Debate III.

[Ms Tree]

And that's still a true statement, no? Regardless, the current day Navy is still about 90% smaller than what the Navy thinks it should be. They want to be at 313 ships. We currently have ~288, and are retiring more hulls than we're building.

The Navy could be building more if they weren't having the appropriations process hijacked for pork barrel projects, and that's a problem with Congress more than anything else. I think we've already discussed the DDG-1000 and DD21 programs... Lots of money spent on what amounted to R&D gone bad. Likewise with all the money spent looking at biofuel alternatives...

All that money could have been much better spent building a few more conventional hulls.

One thing that's been proven in Iraq and Afghanistan -- you can only go so far with superior airpower and technology. Sometimes you gotta have brute force available, and we're nowhere near the point of being able to defend ourselves against the Chinese if they start flexing their military muscle, nor could we defend our allies in the Pacific.

I would like a force capable of repelling any invading force but not big enough to allow us to go traipsing around the world invading countries. I think the military we have is a bit too big for defense.

 

[Deepthroat]

Forest service puts out fires and culls and clears to prevent more serious devastating fires.

So does DOD.

 

[Ms Tree]

How many fires have they put out and how many have they started?

 

[Deepthroat]

Equate that.

 

[Ms Tree]

You brought the fire service into this and said they put out fires. Onus is on you.

 

[Deepthroat]

You brought the fire service into this and said they put out fires. Onus is on you.

Symbolism Woody

 

[Ms Tree]

No chit Cpt obvious. So back to the original question. What 'symbolic fires' has the DoD put out?

 

[Deepthroat]

No chit Cpt obvious. So back to the original question. What 'symbolic fires' has the DoD put out?

A little venture into US history will inflate your ego, Honey

 

[Deepthroat]

Tree hugger get Wood to go?

 

[Ms Tree]

Never mind. Obviously not a point worth making.

 

[Knotbuyinit]

http://landing.newsi...te&VID=23863180

"We pull together, we leave nobody behind, we make sure that we respond as a nation and remind ourselves that whenever an American is in need all of us stand together to make sure we provide the help that is neccessary."

Unless you're an American being attacked by AQ in Libya, then you're on your own!

 

[777 fixer]

And that's still a true statement, no? Regardless, the current day Navy is still about 90% smaller than what the Navy thinks it should be. They want to be at 313 ships. We currently have ~288, and are retiring more hulls than we're building.

The Navy could be building more if they weren't having the appropriations process hijacked for pork barrel projects, and that's a problem with Congress more than anything else. I think we've already discussed the DDG-1000 and DD21 programs... Lots of money spent on what amounted to R&D gone bad. Likewise with all the money spent looking at biofuel alternatives...

All that money could have been much better spent building a few more conventional hulls.

Don't you mean 10% smaller, 281 is about 90% of 313.

Does anyone in Congress show any incling, from either party, to stop the pork barrel spending. Or for that matter ending things like farm subsides, tax/breaks/subsides for oil companies, bankrolling ethanol etc, etc. And lets not forget the billions spent by the US Army on camo uniforms that did not hide soldiers very well and their eventual replacement. Then there are the tanks the Army does not need yet Congress spent money on anyway. The list of cost overruns and uneeded equipment is long. It should clue people in that it's not how much we spend but how it's spent. Yet there are lot of people who parrot that smae old line.

 

[southwind]

Don't you mean 10% smaller, 281 is about 90% of 313.

Does anyone in Congress show any incling, from either party, to stop the pork barrel spending. Or for that matter ending things like farm subsides, tax/breaks/subsides for oil companies, bankrolling ethanol etc, etc. And lets not forget the billions spent by the US Army on camo uniforms that did not hide soldiers very well and their eventual replacement. Then there are the tanks the Army does not need yet Congress spent money on anyway. The list of cost overruns and uneeded equipment is long. It should clue people in that it's not how much we spend but how it's spent. Yet there are lot of people who parrot that smae old line.

You forgot to add the millions lost, that was given to , now defunct, Green Energy company's..........................just want to make sure we include everyone !

 

[southwind]

No chit Cpt obvious. So back to the original question. What 'symbolic fires' has the DoD put out?

Many, that you'll probably never hear about !

 

[777 fixer]

One thing that's been proven in Iraq and Afghanistan -- you can only go so far with superior airpower and technology. Sometimes you gotta have brute force available, and we're nowhere near the point of being able to defend ourselves against the Chinese if they start flexing their military muscle, nor could we defend our allies in the Pacific.

We can't protect ourselves form teh Chinese? Says who? Can the Chinese park a couple CBG off the coast and strike costal targets? Can they send a bomber undetected and bomb our cities at will? No they cannot but we sure as hell can do it to them. Another thing, if there ever was a shotting war between the USA and China we would have a lot bigger things to worry about.