Come celebrate the first anniversary of AA's TWA purchase.

Finally, the carrier parties invariably argue that they relied on the Board’s adherence to be standard United-Capital provisions in their merger negotiations and suggest that they would have to reconsider their agreement if any significant additional labor protective burdens were placed on the merged or surviving carrier.2 Since in most cases one of the carriers is in perilous financial condition, the Board has to take into account the possibility, whose gravity is difficult to assess, that any substantive change in a labor provisions might lead to cancellation of the merger and thence to one carrier’s bankruptcy and cessation of service. All these factors, we believe, combine to raise a serious obstacle to consideration of the objective merits and demerits of proposed changes in the standard United-Capital provisions.

The best solution in our view would be for the Board to initiate a new proceeding, in the nature of rulemaking (although an evidentiary hearing before an examiner would probably be essential), to consider for the future what labor protective provisions should be applied in merger and route transfer cases subsequently coming before the Board, subject, of course, to whatever special provisions might be shown to the required by the individual circumstances of a particular case. In such a proceeding the Board and parties would not be subjected to the time pressures are the typical merger case; the issues involved in a dating and changing the standard United-Capital provisions would take center stage; and the argument of carrier reliance on the existing standard provisions would not impose such a barrier to reasonable changes given agreement to hold such a rulemaking proceeding, we could concur or more readily in the Board's refusal to make additional changes in the United-Capital labor protective provisions applicable to be case at
 
Finally, the carrier parties invariably argue that they relied on the Board’s adherence to be standard United-Capital provisions in their merger negotiations and suggest that they would have to reconsider their agreement if any significant additional labor protective burdens were placed on the merged or surviving carrier.2 Since in most cases one of the carriers is in perilous financial condition, the Board has to take into account the possibility, whose gravity is difficult to assess, that any substantive change in a labor provisions might lead to cancellation of the merger and thence to one carrier’s bankruptcy and cessation of service. All these factors, we believe, combine to raise a serious obstacle to consideration of the objective merits and demerits of proposed changes in the standard United-Capital provisions.

The best solution in our view would be for the Board to initiate a new proceeding, in the nature of rulemaking (although an evidentiary hearing before an examiner would probably be essential), to consider for the future what labor protective provisions should be applied in merger and route transfer cases subsequently coming before the Board, subject, of course, to whatever special provisions might be shown to the required by the individual circumstances of a particular case. In such a proceeding the Board and parties would not be subjected to the time pressures are the typical merger case; the issues involved in a dating and changing the standard United-Capital provisions would take center stage; and the argument of carrier reliance on the existing standard provisions would not impose such a barrier to reasonable changes given agreement to hold such a rulemaking proceeding, we could concur or more readily in the Board's refusal to make additional changes in the United-Capital labor protective provisions applicable to be case at
 
[blockquote]
----------------
On 10/13/2002 11:25:59 PM QQ3270 wrote:

.........Ill be damn if some bankrupt scrap comes in and takes my seniority away from me...............i will tell you this you will not win your law suit and if you do boy i wouldnt want to come to work if i was you.
----------------

Attention QQ3270,

Your insult and implied threat is duly noted.
 
[P]
[BLOCKQUOTE][BR]----------------[BR]On 10/14/2002 1:32:51 PM F/A TWAA wrote:
[P]
[BLOCKQUOTE][BR]----------------[BR]On 10/13/2002 11:25:59 PM QQ3270 wrote: [BR][BR].........Ill be damn if some bankrupt scrap comes in and takes my seniority away from me...............i will tell you this you will not win your law suit and if you do [STRONG]boy i wouldnt want to come to work if i was you.[BR][/STRONG]----------------[BR][BR]Attention QQ3270,[BR][BR]Your insult and implied threat is duly noted.
[P][/P]----------------[/BLOCKQUOTE]
[P]Not to speak of a violation of American Airlines rule of conduct number 32:[/P]
[BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr style=MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px]
[P dir=ltr]Behavior that violates the company's Work Environment Policy, even if intended as a joke, is absolutely prohibited and will be grounds for severe corrective action, up to and including termination of employment. This includes, but is not limited to, [STRONG]threatening, intimidating,[/STRONG] interfering with, or [STRONG]abusive, demeaning, or violent behavior [/STRONG]toward, another employee, contractor, or vendor, while [STRONG]either on or off duty[/STRONG]. Behavior that is also [STRONG]hate-related [/STRONG]will result in immediate termination of employment, regardless of length of service and prior employment record. [/P][/BLOCKQUOTE][/BLOCKQUOTE]
 
Well if you worked at AA then you could run to your little supervisor and tell them that the posters on USAvition aren't being nice to you.
 
[blockquote]
----------------
On 10/14/2002 4:24:19 PM F/A TWAA wrote:


He may not work at AA, but I do. If you're gonna act like a bully, then be prepared for the consequences.
----------------
[/blockquote]

Could you please explain to me how he was bullied? And how a statement like I wouldn't want 22,000 of my co-workers angry with me is threatening? I personally don't like having anyone angry with me.....I hope that doen't sound threatening to you.

