well as MANY ex-coworkers from EAL that are still there. My point is that the between the falling compensation and all the b.s. people will leave in mass like at USAir. Look at Ronin, he got fed up, left and got another job and I'm sure there are many more like him. Even though we still have our pensions, there are many people at AA retiring, retiring early (and taking the penalty), taking the stand in stead, or as Bob Owens points out in JFK, some are just plain quitting. If AA is able to drop my compensation to USAir levels, I won't stick around, it's not worth it. But don't worry Fly, in my opinion somehow UA and US will survive in order to bring the compensation levels (much lower wages, crappy medical, crappy work fules, and no pension) to U levels. After all, that is the grand plan.

 

[kcabpilot]

All I can say is that when someone writes this:

What United doesn't have is a morale problem or a service problem," said Mike Boyd, an Evergreen-based aviation consultant. "They excel in those areas, and even people at other airlines would probably tell you that.

His credibility just went down the crapper because he's obviously talking out his ass on something he knows nothing about.

 

[NewHampshire Black Bears]

Don't you mean that is what you HOPE?

I think/hope that there will be many very disappointed rival carrier employees when United comes out!

[post="261596"][/post]​

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

"When UA comes out of WHAT" ???

I suggest you deal(first) with a JUN work stoppage by AMFA !!

NH/BB's

 

[jimntx]

All I can say is that when someone writes this:
His credibility just went down the crapper because he's obviously talking out his ass on something he knows nothing about.

[post="261616"][/post]​

Glad I wasn't the only one who noticed that particularly weird statement.

 

[herkav8r]

Black Bear,
Why don't you go to work with Ronin and let the rest of us save the company and make it a viable operation.

 

[Bear96]

Black Bear,
Why don't you go to work with Ronin and let the rest of us save the company and make it a viable operation.

[post="261680"][/post]​

If that was to me (and not the NH Bear), don't worry; I have already gone down Ronin's path.

It just strikes me as odd when all the UA employees post here about how "We;re gonna make it out of BK and UA will be a success!" First, the odds are against that; but I don't have anything against a little optimism.

Second, though, yeah maybe UA will make it out. But if it does, this will be a miserable place to work. (And all airlines are headed that way.) So what's the great deal if the company some day becomes profitable for shareholders and senior managers, but the front-line employees are working for poverty wages and pithy benefits (and no pensions)? So why is that so great? Either way, front line employees lose.

But hey, if you want to work long hours for pennies and pathetic benefits just so senior management can enjoy the fruits of their "success" and the travelling public can enjoy their constitutional right to $99 transcon fares, then be my guest.

I am just saying stop for a moment with the "My airline is better than theirs cuz we're less broke!" and take a moment to look at the big picture.

 

[herkav8r]

It was the NH Bear.

I've been furloughed for 18 months. I am tired of sitting behind a desk and talking on the phone. I am taking a paycut to get back and enjoy what I am doing. I've seen both sides of the fence and I am going to go back to aviation.

 

[Busdrvr]

Second, though, yeah maybe UA will make it out. But if it does, this will be a miserable place to work. (And all airlines are headed that way.) So what's the great deal if the company some day becomes profitable for shareholders and senior managers, but the front-line employees are working for poverty wages and pithy benefits (and no pensions)? So why is that so great? Either way, front line employees lose.

But hey, if you want to work long hours for pennies and pathetic benefits just so senior management can enjoy the fruits of their "success" and the travelling public can enjoy their constitutional right to $99 transcon fares, then be my guest.

While I'm the first to say it ain't worth it to be a NB F/O at UAL, and that I'll be bypassing to the max (I disagree, it IS greener on the other side), SWA is an example of employees making less and working significantly harder, all to profit via stock options and profit sharing. Do I think it's a viable loing term solution? Doubling rates and size makes me say No Way, however, that strategy may be sufficient to "adequately" reward the employees while we're all racing against the "Bear" to be one of the last 3 mega carriers to survive and dominate.

 

[Bear96]

... that strategy may be sufficient to "adequately" reward the employees while we're all racing against the "Bear" to be one of the last 3 mega carriers to survive and dominate.

[post="261745"][/post]​

Survive and dominate what, exactly?

If you can barely make ends meet and are exhausted all the time, who cares if your employer is "dominating" its industry.

Dominating the race to the bottom and surviving a miserable job ... no thanks.

 

[Borescope]

"Since filing for Chapter 11 bankruptcy protection in December 2002, United has wrangled about $5 billion in annual cost cuts through wage and benefit reductions and a host of operational changes, including the creation last year of a new low-cost carrier called Ted.

The moves helped United - a unit of Chicago-based UAL Corp. - shift from a $2.8 billion loss in 2003 to a $1.6 billion loss last year.

Although that marks a significant financial improvement, the airline remains a long way from profitability."



If we look at these amounts of savings, it appears that they will need at least $5 Billion more in annual cost cuts through wage and benefit reductions and a host of operational changes to just break even. BOHICA