Alpa And Pinnacle 3701 Accident

smfav8r

Advanced
Mar 20, 2003
210
2
When I get the ALPA's Air Line Pilot magazine every month; I usually do a quick look at the "In Memoriam" section, see if there are any interesting articles on safety and then chuck it in the garbage.

Did the same with the August issue, except didn't chuck it!

I am a little concerned with the report on Pinnacle's 3701 that crashed in Jefferson City.

The title stated "Poor Training, Engine Flaws May Have Led to Pinnacle 3701 Accident".

One quote was: ""Core lock" is a safety risk previously known only to engine and aircraft manufacturers untill very recently-and about which pilots knew nothing."

My thoughts on this is "Core lock" is just a new name for lack of N2 rotation.

In my career, (at various airlines) anytime a pilot attempts to relight a motor in-flight, N2 rotation is required and critical to the relight procedure. This is turbojet basics. And nothing new!!

Another quote was: "Regional airlines across the US are experiencing enormous growth and adding ever more sophisticated aircraft to their fleets. This environment means that pilots often have less time to gain firsthand experience with an aircraft before assuming command. While many regional airlines are putting safety first, others still have opportunities to improve their saftey cultures. These 'improving' carriers must provide comprehensive operational training to compensate for their lack of hands-on experience and to better prepare their pilots for the transition to jet aircraft"

WTF????? Improving carriers that might have my wife and kids on board!!!!

Safety and Experience should be number ONE PERIOD!!!!

I think we've lost sight of what's important in commercial aviation. Due to the automation and safistication of new aircraft, the hull loss rate and passenger death toll has gone down tremendously. (over the past 30 years)

But, now we have poorly trained pilots with low experience levels (getting paid awful wages I might ad) flying our families around. Can we trust these pilots getting the passengers on the ground safely when the aircraft has mechanical issues???

Another issue, that was failed to be reported, what the HELL were they doing at FL410 in a CRJ200. The aircraft was not designed to be at that altitude.

I can already hear the reactions that it is certified to FL410. This is true, but aircraft certification has less to do with the performance of the aircraft at FL410 and more to do with the pressurization and a rapid decompression. In other words, at FL410, the CRJ has a 8000ft cabin altitude at 8.6 psid and it can get down to 10000ft in a specified time. This is the true basis of the certified max alt.

The 727 is certified to FL420. Ask any three-holer driver, they will tell you it just isn't designed to be up there!!!

My question is: Is John/Jane Q Passenger aware of the safety issues at some of the regional airlines today? If so, do they care?? I sure do. Is anyone going to do something about this or will it be swept under the rug untill a major amount fatalities occur? :( :( :(
 
supercruiser,

Thanks for the link, but I already knew what happened.

My point is why are we (as pilots, ALPA and the FAA) letting commercial air transportation get to this point.

There is no excuse for inexperience and poor training in the airline industry.

Would you want your loved ones traveling on one of these "IMPROVING REGIONAL CARRIERS"?

I sure don't!

How long till a inexperienced and poorly trained pilot at an improving regional carrier has a real emergency (not self-induced) and kills the paying passengers on board.

What excuse will the public be provided with then???

We knew about it, but it was a calculated risk??

It seems that the Bent-Wing Guppy Killer has not only killed many carreers, but it may soon kill many people!
 
All:

First, ALPA is in the business of protecting its members. In 18 years of being a member, I have never seen ALPA say a derogatory word about one of its members that has been involved in an accident. The problem would then seem to be that ALPA has blinders on and would never say a disparaging word about a pilot who is a member and is involved in an accident, no matter how much at fault the member was.

In this instance, there is plenty of blame to go around. Surely the training departments at these rapidly growing regional carriers are partly to blame. I am not meaning to paint a broad brush that all regional airlines are unsafe....far from it. But it goes without saying that a carrier that hires minimally qualified applicants for poverty wages with the promise/hope of a quick upgrade, a livable wage, and the possible jackpot of a job with a major could have experience issues in the future. Especially now that the "regionals" have "major" size equipment. Not to mention that we have turboprop drivers all of a sudden flying jet equipment at high altitudes without the benefit of high altitude aerodynamic knowledge.

The pilots involved in this accident are at least 75% to blame for the tragedy. There were many instances where they violated company policies and procedures. 25% of the blame goes to their training department because these guys were obviously not tuned in to the fact that they were about to get themselves killed. They were inexperienced, and this was a factor as well, but an inexperienced pilot who has the knowledge and keeps his actions close to the company/manufacturer guidelines will live a long time.

Many years ago, the commuter I was flying for demanded 1500 hours for hire and 3000-4000 for upgrade, and this was on a turboprop. We now have jet captains with under 2000 TOTAL flying hours, and we aren't talking just the small jets but 90 seaters.

I think back to when I was "paying my dues" flying ratty airplanes in the middle of the night to unfamiliar airports single pilot IFR. I went to a few funerals and was damn lucky that others didn't have to attend mine. I threw a lot of the luck in the bag out the window those few years. Why? We were all inexperienced and "learning" as we went. The difference is we were flying airplanes with limited performance and passenger capacity. Now we have the same scenario with high performance jets with large passenger carrying capability.

It is a miracle we haven't seen more of this.

Boomer