I wonder if I should run to my supv and cry that the TWA'ers are threatening to take my seniority? That seems of more of a threat since you actually have a law suit against us to do just that.
 
[blockquote]
----------------
On 10/14/2002 2:51:51 PM MiAAmi wrote:

Well if you worked at AA then you could run to your little supervisor and tell them that the posters on USAvition aren't being nice to you.
----------------
[/blockquote]

He may not work at AA, but I do. If you're gonna act like a bully, then be prepared for the consequences.
 
You couldn't possibly know what it feels like (nor could I, but can imagine) to have the rug pulled out from underneath you.

Isnt that what happened to the former EAL and Pan Am workers? Now some twelve years later the TWA workers are looking to pull it out from under them again! No matter how you look at it the TWA workers got a better deal than those folks. You got a raise, kept your vacation and your retirement. Didnt the TWA workers drop their Successorship clause to facilitate the merger? Lets see they agreed to go to the AA pay scale, drop their medical but without negotiating with the APFA ahead of time decided to keep their seniority. Would the TWA workers be better off if AA had decided to sell off TWA-LLC after Sept 11? Where would they be now?
 
Oh please twaa you know what i mean dont turn this into a threat or some stupid deal like i meant to personaly harm you I mean wow what a carrer you are going to have if this thing turn your way in court i wouldnt want to come to work and deal with the wrath of 23,000 f/as mad as hell at me
Get a real job go apply for us air or someother company because this company hires winners not whiners
 
[blockquote]
----------------
On 10/14/2002 4:22:32 PM QQ3270 wrote:

Oh please twaa you know what i mean dont turn this into a threat or some stupid deal like i meant to personaly harm you I mean wow what a carrer you are going to have if this thing turn your way in court i wouldnt want to come to work and deal with the wrath of 23,000 f/as mad as hell at me
Get a real job go apply for us air or someother company because this company hires winners not whiners
----------------
[/blockquote]

And he digs the hole deeper..........
 
. . . . Perhaps the challenge was too great . . . clues abound .... knowledge in unending
. Go to any strip mall lawyer and ask if this isn't the proper interpretation. . .
. . . . . this asset acquisition was indeed a merger in the eyes of the regulators (Appendix B, Section 2 (a))
.
Another to ponder - What would Carty need the APFA for if BK was on the horizon. After all he is the one who provided his testimony under oath.
.
John Ward . . . . hide your money . . start your engine and leave FAST. . . unless there are strange bedfellows to consider on high ¿?
.
As always, gavel in hand . . .or maybe two . .
ART
 
The same strip mall lawyer will be able to say that by signing away contract provisions, then suing, to be treated as if they were never freely given up is ridiculous. That a employee starting at a new company expecting to be put above what is offered to its own company transfer employees, is ridiculous. That being made 100% in all senioritys except the contractualy provisioned ones. Is absurd. For a IAM to sue APFA for not negotiating to represent the TW employees intrests is a joke. That knowing the IAM knew how the seniority questions were handled with the Reno employees. Even your so called strip mall layer will have to see you guys are filing frivolous baseless lawsuits to try to gain something at AA and AA employees expense.

Its to bad that 100% company 100% pay seniority is not enough. Its not enough to be doing the same job for the same pay. The TW people want to be senior and make sure they are treated better than the people who made the AA choice. WHo made AA their career. Its seems some TW people could find the black cloud in any situation.
 
Mickey - The law does protect those that are subject to coercion. A gun to the head and a pen in your hand is not a deal in any court. The real truths were uttered by Carty, with his had raised. Your single finger raised is not a match. Call his offices as well. While your at it call John Ward and help him hide the APFA assets, that way you can take co-conspiacy laws to a higher level.
-
Go back to the strip mall lawyer or in your neighborhood, a mail order paralegal, and ask them.. Same answer GUN or Threats for not doing something legal is coercion. That's what was required.
-
Too bad, so sad.
 
There was NO gun to anyones head. You simply could have chosen to not sign away your contract provisions.

There was no coercion. Not a single word of protest from the IAM. So where is the so called gun?

Don Carty said and offered everyone at TW a fair deal in seniority. AA worked it out with our flight attendants, rampers, mechanics, pilots the gate, ticket and res agents.
 
[blockquote]
----------------
On 10/15/2002 6:39:14 PM FA Mikey wrote:

There was NO gun to anyones head. You simply could have chosen to not sign away your contract provisions.
[/blockquote]

Not so. It was made clear that if we didn't sign away the scope clause the entire contract would be thrown out by the judge. Signing away the scope clauses (which was NOT, I repeat, signing away the right to discuss fair integration) allowed us to have the protection of most of our contract for the interim period until AA's unions took over.

MK
 
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